Harley Davidson took its tax cut, closed a factory, and rewarded shareholders

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pauldun170

Diamond Member
Sep 26, 2011
9,142
5,089
136
I think its established that the talking points generated by the GOP to sell the tax plan to voters was filled with horseshit.
Lets toss aside the sales pitch for a second and look at Harley.

They have been facing declining sales for 4 years now. There stock hasn't been exactly top of the charts.
They made plans to close factories and consolidate because there isn't enough volume to justify otherwise.

Stock buyback helps them position themselves as they work through development of electric motorcycles and covering their overseas expansion.
Sales are declining stateside but there are some opportunities overseas.

Using the perks of tax cuts to prop up a shitty structure + poor sales makes no sense long term.


The company will cut 800 jobs at the Kansas City plant when it closes by the fall of 2019 and says it expects to add 450 full-time, casual, and contractor positions in its York facility — a net loss of 350 jobs.

The median household income in York is much lower than in Kansas City, and Tate said that hiring a casual workforce there — temporary workers brought in to boost production during peak season — will be easier and cheaper for Harley.

“This is a decision we did not take lightly,” Harley said in a statement. “The Kansas City plant has been assembling Harley-Davidson motorcycles since 1997, and our employees will leave a great legacy of quality, price, and manufacturing leadership. We are grateful to them and the Kansas City community for their many years of support and their service to our dealers and our riders.”
 

Indus

Lifer
May 11, 2002
11,879
8,299
136
LMAO I got banned from another forum discussing this and they deleted my posts.

Echo Chamber indeed!
 

IJTSSG

Golden Member
Aug 12, 2014
1,122
278
136
Sounds like Harley is doing what they need to in order to keep the company going and explore new markets. Good for them.
 

Indus

Lifer
May 11, 2002
11,879
8,299
136
Sounds like Harley is doing what they need to in order to keep the company going and explore new markets. Good for them.

Will there be a tariff on Harleys made in Thailand? Because that's where the jobs and manufacturing are going!
 

pauldun170

Diamond Member
Sep 26, 2011
9,142
5,089
136
Will there be a tariff on Harleys made in Thailand? Because that's where the jobs and manufacturing are going!

The plant would let Milwaukee-based Harley-Davidson avoid Thailand's up to 60 percent tariff on imported motorcycles and help it get tax breaks when exporting to Thailand's neighbors, thanks to a trade arrangement among members of the Association of Southeast Asian Nation (ASEAN).
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/05/25/har...-factory-to-serve-southeast-asian-market.html

“Our biggest country market [in APAC] is Japan, that’s a very mature market for us,” says Marc McAllister, managing director at Harley-Davidson Motor Company Asia Pacific. “China, India and Southeast Asia are on a par and growing at similar rates.”

One of the brand’s biggest challenges over the last decade has been to shake off the US-centric Harley image associated with wealthy, middle-aged, white men.

To make the brand more relevant to Asians, Harley has adapted its motorcycles to suit to the region’s infrastructure. This year, the company launched the Street 500 and 750, the brand’s first motorcycles to sell for less than US$8,000, designed to appeal to the young, middle-class, urban rider.

The bikes are slimmer than traditional Harley models to make riding in dense, urban areas more pleasurable. The seats are lower too, an insight based on consumer research conducted among thousands of the region’s existing bikers.
https://www.singaporebusiness.com/2...d-itself-for-asia.html?subFormJan2018=visible
 

UberNeuman

Lifer
Nov 4, 1999
16,937
3,087
126
On the upside, Harley-Davidson plans to toss in a free lady-boy with any purchase of a Hog.
 

sportage

Lifer
Feb 1, 2008
11,492
3,161
136
How many x Harley workers does it take to flip a burger?
And they still support Trump.... Go figure.
Guess unemployment is worth it if that also includes going after them marrying gays and women abortion lovers.
As they say in France, live and learn.
 

