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GTX 600 Series: 28nm, OEM-only Fermi Refresh

S

Saico

Member
According to our sources, the company will repeat the strategy from previous architectures (G80-G9x, GT200-GT21X) and introduce a limited number of die-shrunk Fermi-based parts which are to be used for process optimization.

As such, the low-numbered GeForce 600 parts will target OEM and SI vendors, but we expect some parts to appear in e-tail/retail as well, as the box-business (Add-In-Board Vendors) companies usually get their share of parts which are worth seeing in discrete end of business.

Does this mean that Kepler will skip the GeForce 600 naming and become GeForce 700 Series, as it happened with GeForce 300 and 400? Only time will tell.

The parts are planned for introduction for this years' holiday season.
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Source

I smell Cypress vs Fermi all over again. Nvidia's trying hard to spoil AMD's new generation launch.
 
Can't say I blame them. I would want a previous architecture "pipe-cleaner" card on a new process first. I think they learned their lesson with Fermi.
 
lifeblood said:
Can't say I blame them. I would want a previous architecture "pipe-cleaner" card on a new process first. I think they learned their lesson with Fermi.
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Yea, same thing AMD did with the 4770, I think its a good move also. Plus it gonna be a money maker in the OEM channel.
 
I smell low-end only, much like with the previous generations (e.g. 40nm).
There's minimal chance of doing a high end refresh and going OEM only IMO.
 
From the sounds of it TSMC is going to have issues regardless. AMD may launch first but supplies will be very low through the end of the year. Doesnt hurt to get OEM products on a smaller process. Lower cost, lower power consumption.
 
I'd be all for both companies die-shrinking their existing performance parts, bumping up clocks a little, all while lowering TDP in the process if there is a substantial wait between now and the true next gen parts. But I don't think there is enough of a time gap between now and then for a lineup of die shrunk GF110 and GF114's (or barts, or caymans for that matter).
 
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The generational naming conventions stopped making any sense after 8800 series was rebadged into 9800 series. GTX600 generation is really a true GTX300

8800 series (real GeForce 8)
9800 series (still should have been GeForce 8)
GTX200 (Should have been GTX100 series) <this is really GeForce 9>
GTX300 (skipped)
GTX400 (should have been GTX200 series) <this is really GeForce 10>
GTX500 (should have been GTX400 refresh series)
GTX600 (the real GTX300 series) <this is GeForce 11>

Thanks NV for completely ruining any relation to what a generation is with your convoluted branding!
 
At least they don't horribly mislead people with sneaky ddr3-equipped 6670's... 🙂

I still think that AMD could do something like this as well, maybe bring out a 7770 ala 4770. 5870 went ok, but they didn't make the kind of fundamental changes that you saw with, say, 8800 gtx or 3870. If the high end 79x0 is really an all- or mostly-new design then it would be extremely risky to roll that out on 28nm. In fact, I would go so far as to say that if the new "high end" comes out before any other 7xx0 products on 28nm then it will likely just be a rework of the vliw4 arch.
 
Tempered81 said:
I predict a re-spin 28nm Fermi to be equal to or faster than a VLIW4g2 or GCN 28nm chip from AMD. Nvidia must obviously think it has a chance too.
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You don't think that NV will just roll out a low/midrange card first and bring out the high end later on? Not saying that a die-shrunk 580/680 that was 30-40% faster wouldn't compete extremely well with a vliw4 7970, but why would NV waste the resources on it when the next gen will be out a few months later and could wipe the floor with 7970 and even go toe-to-toe with 7990? Only way I see them die-shrinking high-end fermi is if the new arch won't be ready until q4 2012.
 
bryanW1995 said:
At least they don't horribly mislead people with sneaky ddr3-equipped 6670's... 🙂

I still think that AMD could do something like this as well, maybe bring out a 7770 ala 4770. 5870 went ok, but they didn't make the kind of fundamental changes that you saw with, say, 8800 gtx or 3870. If the high end 79x0 is really an all- or mostly-new design then it would be extremely risky to roll that out on 28nm. In fact, I would go so far as to say that if the new "high end" comes out before any other 7xx0 products on 28nm then it will likely just be a rework of the vliw4 arch.
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I had read somewhere, sorry can't find it right now, Dave Baumann said that the 7000 series was going to be GCN top to bottom.
 
I don't believe many people buy high end video cards off of OEM's. It wouldn't be a good idea for a refresh like this on the high end to restricted to OEM only. People do buy OEM PC's but in the enthusiest market that is limited amount of people compared to the low end market.

Likely a low end refresh which really only means that they can make more money. I understand that smaller process means more profits.

However if it was a high end refresh I think we would be able to clock these chips higher than the 5 series? Is this correct?
 
3DVagabond said:
I had read somewhere, sorry can't find it right now, Dave Baumann said that the 7000 series was going to be GCN top to bottom.
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They would need at least a single VLIW4 design at the bottom end for hybrid crossfire with Trinity. I guess it could be that they will make a VLIW4 card for that purpose but name it outside of the 7xxx series.
 
