Discussion Google Tensor SoC thread

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DZero

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Jun 20, 2024
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If Tensor G5 fails Google would definately have failed in the smartphone Market and even damage Android in the process
 

Doug S

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Feb 8, 2020
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If Tensor G5 fails Google would definately have failed in the smartphone Market and even damage Android in the process

Why would it damage Android? And haven't most generations of Pixel had various shortcomings and various issues? Hasn't stopped buyers from coming back. It takes a lot for a brand as big as Google's to "fail" in the smartphone market, and using an SoC with subpar performance certainly wouldn't be the thing that makes that happen. Especially when their marketing would be all about AI, and not stellar GB6 results.
 

FlameTail

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2021
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A spreadsheet with the names of engineers who are part of Google's Tensor SoC team.

There are some veterans from Qualcomm, Intel, IBM etc... with 10+,20+ and even 30+ years of experience.

A lot of these people were hired in the last 3-4 years. It seems Google's bolstering their Tensor team as they wean off of Samsung LSI, and start to make their own fully in-house SoCs starting with Tensor G5.

View attachment 107707View attachment 107708
Is Google building custom CPU cores!!?
View attachment 107709
Information was sourced from this Reddit comment;
Some more scraps of information;

A renaissance in custom ARM CPU core projects?

Will be interesting to see how Google's core stacks up against others. We might see it in the Tensor G6.

I'd guess this was a long term objective of theirs- building a custom CPU. Remember when Google tried to buy Nuvia?
 

FlameTail

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2021
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Tensor G5 hits 5 GHz? Custom CPU core??
Laguna is the codename for TensorG5 and has appeared in Qualcomm-related content .

( Fabless, Foundry News. (2024.08.31. Samsung, Google, Qualcomm, AMD) )

It's hard to see this as a coincidence since it's not an old product, and Laguna doesn't fit the Snapdragon codename pattern.

If Google is working with Qualcomm through Laguna, we can imagine what specific areas it might be working on.

It could be something like Samsung's custom SoC team, or it could be trying to use Qualcomm IP like Oryon.

This becomes more plausible when you look at the following.
3nm Gchip CPU 5.1GHz

When we say Gchip, it is common to think of it as a tensor, but if it is a 3nm tensor, it is reasonable to think of it as a TensorG5 (Laguna).

It's likely that it uses the ARM reference architecture, but the clock speed is too high for that to be the case.

Looking at the ARM announcement, the 3nm Cortex-X925 targets 3.6GHz.

Even if the 2nd and 3rd generation 3nm process is used, there is a limit to the increase in clock speed, and when predicting the release date of Tensor G5, it is difficult to see that it will use the successor architecture (Travis) of Cortex-X925.

5GHz is impossible using ARM reference architecture at 3nm.
.

This is either true or it is BS. I might be leaning to the latter...

However, strange isn't it that there hasn't been any leaks about the Tensor G5 specs? The SoC itself has supposedly already taped out on TSMC N3E. Release is ~1 year away.
 

DZero

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Jun 20, 2024
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Why would it damage Android? And haven't most generations of Pixel had various shortcomings and various issues? Hasn't stopped buyers from coming back. It takes a lot for a brand as big as Google's to "fail" in the smartphone market, and using an SoC with subpar performance certainly wouldn't be the thing that makes that happen. Especially when their marketing would be all about AI, and not stellar GB6 results.
Funny story this time there is Apple and Huawei who has interesting enough better chips than Google (and about Huawei is saying a lot seeing the foundry), but more than that, their OS are quite competitive and with also competitive AI features, Google would lose most of it's appeal.

The Pixel in the Snapdragon (1 to 5) era was pretty much acceptable and even the Pixel 7 and 8a were quite decent.
 

Doug S

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Feb 8, 2020
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Funny story this time there is Apple and Huawei who has interesting enough better chips than Google (and about Huawei is saying a lot seeing the foundry), but more than that, their OS are quite competitive and with also competitive AI features, Google would lose most of it's appeal.

The Pixel in the Snapdragon (1 to 5) era was pretty much acceptable and even the Pixel 7 and 8a were quite decent.

At least from what I've read online (not being an Android person or knowing anyone with Pixel) it seems like a lot of the appeal of Pixel has been the "pure" Android that isn't layered with vendor crap like Samsung's, and because being a Google product it would get Android updates more reliably. Huawei is pretty irrelevant at least in China as Google Play does not operate there.

Since Google has tightened the screws on the amount of customization Android OEMs can do with each release - claimed at least to address the problem of vendors not delivering timely updates - that would reduce the impetus to seek out a "pure Android" alternative. The Android update situation is much better on most OEMs than it was when Pixel was introduced, and there are fewer differences between the various vendor Android installs. So where previously Pixel could compete with inferior hardware due to a superior software situation, now that its software advantage is diminished it needs to be more competitive hardware wise to survive.
 

adroc_thurston

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2023
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it seems like a lot of the appeal of Pixel has been the "pure" Android that isn't layered with vendor crap like Samsung's, and because being a Google product it would get Android updates more reliably.
no. it was the camera.
 

SpacemanSpiffVT

Senior member
Apr 17, 2001
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I am fairly happy with my Pixel 9 Pro as compared my previous Pixel 7 experience. I don't game day to day so the lack of a high end Snapdragon doesn't really bother me but it does have the occasional extreme overheating feeling especially compared with my S23 Ultra which almost never does that.

I don't understand why they just don't use a Snapdragon like every other Android manufacturer? What is the benefit of this custom CPU?
 

DZero

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Jun 20, 2024
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I am fairly happy with my Pixel 9 Pro as compared my previous Pixel 7 experience. I don't game day to day so the lack of a high end Snapdragon doesn't really bother me but it does have the occasional extreme overheating feeling especially compared with my S23 Ultra which almost never does that.

I don't understand why they just don't use a Snapdragon like every other Android manufacturer? What is the benefit of this custom CPU?
The S23 line were the best Samsung did in a long time ago. heck, Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 is one of the best processors ever since the 865.
 

Hesperax

Junior Member
Nov 13, 2023
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I am not sure if the information is authentic. But it looks like there is a (former?) employee who has posted slides on Twitter from the Malibu (Pixel 26) Arch-Concept (from 2023).

Not sure if I should provide the link to his account. He seems to be trying to blackmail money from Google. Is there any forum rule that I should be aware of?

The Slides have the CPU/GPU Roadmap for Pixel (for Laguna, Malibu, Malibu+). Along with block diagrams for the GPU/DSP/ISP/TPU/etc and other miscellenous information that makes them seem legitimate.
 
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Reactions: FlameTail

DZero

Member
Jun 20, 2024
159
65
61
I am not sure if the information is authentic. But it looks like there is a (former?) employee who has posted slides on Twitter from the Malibu (Pixel 26) Arch-Concept (from 2023).

Not sure if I should provide the link to his account. He seems to be trying to blackmail money from Google. Is there any forum rule that I should be aware of?

The Slides have the CPU/GPU Roadmap for Pixel (for Laguna, Malibu, Malibu+). Along with block diagrams for the GPU/DSP/ISP/TPU/etc and other miscellenous information that makes them seem legitimate.
It's for 2023-2025? or is a new brand one?
 

Hesperax

Junior Member
Nov 13, 2023
21
40
51
It's for 2023-2025? or is a new brand one?
The document is from 2023. It shows a CPU Roadmap to 2027 (which is listed as "MBU+"). A GPU Roadmap to P26 (which is listed as "Malibu"). A DSP Roadmap to Laguna (it says "under construction" for Malibu).

There is a CPU Competitve Analysis slide with a graph of Geekbench 5 from 2021 to 2026 between Apple, Qualcomm, Mediatek, and gChips. The figure for 2024 is close for Apple and Qualcomm but way off for Mediatek.