Puffnstuff

Lifer
Mar 9, 2005
16,147
4,847
136
How many x Harley workers does it take to flip a burger?
And they still support Trump.... Go figure.
Guess unemployment is worth it if that also includes going after them marrying gays and women abortion lovers.
As they say in France, live and learn.
I saw a new Republican attack ad the other day here in FL and one of the guy's talking points was that he wanted people to oppose student loans and education as a liberal elite ploy to lure them into indebtedness. Folks this is why they have a support base of uneducated people who will believe almost anything they are told by them.
 
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ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
38,202
18,671
146
Working for Harley Davidson, you must have access to the premium bootstraps at employee prices, I can only assume each employee has a pair.
 
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Bitek

Lifer
Aug 2, 2001
10,676
5,238
136
Trump has managed to really screw over the tax payers, us workers and HOG at the same time.

The trade war has increased the price of a bike by $2200 due steel tariffs. The company is bleeding money and sales are slumping.

The plan will shift production of EU bound bikes (~18% of sales) to Asia where they can avoid a 31% EU levy, imposed as retaliation for the steel tariffs.

The capital to invest in Asia factories hah been freed up thanks to the windfall tax cuts we are funding.

I would not expect those jobs to ever come back.


"Harley Davidson it will shift production of EU-bound motorcycles away from its US-based manufacturing sites as a result of Brussels’ decision to retaliate in kind against Washington’s tariffs on imported steel and aluminium.

The famed maker of motorcycles said the financial impact of the EU tariffs would be up to $100m per year. This makes the Milwaukee-based manufacturer one of the first US companies to detail the financial impact of the escalating trade tensions between Washington and its allies, and follows hard on the heels of Daimler, which last week issued a warning that its profits would be hit by new Chinese tariffs on US imports.

Instead, it will “be implementing a plan to shift production of motorcycles for EU destinations from the US to its international facilities to avoid the tariff burden.”

Tariffs imposed by the EU on various US-manufactured products became effective on June 22 and have pushed up the levy on Harley-Davidson motorcycles exported from the US to the EU to 31 per cent from 6 per cent. While this was itself a response to Washington’s decision to impose levies on steel and aluminium imports from the EU, Canada and Mexico, US President

The tariffs are expected to add $2,200 per average motorcycle to affected vehicles, the company said in a filing on Monday."
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
48,094
37,301
136
What Trump is doing makes US goods uncompetitive either through increased raw material cost or retaliatory tariffs (or even both). Anybody who relies on much of an export business is at real risk.
 
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pauldun170

Diamond Member
Sep 26, 2011
9,142
5,089
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Trump has managed to really screw over the tax payers, us workers and HOG at the same time.

The trade war has increased the price of a bike by $2200 due steel tariffs. The company is bleeding money and sales are slumping.

The plan will shift production of EU bound bikes (~18% of sales) to Asia where they can avoid a 31% EU levy, imposed as retaliation for the steel tariffs.

The capital to invest in Asia factories hah been freed up thanks to the windfall tax cuts we are funding.

I would not expect those jobs to ever come back.


"Harley Davidson it will shift production of EU-bound motorcycles away from its US-based manufacturing sites as a result of Brussels’ decision to retaliate in kind against Washington’s tariffs on imported steel and aluminium.

The famed maker of motorcycles said the financial impact of the EU tariffs would be up to $100m per year. This makes the Milwaukee-based manufacturer one of the first US companies to detail the financial impact of the escalating trade tensions between Washington and its allies, and follows hard on the heels of Daimler, which last week issued a warning that its profits would be hit by new Chinese tariffs on US imports.

Instead, it will “be implementing a plan to shift production of motorcycles for EU destinations from the US to its international facilities to avoid the tariff burden.”

Tariffs imposed by the EU on various US-manufactured products became effective on June 22 and have pushed up the levy on Harley-Davidson motorcycles exported from the US to the EU to 31 per cent from 6 per cent. While this was itself a response to Washington’s decision to impose levies on steel and aluminium imports from the EU, Canada and Mexico, US President

The tariffs are expected to add $2,200 per average motorcycle to affected vehicles, the company said in a filing on Monday."

