Guildwars 2 Beta Thread

[Fanatical Meat]

Post interesting Guild Wars 2 info here, It will be released 8/25/12 its Free to play, there will be some kind of cash shop beta is over.

Superseded by the official GW2 launch thread
-ViRGE

 

[IonusX]

Anyone have an intelligent updates? Anyone in beta?

nope and nope. i have a friend in the closed beta but hes sworn to secrecy

 

[Arkadrel]

My only worry is the itemisation for the game.

Apperntly all the items for each race, has the same stats totals, just in differnt configourations. Where is the incentive to do endgame stuff, if the drop from a crazy tough ah heck isnt any better than the random drop off a max level normal monster?

That and them doing away with raids, there wont be pve to challenge players, it ll all be open world, world bosses, where everyone can jump in and parttake of the loot.

The reason raid system work, is because it limits the amount of players vs tough ah heck boss, makeing it challengeing (or atleast if pve is done right in the game its that way). Haveing only open world bosses, where anyone and everyone will join is gonna kinda ruin the pve aspect of the game (endgame wise).

I think guildwars2 ends up heavly pvp oriented, so I hope they get that stuff right.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

While I hope it's centered around PvP, there needs to be some PvE enjoyment for the carebears or else there will be no sheep for the wolves to slaughter.

 

[Arkadrel]

@bella

I usually enjoy pve content more in games, but I do think the pvp mini games (like capture the flag) will be fun to play.

Runes of Magic, had a Tower Defense mini pvp game, gawd that alone made RoM fun to play for me. I kinda hope GW2 has something like that (where your useing your character to plan turrets, and running around useing your character skills to kill invaders) everyone loves TowerDefense's.

I do however totally agree, a all focused PVP game wont last long.
I think there are more pve carebears than hardcore pvpers, a market that only looks to please 1 of the 2, usually isnt gonna last long (Ive seen pve only games work well though, never other way around).

 

[VashHT]

Yeah but if they did a raid system it would just be another WoW clone, I'm glad they're trying something new and the itemization model worked for GW1 so why not GW2? Plus there will still be plenty of PVE content and I'm sure there will be end game dungeons, they just won't be in a raid style.

 

[The Sauce]

That max-stat item drops sounds exactly like GW1. After a while people were farming to get points in different areas rather than any true stat increase. Got mighty weak after a while.

 

[VashHT]

That max-stat item drops sounds exactly like GW1. After a while people were farming to get points in different areas rather than any true stat increase. Got mighty weak after a while.

Well the PVE won't end up with the same farming as GW1 had just because it will be an open world rather than instanced.

I'm pretty excited to see how these world events they have planned work out, if they're on the scale that they've described so far then I think the game will be amazing and a big step forward. They sound like the world events from warhammer online but on a much larger scale (across an entire region) with consequences depending on whether or not people successfully complete the events. That's what I'm looking forward to, events that actually change the world you're playing in, I think that will make MMO's a lot more fun.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

I usually enjoy pve content more in games, but I do think the pvp mini games (like capture the flag) will be fun to play.

We already have MMO's like that, they're called everything released since Asheron's Call in 1999.

We've had two PvP orientated MMO's since then, Shadowbane & Darkfall. It's time for a new MMO based on skill and pvp.

 

[Rhezuss]

Can't wait to try this game bit the itemization scheme don't look so good.

What's the point then if you end up with the same total of stats...except to "specialise" in one stat or the other...

 

[shortylickens]

Not interested. I have the collectors edition of the first one (was dirt cheap at the time) and I played for a bit, getting two characters up to about level 11. Got tired. Eventually hit a point where I cant do anything with just the in game companions. You really cant grind for levels in that game, enemy XP drops off sharply with each level you get.
Could never organize a group of high level friends to help me beat any more quests, which is the only way to get decent XP which is the only way to level up.

Also, I dont like the fact that I'm challenged by enemies who only give me 1 XP. If they give me trouble they should be worth a hell of a lot more.

So yeah, gave up. In fact last time I redid my gaming system I didnt even bother reinstalling the game. Dont see the purpose in going to a sequel. In that time a bunch of really awesome Bethesda games have come out and I'd rather play those two or three times each.

 

[Arkadrel]

@Shortylickens

So group up to get leveling.... its a MMO, not a singleplayer game.

