Stocks do grow in value, split, pay dividends, bonds mature and cash funds collect interest. Investments grow and you own them.
Stocks do grow in value, split, pay dividends, bonds mature and cash funds collect interest. Investments grow and you own them.
Engineer
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- Oct 9, 1999
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That's exactly what I want, not the "rumored" private account that caps the growth at inflation + a certain percent with the government skimming the rest. Also, I think that a person should be able to access that money for "early retirement" if they are able to do so, and not this mandatory minimum retirement age.
Still doesn't solve any shortfalls for the current generation of payees.
But who is paying that interest on bonds? US workers = taxpayers. Who is paying dividends or interest on corporate bonds? Companies out of their earnings. Ultimately it's still younger workers' earnings supporting retirees, any way you cut it.
So how exactly is this an argument against private accounts which will be owned by the citizen and not the government?
You guys just don?t get it. You think YOU will be able
to take some of your SS money and invest it in ATT or
MS or uncle Bobs grocery store? Nope! You?ll have one
choice, to give that money over to THE GOVERNMENT to
invest in two or three of what THEY want to invest it
in. This idea that you will be able to take that money
and do as you wish with it is not what Bush is doing.
Wake up!
to take some of your SS money and invest it in ATT or
MS or uncle Bobs grocery store? Nope! You?ll have one
choice, to give that money over to THE GOVERNMENT to
invest in two or three of what THEY want to invest it
in. This idea that you will be able to take that money
and do as you wish with it is not what Bush is doing.
Wake up!
Consumers will pay the interest on corporate bonds. But that is besides the point of this article. The point is Greenspan believes private accounts are a better long term solution than the current pay as you go system.
Now if you think you are somehow more qualified than Greenspan please let us know. Your lack of understanding of the stock market and banking in this country will surpise us if you are.
It sounds like they want to model it after the federal thrift program. When was the last time the thrift program collapsed? I dont believe anybody has said they plan on letting you invest in individual stocks. It will be run like a mutual fund.
On a side note here is some information about the federal thrift program.
http://www.tsp.gov/rates/monthly-history.html
All fund gained an avg of at least 5.45% on an annual basis with a high of 12% over a 10 year span.
SS earned you ~3% at the best.
It's not an arguement for or against, it's pointing out that privatization won't solve the fundamental problem with more retirees living longer with fewer workers to support them.
The federal employees thrift saving plan has about 6 funds you can choose from. Ranging from income to growth funds(foreign and domestic).
Even 2 options would be better than the single "option" we have now.
Interesting you didn't note that Greenspan said that in order to pay for this, either taxes must be raised or benefits must be cut.
Greenspan Sounds Cautionary Note on Social Security Changes
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4502016
Greenspan Sounds Cautionary Note on Social Security Changes
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4502016
The Krugman rumor. It was retracted the day after he wrote it, actually the correction was sent out hours after he wrote it. Nice that he gets a long column full of crap information that he basically pulls from his a** then they have a tiny correction on page A79 the next day.
Reason why Krugman is nothing more than a DNC shill. A poor one at this because this is his second major retraction in the past few weeks. It seems as if this 'brilliant' career professor (read: never held a real world job) gets it wrong a lot.
This is a given and it has never been taken off of the table. I happen to believe that the final Bush proposal will look something like this...
1. Increase taxes on higher end earner. Say over $60,000 or so.
2. Increase the ceiling to around $110,000.
3. Private accounts with up to 3% of your money.
Something like that will give a carrot to everyone. It is also totally feasible and would really not piss all that many people off. For those making more money the 3% in private accounts will more than cover the increase in taxes when ROR is figured in. It would still be a net gain for them, and everyone else in particular.
There is no reason why they cannot come up with a compromise that includes private accounts. About the only real reason I voted for anyone this time around was because I knew Bush was willing to change SS. I also knew that this may be the only time during my lifetime that there is a chance to save it, really fix it. I know that when Hillary wins in 2008 she will not fix it, in 2012 she will not fix it. The only people who can (or will) attempt to fix SS are two term Republicans as it is suicide to try your first time around. And we may not see one for a while. I fear that is a solution is not found now, I cannot could on anything.
If AARP would just sit back and if the Democrats would just work with Bush they could easily fix the problem. What pisses me off is that AARP is threatening everyone that mentions it (like it will even effect their current membership) and the Democrats are just sitting around stalling, complaining, and whining. Bush asked for their proposals, they need to get one together. If they don't they are really risking a lot in terms of the parties long term health in America.
Sadly, I think their rage and hatred for the Fourth Reich is so out of control that they do not even realize that they are endangering their very party.
I'd have no problem with either 1) Repeal the Bush tax cuts that worsened our deficits by lowering tax revenue to the lowest % of GDP in over 40 years or 2) Remove the income limit on FICA taxes.
The trouble is, Bush's propaganda has completely avoided either of those necessities until just yesterday when he said he'd review options that included raising taxes.
Uh did you and your liberal buddies not watch the state of the union? Bush said ALL options with the exception of hiking the payroll tax, are on the table. IIRC he even mentioned that option(raising the cap) specifically. I guess liberals keep tuning that out when they hear the words private accounts.
Allow private accounts.
Do away with the cap.
Raise Retirement age.
Tinker with the payout formula.
Raise Taxes and Cut Spending.
This would fix social security, and not screw over future generations. It would also allow for medicad/medicare to be reformed.
What liberal buddies? Take your partisan blinders off, they're affecting your brain.
Perhaps if Bush had listened to Greenspan and O'Neill back in 2001 we'd have fixed SS then and it would have been a great accomplishment for Bush.
I got called a liberal.
Conjour, will you be my liberal friend? I will need help in the land of bunnies and cupcakes.
Conjour, will you be my liberal friend? I will need help in the land of bunnies and cupcakes.
Not the point of the article I linked to. The point is he thinks it is a more viable program than the current system. And democrats wont even consider it.
He acknowleges the costs involved and if you read my article he makes note that he is not sure if the financial markets have already figured in the costs or not.
But he also suggested that in determining interest rates and bond yields, the financial markets may already have accounted for the $16 trillion in unfunded liabilities of the Social Security and Medicare programs.
You didnt listen very well at the state of the union speech then. He said all options on are on the table except increasing payroll taxes. I think raising the cap is a good thing. But dont act like it will magically solve the problem either.
I lost all respect for Greenspan and Greenspan lost all credibility when he prostituted himself for Bush by supporting the reckless Bush tax cut for the wealthy (at the expense of the budget and the rest of America). Then Greenspan dropped interest rates about a dozen times in as many months in an attempt to end the recession caused in part by Bush's irresponsible tax cuts and at the cost of seniors who had their savings invested in just about any of the vehicles seniors use.
Greenspan is just another in a long and ever growing list of whores for Bush.
Greenspan is just another in a long and ever growing list of whores for Bush.
Greenspan happens to be a big backer of free markets. This means tax cuts, increasing private savings, etc... Has he ever been any different? I don't think it can be argued that he has done a bad job over the years serving many presidents. Funny, now that you hate Bush and he agrees with Bush you hate him. I am guessing that about six years ago you thought he was brilliant.
Long live Bush Hitler and the Fourth Reich - led by General Greenspan of the Waffle ZZ
Long live Bush Hitler and the Fourth Reich - led by General Greenspan of the Waffle ZZ
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