"Guns vs. Butter 2010" - Arianna Huffington on America's priorities

[bamacre]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huffington/guns-vs-butter-2010_b_548620.html

It's like something written several years ago when Bush and Dick were running the show. A lot of it sounds like it came from Ron Paul. It was he who used the "guns and butter" analogy during the Republican debates, and it was he who this year quoted Eisenhower at CPAC regarding the "military industrial complex." And it was he who blasted Republicans for wanting to cut health care spending for children all the while spending hundreds of billions overseas. But regardless, here we are, Bush and Dick are gone, the "tidal wave of change," Mr. Nobel Peace Prize Winner himself is in power, and sane Americans are asking, "where's the change?"

 

[dmcowen674]

here we are, Bush and Dick are gone, the "tidal wave of change," Mr. Nobel Peace Prize Winner himself is in power, and sane Americans are asking, "where's the change?"

The change is there, you're pissed off right?

You weren't pissed when your heroes Bush & Dick were in power.

The Real Mission is Accomplished.

It's really that simple.

 

[Perknose]

A lot of it sounds like it came from Ron Paul. It was he who used the "guns and butter" analogy during the Republican debates...

The "guns and butter" analogy is an extremely well known and oft used analogy dating at least from the Johnson administration during the Vietnam war, when Johnson said we could have both -- the Great Society and that war.

Ascribing that phrase to Dr. Paul without further reference is like ascribing a Lady Gaga remake of a Beyonce remake of a Beatles original to Beyonce, without mentioning the Beatles.

Just saying.

 

[Moonbeam]

Herman Goering said, “Guns will make us powerful; butter will only make us fat.”

 

[irishScott]

Flaws in that article notwithstanding, the goal in Afghanistan and Iraq is now to make sure that they don't become havens for terrorism after we leave. Problem there is that involves a significant bit of nation building, especially in Afghanistan (which was hardly a nation to start with) which I don't think even Bush or Rumsfeld considered (morons that they were...). If we just up and left the Taliban would be back in power in a year or two and we'd have to hit them again. And again. And again. Of course Afghanistan was never really a country to begin with, so nation building may also be a lost cause.

Iraq's getting there though, and as for the guns and butter argument: I'm against most forms of welfare. Too much just leads to abuse of the system on a scale that overtakes it's potential benefits. It leads to a weak population and entitlement personalities. Hell just look at the people now. So many healthy people would pretty much die if they had to go without, say... electricity for a month. A single month. Our ancestors survived their entire lives with less infrastructure without electricity. Pile on a shitload of government benefits and see what happens when they disappear.

 

[First]

lmao. Silly Paulbot, thinking is for non-kooks.

 

[bamacre]

The "guns and butter" analogy is an extremely well known and oft used analogy dating at least from the Johnson administration during the Vietnam war, when Johnson said we could have both -- the Great Society and that war.

Yeah, definitely, just haven't heard it used by many politicians.

 

[bamacre]

lmao. Silly Paulbot, thinking is for non-kooks.

Thanks, you add about as much to these forums as Dave.

 

[bamacre]

Herman Goering said, “Guns will make us powerful; butter will only make us fat.”

I think her point was not the guns, but how much we are spending on them. And butter tastes good.

 

[Perknose]

Yeah, definitely, just haven't heard it used by many politicians.

Well, the good Doctor has a point about the elephant in the room around the Federal deficit -- defense spending.

One point around this is well nigh inarguable. We'd be in much better shape, financially and security-wise, if Bush hadn't led us into the tragically unnecessary war in Iraq.

Iran has been the big beneficiary of that war, and America the big loser.

We squandered a great deal of international good will as the victims of 9/11 by invading Iraq, all because the neocons that surrounded Bush stupidly thought they could pull off an easy victory.

Vietnam taught them NOTHING, apparently, the greedy, shallow, ignorant bastards. You try to force your political system on another country and culture, incurring a lot of civilian "collateral damage" along the way, they ALL end up hating YOU, the arrogant, invading outsider!

Not to mention that, in their haste for this "easy victory", the 'cons pulled vital resources out of Afghanistan at a time when we had the Taliban on the run.

Utter disaster, all the way 'round.

 

[Double Trouble]

Well, the good Doctor has a point about the elephant in the room around the Federal deficit -- defense spending.

One point around this is well nigh inarguable. We'd be in much better shape, financially and security-wise, if Bush hadn't led us into the tragically unnecessary war in Iraq.

Iran has been the big beneficiary of that war, and America the big loser.

We squandered a great deal of international good will as the victims of 9/11 by invading Iraq, all because the neocons that surrounded Bush stupidly thought they could pull off an easy victory.

Vietnam taught them NOTHING, apparently, the greedy, shallow, ignorant bastards. You try to force your political system on another country and culture, incurring a lot of civilian "collateral damage" along the way, they ALL end up hating YOU, the arrogant, invading outsider!

Not to mention that, in their haste for this "easy victory", the 'cons pulled vital resources out of Afghanistan at a time when we had the Taliban on the run.

Utter disaster, all the way 'round.

For once, I agree with Perknose. What a waste of trillions as well as a unique opportunity after the 9/11 tragedy to unify the world and take fight radicalism worldwide. Instead, we squandered trillions, lost lives and helped further radical islam all over the world. :thumbsdown:

 

[Genx87]

Herman Goering said, “Guns will make us powerful; butter will only make us fat.”

Did the man ever look in the mirror?