That's ok. with tax cuts you can spend the savings on the additional cost of the motorcycle.
Or something like that.
 

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
27,654
26,755
136
Trump has managed to really screw over the tax payers, us workers and HOG at the same time.

The trade war has increased the price of a bike by $2200 due steel tariffs. The company is bleeding money and sales are slumping.

The plan will shift production of EU bound bikes (~18% of sales) to Asia where they can avoid a 31% EU levy, imposed as retaliation for the steel tariffs.

The capital to invest in Asia factories hah been freed up thanks to the windfall tax cuts we are funding.

I would not expect those jobs to ever come back.


"Harley Davidson it will shift production of EU-bound motorcycles away from its US-based manufacturing sites as a result of Brussels’ decision to retaliate in kind against Washington’s tariffs on imported steel and aluminium.

The famed maker of motorcycles said the financial impact of the EU tariffs would be up to $100m per year. This makes the Milwaukee-based manufacturer one of the first US companies to detail the financial impact of the escalating trade tensions between Washington and its allies, and follows hard on the heels of Daimler, which last week issued a warning that its profits would be hit by new Chinese tariffs on US imports.

Instead, it will “be implementing a plan to shift production of motorcycles for EU destinations from the US to its international facilities to avoid the tariff burden.”

Tariffs imposed by the EU on various US-manufactured products became effective on June 22 and have pushed up the levy on Harley-Davidson motorcycles exported from the US to the EU to 31 per cent from 6 per cent. While this was itself a response to Washington’s decision to impose levies on steel and aluminium imports from the EU, Canada and Mexico, US President

The tariffs are expected to add $2,200 per average motorcycle to affected vehicles, the company said in a filing on Monday."

No one could have seen this result coming. Trade wars are hard and stuff but we can win bigly because reasons. These things usually end well when you piss off everyone through unilateral action against everybody.

Global companies have the ability to shift work around to minimize the impact of tariffs. If the US is the one pissing everyone off and engaged unilaterally in a trade war with the world. They can move the work off shore and maintain their profits why we at home get a fucked economy.

So much winning, are the Trumpets tired of the winning yet?
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
48,094
37,301
136
Who would had guessed trade wars are bad? It isn't like we have ample examples and empirical data to show why it doesnt work.

No it will work. Best Negotiator President Deals is going to work his magic. Just wait and see.

It's not like he's ever fucked up leaving financial ruin in his wake that other people have to pay for.
 

Commodus

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2004
9,215
6,818
136
This is, in a sense, the real problem with the Trump administration -- it's making all kinds of disastrous changes like this, but they'll take a while to really manifest themselves. And the Trump cheerleaders won't realize how badly they've screwed themselves until it's too late, at which point they'll still probably try to pin some of it on Democrats.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
This is, in a sense, the real problem with the Trump administration -- it's making all kinds of disastrous changes like this, but they'll take a while to really manifest themselves. And the Trump cheerleaders won't realize how badly they've screwed themselves until it's too late, at which point they'll still probably try to pin some of it on Democrats.

People want what they want and if it is their Holy Grail they will defend it and attack anyone who attempts to point out the reality of their desire. Dangle a carrot and they go mad over it.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,136
30,086
146
I wonder if it is wise for US businesses affected by Trump's tradewar to sort of shutter up or ramp down production, temporarily, to save lost money until the Clown is out of office and the adults return and get back to work fixing this disaster?

A company like AB managed to survive the decade + of Prohibition, which wrecked nearly 95%+(?) of the alcohol industry in the US, but that's because they were able to use their refrigerated rail car technology to transport other goods (like meats and produce) for clients.

The Trump administration is very much the same sort of crisis for US business and agriculture that prohibition was for brewers and distillers--so it might be wise to start pulling back as best as possible until the Trump crisis is over.