• Guest, The rules for the P & N subforum have been updated to prohibit "ad hominem" or personal attacks against other posters. See the full details in the post "Politics and News Rules & Guidelines."
  • Community Question: What makes a good motherboard?

GOP betrays innocent fetuses on Roe v. Wade anniversary

Page 2 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

BurnItDwn

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
25,397
1,024
126
As medicine progresses and premature babies can survive at 20 weeks will your opinion change?
Yes, instead of an abortion, the woman should have the fetus removed from her body alive and put inside the future machine so that an adoptive family with the resources and the desire can raise the baby.
 

nickqt

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2015
6,023
4,087
136
blue state red state. We need a new purple party, it will be moderate, like the libertarian party, only a bit more liberal fiscally as far as safety nets and public services go.
We have that already, it's called the Democratic party.
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,017
571
126
Once the baby is old enough, then the baby can be taken out of the mother and put in a machine rather than aborted.. Can go be adopted and will not be killed. Otherwise, the woman has the right as long as its in her body, and does not have a viable alternative IMO
I can't agree that we can snuff out human beings so that women might be spared 40 weeks of pain and discomfort.
 

BurnItDwn

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
25,397
1,024
126
I can't agree that we can snuff out human beings so that women might be spared 40 weeks of pain and discomfort.
It is a dark/ugly horrible position that I take. I believe the solution is to prevent abortion by encouraging condom use, birth control, morning after pills, and workable prevention.


Any woman who wants an abortion should try to get one much earlier as well.

In any case, Im not talking about discomfort, I am talking about ownership of self. Assuming the woman is of the age of consent, and a she undergoes a psychiatric evaluation to insure she is of sound mind, the decision should be hers to make, and hers to live with.
 
Feb 6, 2007
16,439
1
81
I can't agree that we can snuff out human beings so that women might be spared 40 weeks of pain and discomfort.
It's really easy to have that opinion knowing that you will not ever be in a position to go through that 40 weeks of pain and discomfort yourself. It also makes it really easy to dismiss your opinion. It's legislation that doesn't apply to you, just like gay marriage or marijuana laws (I'm assuming you don't smoke pot). Frankly, if legislation doesn't actually affect you, your opinion is inherently less important.
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
14,368
7,149
146
My grandpa relied on my grandmother to survive. He had MS and couldn't do much more than talk.

Was he not a person?
Let's look at it another way. Do you think he should have the right to end his life if his quality of life devolved to the point he no longer wanted to live. Should he be forced into expensive invasive care to eek out every last minute of "life" by the government?

Or are there some situations where it's moral to end or help end someones life?
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
14,368
7,149
146
I can't agree that we can snuff out human beings so that women might be spared 40 weeks of pain and discomfort.
If you don't want unborn children snuffed out don't have kids.

You do have kids though, right?

So how do you justify the kids you naturally snuffed out to have ones you do?
 

unixwizzard

Senior member
Jan 17, 2013
205
0
76
This brings up a point I'd like to know.. as we all know, those on the left just love to classify Republicans / conservatives as racist.. if they really were as racist as claimed, why are they so against something that has resulted in the death of millions of black and hispanic babies since 1973?

I keep hearing about how those who are opposed to "Obamacare" (Republicans) are racist, because they are against something that will help out poor minorities, that stopping "Obamacare" will result in the death of those same poor minorities. Using that kind of logic, if Republicans were as racist as claimed, shouldn't they be for more abortion and not against it?
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
28,200
8,044
136
Let me see if I get this right:

Late term abortions = rare = we must do something to stop them! Abortions should be outlawed!

Voter ID fraud = super rare = we must do something!! We will make it harder for legit people to vote while ignoring where the majority of voter fraud occurs.

Mass shootings = rare = can't do anything sorry. You can address the underlying cause though.

Righty retard logic strikes again!
 

Tombstone1881

Senior member
Aug 8, 2014
486
161
116
This brings up a point I'd like to know.. as we all know, those on the left just love to classify Republicans / conservatives as racist.. if they really were as racist as claimed, why are they so against something that has resulted in the death of millions of black and hispanic babies since 1973?
Millions, eh? I'm sure you have statistics to back that up.

And save us from your "moral attitude" Republicans are all for the rights of fetuses and zygotes, but once a kid is born... Forget it.

Cut every type of social funding you can imagine. Cut education. Cut food stamps. Cut healthcare. Cut housing allowances. Tell that infant to get a job and stand on his own two feet.
 

nickqt

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2015
6,023
4,087
136
This brings up a point I'd like to know.. as we all know, those on the left just love to classify Republicans / conservatives as racist.. if they really were as racist as claimed, why are they so against something that has resulted in the death of millions of black and hispanic babies since 1973?

