Has it been confirmed that AMD's Paris chip will use socket 754, or is this a rumor?

[coolred]

I had heard that socket 754 will soon become AMD's value socket hosting its codenamed Paris chip(a K7 chip ported to the K8 architecture minus 64bit support)but I am not sure if this was conifrmed or a rumor. From what I understand when AMD switches to DDR2, it will obviously require a new memory controller and according to AMD a new socket, so will they then start using socket 939 or 900 or whatever for the value chips? This will help me in my decision for my next system if anybody knows for sure.

 

[Alkaline5]

Yes, it's a pretty sure thing that Socket 754 will soon become AMD's value platform for Paris CPUs.

DDR2 is still probably over a year away for the A64. It's probable that Socket 939 will become the value platform at some point, but there's no word on that yet.

 

[coolred]

Well I ask because I ambuilding an HTPC/PVR rig, I have another threa don it, so i won't get into it too much. I wa shoping that if I build with socket 754 right now(I know its overkill for now) that it will be able to handle the tasks I ask it to without need for an upgrade for at the very least 2 years, but would prefer to get 3 out of it. But if in 2-3 years the socket 754 is no longer having CPU's produced for it, then there is no point in spending the extra on it now.


Heck at this rate I am abotu ready to buy an Opteron 142, cause at least I know socket 940 shoudlbe aroudn for some time to come.

 

[Alkaline5]

I wouldn't count on seeing Socket 754 or 939 CPUs still being produced for current motherboards in 3 years time. You're right in that Socket 940 is your best bet for future upgradability, but there's a lot of other baggage that comes with server platforms.

I've been looking into building an HTPC lately, as well, and have decided on pairing an Applebred/Duron or a P4 B with a hardware PVR card. The mobile Barton's represent a good, cheap alternative too if your mobo supports multiplier adjustment.

 

[coolred]

What baggage would that be, the need for special RAM????

 

[Alkaline5]

RAM is certainly an issue, but your mobo options are going to be limited (and probably expensive) even if you plan to use a full-size tower. I've been looking at SFF systems, and there just don't seem to be any that support Socket 940.

 

[coolred]

I will be using the ANtec Overture, it is full ATX, but it is a desktop style case, not a tower. I actualy kind alike the Asus nForce 3 150 socket 940 board, as it has pretty much the same layout as the MSI K8N Neo Platinum I am considering if I go socket 754. Actually its a bit better as the power connector isn't located directly to the side of the IDE connectors as on the MSI.

Going socket 940 would cost me an extra 50 or so for the motherboard, the processors are about the same prices as the socket 754 stuff. Well depending on how you look at it. Looking at the lower speeds, the Opteron 1.8 with 1MB cache costs the same as the A64 2.0 with 512KB cache and the 1.6 1MB cache Opteron costs the same as the A64 1.8 512KB cache. And since everyone says these chips are more then is needed in an HTPC, I ocudl probablly get away with the 1.4GHz which would equal the 2600+ A64 I was considering if it came out soon. That I thinks ells for 158 or soemthing like that on newegg. SO going socket 940 would cost apporximately 120-150 more then AXP and cost only like 60-70 more then A64. Even if my numbers are low and the differance between AXP ios more like 200, that still doesn't quite cover the cost of a mid-high range motherboard and CPU, so if socket 940 is stilla round at my next upgrade time, thenit may be a good idea, but socket 754 is not looking quite as appealing.

 

[coolred]

woah, wait a minute, I made another big mistake in my thinking. I was think the opteron system would cost about 150 more then the AXP system. My thinking being spendingt he extra 150 now meant not having to buy a new board and chip later, thats not true, while I can possibly get by without a new board and upgrade obviously would require a new CPU at say 150.00 or so.


But heres the full math, pay an extra 150.00 now, when its time to upgrade buy a new CPU at say 150.00. For a total cost over AXP of 300.00. Where as if I go AXP now saving myself 150.00 then in the same amoutn of time upgrade, oviously I will definately need a new board and proc. but at 150.00 a piece thats 300.00, the same cost as the opteron. Obviously those numbers are approximations, but th emore I think about it, AXP is sounding better and better.

 

[AnnoyedGrunt]

Remember that you may not need a 2007 chip when you want to upgrade (you may be able to buy a 2004/5 chip @ a much lower price). Also, if you don't change your software, you may not need a huge jump in performance either, so whatever you get now may last a quite some time.