 

[GaiaHunter]

1) In Guild Wars the max stats weapon system is already in place - that means a person choices rather than the equipment decides the outcome.

In Guild Wars you don't overcome the problems by farming higher levels/better equipment, but by devising better builds(team builds)/strategies/tactics.

People farm for rare skin items they find better looking and/or just rarer to show their epeen.

2) The first guildwars campaign, prophecies is by far the slower one in terms of leveling. If one can't reach max level using henchmen in prophecies they are doing it wrong. Additionally henchmen suffered some updates.

3) Guild Wars Nightfall introduced heroes, which are customizable henchmen and currently you can fill your party with them, so no problem playing alone and doing all content on your own.

 

[shortylickens]

@Shortylickens

So group up to get leveling.... its a MMO, not a singleplayer game.

please re-read my post.

 

[Arkadrel]

1) In Guild Wars the max stats weapon system is already in place - that means a person choices rather than the equipment decides the outcome.

In Guild Wars you don't overcome the problems by farming higher levels/better equipment, but by devising better builds(team builds)/strategies/tactics.

There are downsides too, some games use gear as a balanceing tool.
If gear always stays constantly the same (stat total), thats out of the question.

PvE incentive is lowered alot, because all you get is a differnt skin, look for your character. In FFXI some gear was so good it could last you for 30 levels or something, it was insanely rare drop, but with a skin people reconised. Haveing such a item screamed badass = incentive to go collect it. It doesnt sound like GW2 will have that.

Other games with gears, can still have tactics/strategies needed to be used to beat a monster, even with the best gears possible in the game. Itemisation doesnt kill that aspect of the game.


I personally think its a downside, that there are no raids and all gear is the same but for the looks (if all gear is same level).

 

[zokudu]

There are I believe 8 planned end game dungeons. All endgame dungeons have a story mode and 3 separate explorable modes. By separate think of UK,UP or HoS and HoL in WotLK in WoW. Same area and atmosphere but different dungeon. The story mode is built to be relatively easy to tell a story essentially. The explorable much more challenges are expanding on the dungeon and giving it much more challenge. Think of them as 5 man raids instead of faceroll easy dungeons. Also with 3 explorable modes and 8 dungeons thats 24 endgame "raids" intended for launch.

About the gear complaints, why do you need a carrot on a stick? If you want to get dope gear so you can stand around town and brag about it then go do explorable mode dungeons that are built to be difficult and theoretically few people will be able to beat. If you don't care about having the best gear in other MMOs and complain about gearscore and crap like that then why complain about removing the items that you claim are preventing you from entering endgame raids? What fathomable reason is there to wish there was a gear progression?

As far as balancing why complain? Suddenly you don't have to worry that hunters are stupid underpowered because all caster classes got a legendary or that rogues are facerolling dps meters because everyone is on an even playing field. The game is built and balanced around this even playing field.

 

[VashHT]

In the end this game is not for people who raid in current MMO's, it's for people who hate the raiding system and everything it promotes. I had fun with raids in WoW maybe the first few times I ran them but they get tediously boring when you're runnign them over and over to earn badges or you are looking for a specific drop. I'm glad you won't be doing that in GW2, I'll play the end game dungeons to see the story behind each one and just to beat it for the challenge, imo that's more fun than playing through an instance for an hour only to have the boss drop the same item you've seen 5 times in a row that you don't need.

 

[imaheadcase]

No PvP..no thanks. Just another cookie-cutter pvp setup like other MMO do. "hey everyone we have awesome pvp!"
FAQ: What kind of pvp will be in game? Organized pvp!

So basically lets copy arena play because its cheap and easy to put in game.

Sorry for the rant, Im kind of tired of games hyping pvp and not even design the freakin thing around it.

Give me planetside 2 already!

 

[drebo]

No PvP..no thanks. Just another cookie-cutter pvp setup like other MMO do. "hey everyone we have awesome pvp!"
FAQ: What kind of pvp will be in game? Organized pvp!

So basically lets copy arena play because its cheap and easy to put in game.

Sorry for the rant, Im kind of tired of games hyping pvp and not even design the freakin thing around it.

Give me planetside 2 already!

The problem with anarchic PvP in a game that's level and item based is that there's no possible way to compete.

It worked in a game like UO because UO didn't have the dynamic of "i'm level 10 so I'm stronger than your level 9 by default". While we have levels, the only kind of PvP that works in games is organized.

That said, organized PvP can be very fun. DAoC for an example. Structured, realm-based PvP. My team vs your team. Warhammer Online had a chance to be huge with the next evolution of it, but they made the mistake of including battlegrounds. Because of that, no one did anything BUT battlegrounds and the game sucked because battlegrounds are tedious and boring and unbalanced, and have been since WoW introduced them almost a decade ago.

 

[zokudu]

The problem with anarchic PvP in a game that's level and item based is that there's no possible way to compete.

It worked in a game like UO because UO didn't have the dynamic of "i'm level 10 so I'm stronger than your level 9 by default". While we have levels, the only kind of PvP that works in games is organized.

That said, organized PvP can be very fun. DAoC for an example. Structured, realm-based PvP. My team vs your team. Warhammer Online had a chance to be huge with the next evolution of it, but they made the mistake of including battlegrounds. Because of that, no one did anything BUT battlegrounds and the game sucked because battlegrounds are tedious and boring and unbalanced, and have been since WoW introduced them almost a decade ago.

GW2 has a feature called WvWvW where your world (server) competes against 2 other servers. There's not a ton of details on it at the moment but the idea is that you compete to keep certain things unlocked on your server but not on the others. Its very similar to DaoCs system and Warhammers System. In fact I believe there are a couple quotes stating Arenanet was inspired by Daoc. I also remember reading something like a designer from daoc works on the arenanet team but I can't find the article or confirmation for it.

 

[imaheadcase]

DAOC is still leap years ahead of MMO for pvp.

No matter who worked on GW2, its not set up from ground up like daoc was for pvp with PvE as a 2nd thought. That is the problem with MMO today. Its just a massive co-op game.

To me today's MMO are just like skyrim with friends to play with.

By nature MMO are not balanced, that is why they are constantly updated, to say a game can't be made with good pvp, just means they are not trying. Every MMO has/had a flavor of the month character/build before it got nerfed I as a berserker in DAOC i know

 

[Tom]

please re-read my post.

experience points only drop off if you don't progress through the game. most games are like that.

anyway, leveling isn't as important as acquiring skills in GW.

theres no reason to grind to play through the campaign.

 

[Arkadrel]

As far as balancing why complain? Suddenly you don't have to worry that hunters are stupid underpowered because all caster classes got a legendary or that rogues are facerolling dps meters because everyone is on an even playing field. The game is built and balanced around this even playing field.

that swings the other way around too, if all the casters classes are too powerfull, then give the hunters a magic res armor.

Cant do balanceing for classes that way, with no itemisation in the game.
Which basically means they ll have to do it via constant skill tweaking.

also, if it turns out that class Y > class X,
then nothing you do item wise will help you, because ever other class X is geared just like you are.

Diablo II had lots of itemisation, and "dueling" was still fun in that.
I dont think items make pvp bad, it just encurages people to do pve content = playing the game = good thing.

Otherwise, guildwars2..... LFG 2 go do PVE content...... *2hours lateron* no one wants to go party,
because item drops are same stats as what they already have on.

Which means it ll just be people pvping non-stop for some kill-death ratio list, trying to stay on top.

 

[zokudu]

that swings the other way around too, if all the casters classes are too powerfull, then give the hunters a magic res armor.

Cant do balanceing for classes that way, with no itemisation in the game.
Which basically means they ll have to do it via constant skill tweaking.

But why even bother? If you didn't give casters the legendary and everyone at level 80 is pulling from the same set pool of stats on armor then theres no need to balance it by giving special armor for special circumstances. Suddenly it doesn't become about armor and its about how well you play the game and group tactics instead.

Not to mention my post wasn't referring to hunters getting killed by mages I meant dps balance in it.

 

[Arkadrel]

I played Allods... a free2play mmo.
In that, all the items had the same amount of stats in just various differnt configourations.

And the builds you could make with each class, ended up being the "optimal" builds quick.

Since everyone was useing the same "best" builds, with each class, and had the same items, you knew that:

Class X ALWAYS beats Class Y.... and there was nothing you could do to change it (extremly sucky feeling).

(atleast with items, you can hope your better equipted than the other player, and its enough to make a differnce)

I just view itemisation as a way to balance classes, its another tool, in the toolbox for devs that make the games to add balance in pve and pvp between classes.

Ive seen games without itemisation... its not a good thing, from my perspective.