(sic)Klown12 said:
They would need at least a single VLIW4 design at the bottom end for hybrid crossfire with Trinity. I guess it could be that they will make a VLIW4 card for that purpose but name it outside of the 7xxx series.
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Not necessarily. 😉

Another critical update that will be enabled in the Catalyst 10.2 is the rearchitecture of CrossFire. According to the chip maker, the new drive will see some of the CrossFire code moved from the 3D drive to a separate driver component, in an attempt to prepare the Catalyst Software Suite for future AMD products, namely the much-anticipated Fusion products, such as the 2011-bound 'Llano' APU. In addition, the separate drive will also enable users to mix and match ATI graphics cards from different generations.
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http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1569541&postcount=594
 
RussianSensation said:
The generational naming conventions stopped making any sense after 8800 series was rebadged into 9800 series. GTX600 generation is really a true GTX300

8800 series (real GeForce 8)
9800 series (still should have been GeForce 8)
GTX200 (Should have been GTX100 series) <this is really GeForce 9>
GTX300 (skipped)
GTX400 (should have been GTX200 series) <this is really GeForce 10>
GTX500 (should have been GTX400 refresh series)
GTX600 (the real GTX300 series) <this is GeForce 11>

Thanks NV for completely ruining any relation to what a generation is with your convoluted branding!
Click to expand...

Well it's not like AMD isn't to blame also lately. 6870 is slower than a 5870. A 6770 is the same thing as a 5770. A 6850 is sometimes slower than a 5850. A 6990m is not a dual solution like the 6990.

They're both just as guilty as the other now.
 
tviceman said:
Well it's not like AMD isn't to blame also lately. 6870 is slower than a 5870. A 6770 is the same thing as a 5770. A 6850 is sometimes slower than a 5850. A 6990m is not a dual solution like the 6990.

They're both just as guilty as the other now.
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What a load of FUD.

6770 is a renamed 5770 with some added hdmi stuff or something like that. AMD is open about it and says: you can CrossfireX these two cards.

Have you SLIed a 8800 with a 250?


68xx is mid/high end, while the 58xx was the high end. Whats the point in spreading such FUD anyway? Transparent to the extreme.

What's also transparent is your attack. If you really want to keep posting here it needs to stop.

-ViRGE
 
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Madcatatlas said:
What a load of FUD.

6770 is a renamed 5770 with some added hdmi stuff or something like that. AMD is open about it and says: you can CrossfireX these two cards.

Have you SLIed a 8800 with a 250?


68xx is mid/high end, while the 58xx was the high end. Whats the point in spreading such FUD anyway? Transparent to the extreme.
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I won't comment about the naming but SLI cannot work with different cards, you cannot even SLI GTX570 with GTX580.
 
tviceman said:
Well it's not like AMD isn't to blame also lately. 6870 is slower than a 5870. A 6770 is the same thing as a 5770. A 6850 is sometimes slower than a 5850. A 6990m is not a dual solution like the 6990.

They're both just as guilty as the other now.
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At least AMD doesn't take a GPU core and make FIVE series let alone the countless individual models.

G92 = 8800GT/9800GT/GTS150/GTS250/340
 
Madcatatlas said:
What a load of FUD.

6770 is a renamed 5770 with some added hdmi stuff or something like that. AMD is open about it and says: you can CrossfireX these two cards.

Have you SLIed a 8800 with a 250? <------- WTF???


68xx is mid/high end, while the 58xx was the high end. Whats the point in spreading such FUD anyway? Transparent to the extreme.
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You contest one thing out of 4 and you call it a load of FUD? Why?

"Well it's not like AMD isn't to blame also lately."
6870 is slower than a 5870." TRUE
"A 6770 is the same thing as a 5770." TRUE except for "some added hdmi stuff or something like that."
"A 6850 is sometimes slower than a 5850." TRUE
"A 6990m is not a dual solution like the 6990." TRUE

And not once was anything mentioned about Crossfiring or SLI. I actually don't understand why you introduced that variable into the discussion at this point.
 
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Madcatatlas said:
What a load of FUD.

6770 is a renamed 5770 with some added hdmi stuff or something like that. AMD is open about it and says: you can CrossfireX these two cards.

Have you SLIed a 8800 with a 250?


68xx is mid/high end, while the 58xx was the high end. Whats the point in spreading such FUD anyway? Transparent to the extreme.
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Imho,


6770 and 5770 use the same core but personally understand why AMD changed the naming. Both companies do similar things and just illusions to say one does and the other doesn't. The Juniper core still provided performance/features and worthy of a name change. Have you noticed that really good chips from IHV's last for many generations and a testament to their engineering? Some mocked at the G-92 and G-92B from nVidia but forget one thing -- they were outstanding chips, just like Juniper.

The reason why AMD changed their naming convention with the 6XXX series, is the 5XXX series had a gigantic hole that the 5830 by itself couldn't fill. So, AMD created a new convention and sku's; the 6870 and 6850 series simply were dropped down for their lower price-point designation and the high-end was replaced with the 69XX moniker.

But extremism will offer this is all trying to confuse and mislead the consumer but actually attempts to redefine and offer more clarity to their current naming convention.
 
StrangerGuy said:
At least AMD doesn't take a GPU core and make FIVE series let alone the countless individual models.

G92 = 8800GT/9800GT/GTS150/GTS250/340
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That was one hell of a flexible chip/architecture - G-92 and G-92B -- and many more SKu's than what you're listing.
 
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