If you get an A64 2800+ now, you will be at least guarateed an upgrade path to a 3700+, and even more if you decide to try overclocking at that point.

Given that A64's don't benefit a whole lot from memory bandwidth, I doubt AMD will jump on the DDR2 bandwagon anytime soon.

As far as the Paris thing goes, I've only heard the info from reviews of the 939 chips, and from posts of AMD's roadmap:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpu/showdoc.html?i=2056

-D'oh!

 

[coolred]

Well heck I don't know what to do, I got parts picked out for pretty much any way I could go, but I can't decide what way to go. One thing that concerns me is the MSI K8N Neo Platinum. Everybody is saying not to get an MSI since they just had that lawsuit filed against them for mainboard failures. But if I am correct that was due to bad capacitors, so i think they would have fixed that.


How long will AMD keep using socket 940? I know it stands to go on pretty long since its a server platform, but not sure how long exactly.

 

[Alkaline5]

The P4-based Xeon platform hasn't changed drastically since it's release over two years ago. The AthlonMP platform was phased out after nearly two years w/o changing at all. Socket 940 does represent your best hope for longevity, but 3 years is pushing it for any platform.

The general consensus in your other thread was that you should get a mobile Barton, is there some reason you don't want to do that? You could run it at 35w for now and OC it as you need later on.

 

[DancingBear]

I don't think that you can really go wrong with either an Athlon XP or a socket 754 at this point. You can spend significanly less right now and then upgrade both yoru MB and processor in the future, or spend a lot more now and have an upgrade path available (it will definitely be available for the next 2 years).

Personally, I would spend $150 total on a MB and AthlonXP 2500+ and save the rest of the expense for some other time.

 

[Falloutboy]

just a thought since the memory controller is on die on the a64 would that not mean if you go to ddr2 that you would have to change sockets because ddr2 has more pins.

 

[coolred]

Falloutboy, from what I understand, AMD has said they will go with new sockets/pin counts for each new memory controller(DDR2, DDR3). I am not sure if this is actually needed or if they are just doing it hoping to get more money. If the rumors are right, then the DDR2 socket will be 900 pins, so it doesn't really need more pins, unless this socket will only work with some of the chips, like socket 754/939 now, but i don't think AMD would do that again.

DAncing bear, what are you saying will be around in 2 years, socket 754 or socket 940?

Alkaline5, I am not dead set against the mobile barton, I just want to make sure I am covering all my bases. I would prefer not to have to overclock inthe future since I want this machien rock solid stable. Plus I have been told even the mobile barton is more then I need, and that I should run that in my main rig and put my 2100+ ECS K7S5A in the HTPC. The CPU I have no problem with, but the motherboard would not be my first choice for an HTPC motherboard. I mean it is a cheap peice of junk, that has served me well for quite a while now, but it lacks any sort of SPDIF output, so that means I would either need a new board or soundcard, if I go that route.

Plus, don't ask me why I am hung up on this, but I really like the zalman 7000 flower coolers, but with pretty much all the nForce2 boards, the socket placement won't allow this HS to be mounted in the overture. This is just somethign I need to get past, as I amsure there are at least a few more HSF out there that are as quiet and maybe even quieter then the zalman. I liked the MSI K8N Neo sinc eit had a centralized socket and would work with the zalman, I think, plus it had a nice layout for running my cables. The nForce3 150 Asus socket 940 board is almost the same layout, actually a little better.

I guess I am starting to think more about my main rig as well, since it is a bit dated with no options for overclocking. It serves me well for the most part, but on occasion I do run into 100% CPU utilization, while just doing stuff like browsing the net and listening to MP3's, admitadely, I often have many IE browsers open at once though.

 

[coolred]

I tell you what though, that FIC Condor system looks awesome, and if I wasn't worried about upgrade space and the cost, I would go with that in a second.


Oh yeah I almost forgot another reason I was considering socket 754(not sure if 940 has it)is cool and quiet, that is a great tech, not sure why isn't hasn't been brought to the desktop market a while ago.

 

[coolred]

What motherboard support voltages of 1.35 and possibly below?

 

[coolred]

Dang the ASUS "A7N8X-E Deluxe" doesn't support a lwo enough voltage for a 35watt mobile, heck according to the list on SPCR, only like 3 of the MCP-T boards liste don newegg support a low enough voltage for this chip.