I keep hearing about how those who are opposed to "Obamacare" (Republicans) are racist, because they are against something that will help out poor minorities, that stopping "Obamacare" will result in the death of those same poor minorities. Using that kind of logic, if Republicans were as racist as claimed, shouldn't they be for more abortion and not against it?
Fetus =! baby

Also: more poor people working = lower wages and benefits = more profits.

If we're going to straw man our political opponents.
 

unixwizzard

Senior member
Jan 17, 2013
205
0
76
Millions, eh? I'm sure you have statistics to back that up.
I don't have them, the CDC does.. Look up their Abortion Surveillance Reports.. Others have put together the numbers, since Roe v Wade in 1973, there were approx 55 million legal abortions in the US. Of those, at least half were performed on black or hispanic women.

Half of 55 million is 27 1/2 million, so yes.. millions.
 

rudeguy

Lifer
Dec 27, 2001
47,385
13
61
Let's look at it another way. Do you think he should have the right to end his life if his quality of life devolved to the point he no longer wanted to live. Should he be forced into expensive invasive care to eek out every last minute of "life" by the government?

Or are there some situations where it's moral to end or help end someones life?
Let's look at a different way: if my gramma thought he was a burden, should she have been able to kill him?
 

tracerbullet

Golden Member
Feb 22, 2001
1,661
19
81
It is a dark/ugly horrible position that I take. I believe the solution is to prevent abortion by encouraging condom use, birth control, morning after pills, and workable prevention.

Any woman who wants an abortion should try to get one much earlier as well.

In any case, Im not talking about discomfort, I am talking about ownership of self. Assuming the woman is of the age of consent, and a she undergoes a psychiatric evaluation to insure she is of sound mind, the decision should be hers to make, and hers to live with.
This, 100%.
 

Tombstone1881

Senior member
Aug 8, 2014
486
161
116
In a republicans eyes, that should be a good thing then isn't it?

Lees people on the welfare rolls to have to pay for, and foster homes are already busting at the seams.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 30, 2003
26,916
172
106
How does the baby's viability have any bearing whatsoever on its rights as a human being? Since when were human rights predicated on such conditions?
Because the SCOTUS says it does in their decision Roe v Wade.

Contrary to what you usually see, RvW was largely about balancing the rights of the mother and those of the fetus.

The SCOTUS drew the line at "viability". I.e., once the point of viability is reached the mother does not have a 'right' to an abortion.

Fern
 

conehead433

Diamond Member
Dec 4, 2002
5,118
164
106
Why the hell do we need parties at all?
Most people misunderstand the whole party system. U.S. Senators and Congressmen get voted into office. Then they go to Washington and party on your dime while also having money stuffed into their pockets by their corporate sponsors.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 30, 2003
26,916
172
106
Why the hell do we need parties at all?
All democratic countries have political parties; our problem is that we just have two of them (for all practical purposes).

Also, it seems to me that Congressional rules essential mandate two political parties. E.g., Bernie Sanders is an independent, however he caucuses with the Democratic Party (so for all intents and purposes he is one) otherwise under Congressional rules I don't think he'd have any power (committee positions etc.)

The Constitution gave broad authority for Congress to enact its own rules of conduct.

Fern
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,130
13,070
136
Your grandpa could have relied on a nurse or hospital too. That is clearly very different from my point.

If a woman doesnt want to raise a baby, and she is carrying a fetus, she should have the right to abort the birth to kill/murder the fetus. The small human which isnt fully developed and isnt viable to live on his or her own. It is a horrible horrible thing, but, no matter how horrible, is not as horrible as telling a person that their body belongs to somebody else, that they are not in charge of their own body. They do not own themselves.
It is a dark/ugly horrible position that I take. I believe the solution is to prevent abortion by encouraging condom use, birth control, morning after pills, and workable prevention.


Any woman who wants an abortion should try to get one much earlier as well.

In any case, Im not talking about discomfort, I am talking about ownership of self. Assuming the woman is of the age of consent, and a she undergoes a psychiatric evaluation to insure she is of sound mind, the decision should be hers to make, and hers to live with.
That's the most rational thinking on the subject I've ever read on this forum. Thank you.

That particular issue of personhood & personal responsibility is central to the thinking of modern women. They'll accept the same constraints on their say over their bodies as those placed on men, and no more. Obviously, no constraints can be placed on men in this matter- so they accept none on themselves. True equality.
 

MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,751
3,064
121
Seems like a lot of people are getting really pissed at the whole political system as it it.

Would be a good thing, but unless something radical happens I do not see a big change in the near future.

I guess that is just the way things are.
 

First

Lifer
Jun 3, 2002
10,530
271
136
I can't agree that we can snuff out human beings so that women might be spared 40 weeks of pain and discomfort.
You have to lack a lot of nuance, and might have some sort of personality disorder, if you see the world in such black and white.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY