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Google may shut down operations in China

bfdd

Lifer
Feb 3, 2007
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Not that big of a deal they're not even close to the largest search provider and are losing market share there DAILY. The most term searched the most in Google.cn is Baidu, which for those that don't know is their largest search provider and just a huge web portal in China.
 

Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
9,280
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So they are going to miss out on 2 billion customers because of their principals.
Doesn't sounds like they are doing what is in the best interest of their share holders.
 

bfdd

Lifer
Feb 3, 2007
13,312
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So they are going to miss out on 2 billion customers because of their principals.
Doesn't sounds like they are doing what is in the best interest of their share holders.
It has nothing to do with principals, it has to do with them constantly losing market share to Baidu. Baidu btw provides Google with access to the filter. So Google has to go through Baidu to use the Chinese filter and they're losing everyone to Baidu. Doesn't seem very cost effective to stay there imo.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,872
4,214
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So they are going to miss out on 2 billion customers because of their principals.
Doesn't sounds like they are doing what is in the best interest of their share holders.
Good for Google. Many US companies did what's in the "best interest" of their stockholders by selling to genocidal dictatorships. It might be in the best interest of a business to sell Bin Laden high tech terror. No thanks.

While it's been a while that China has killed some tens of millions, they are still oppressive, and will imprison people for political or religious reasons. You don't like Obama, Pelosi or Reid? You'd be begging for a warm hug from Barney Frank if you were at the tender mercies of China.

I have to give Google a big thumbs up for this.
 

Sacrilege

Senior member
Sep 6, 2007
647
0
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This really shows the asymmetrical warfare potential of the internet which the PRC hacker brigades are going after. If they pulled out all the stops they could really fuck stuff up around the world. The US government has nowhere near the manpower or practice to fight China on the internet.
 

JS80

Lifer
Oct 24, 2005
26,260
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This really shows the asymmetrical warfare potential of the internet which the PRC hacker brigades are going after. If they pulled out all the stops they could really fuck stuff up around the world. The US government has nowhere near the manpower or practice to fight China on the internet.
What? You mean there's no hard wire to the internet we can just cut?!?! Skynet is software?!?!?! AHHHHHHHHHH
 

Sacrilege

Senior member
Sep 6, 2007
647
0
0
It has nothing to do with principals, it has to do with them constantly losing market share to Baidu. Baidu btw provides Google with access to the filter. So Google has to go through Baidu to use the Chinese filter and they're losing everyone to Baidu. Doesn't seem very cost effective to stay there imo.
This is entirely correct, but expect to see US media and bleeding heart crowd lauding this action.

Google was nothing in China, everyone there uses domestic web sites and portals, and the internet based threat to Chinese dissidents and activists (many of them not even in China) remains.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,872
4,214
126
This is entirely correct, but expect to see US media and bleeding heart crowd lauding this action.

Google was nothing in China, everyone there uses domestic web sites and portals, and the internet based threat to Chinese dissidents and activists (many of them not even in China) remains.
It's kind of hard to be anything that a totalitarian government doesn't want. Google gave them a big FU, and if that is all it amounts to I'm good with that. Someone needs to tell the Chinese govt. to shove it.
 

cirrrocco

Golden Member
Sep 7, 2004
1,946
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http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN1213312720100113?type=marketsNews

Like many other well-known organizations, we face cyber attacks of varying degrees on a regular basis. In mid-December, we detected a highly sophisticated and targeted attack on our corporate infrastructure originating from China that resulted in the theft of intellectual property from Google. However, it soon became clear that what at first appeared to be solely a security incident -- albeit a significant one -- was something quite different.

First, this attack was not just on Google. As part of our investigation we have discovered that at least twenty other large companies from a wide range of businesses -- including the Internet, finance, technology, media and chemical sectors -- have been similarly targeted. We are currently in the process of notifying those companies, and we are also working with the relevant U.S. authorities.

Second, we have evidence to suggest that a primary goal of the attackers was accessing the Gmail accounts of Chinese human rights activists. Based on our investigation to date we believe their attack did not achieve that objective. Only two Gmail accounts appear to have been accessed, and that activity was limited to account information (such as the date the account was created) and subject line, rather than the content of emails themselves.

Third, as part of this investigation but independent of the attack on Google, we have discovered that the accounts of dozens of US-, China- and Europe-based Gmail users who are advocates of human rights in China appear to have been routinely accessed by third parties. These accounts have not been accessed through any security breach at Google, but most likely via phishing scams or malware placed on the users' computers.

We have already used information gained from this attack to make infrastructure and architectural improvements that enhance security for Google and for our users. In terms of individual users, we would advise people to deploy reputable anti-virus and anti-spyware programs on their computers, to install patches for their operating systems and to update their web browsers. Always be cautious when clicking on links appearing in instant messages and emails, or when asked to share personal information like passwords online. You can read more here about our cyber-security recommendations. People interested wanting to learn more about these kinds of attacks, can read this U.S. government report, Nart Villeneuve's blog and this presentation on the GhostNet spying incident.

We have taken the unusual step of sharing information about these attacks with a broad audience not just because of the security and human rights implications of what we have unearthed, but also because this information goes to the heart of a much bigger global debate about freedom of speech. In the last two decades, China's economic reform programs and its citizens' entrepreneurial flair have lifted hundreds of millions of Chinese people out of poverty. Indeed, this great nation is at the heart of much economic progress and development in the world today.

We launched Google.cn in January 2006 in the belief that the benefits of increased access to information for people in China and a more open Internet outweighed our discomfort in agreeing to censor some results. At the time we made clear that "we will carefully monitor conditions in China, including new laws and other restrictions on our services. If we determine that we are unable to achieve the objectives outlined we will not hesitate to reconsider our approach to China."

These attacks and the surveillance they have uncovered -- combined with the attempts over the past year to further limit free speech on the web -- have led us to conclude that we should review the feasibility of our business operations in China. We have decided we are no longer willing to continue censoring our results on Google.cn, and so over the next few weeks we will be discussing with the Chinese government the basis on which we could operate an unfiltered search engine within the law, if at all. We recognize that this may well mean having to shut down Google.cn, and potentially our offices in China.

The decision to review our business operations in China has been incredibly hard, and we know that it will have potentially far-reaching consequences. We want to make clear that this move was driven by our executives in the United States, without the knowledge or involvement of our employees in China who have worked incredibly hard to make Google.cn the success it is today. We are committed to working responsibly to resolve the very difficult issues raised.
 
Jun 26, 2007
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Good for Google. Many US companies did what's in the "best interest" of their stockholders by selling to genocidal dictatorships. It might be in the best interest of a business to sell Bin Laden high tech terror. No thanks.

While it's been a while that China has killed some tens of millions, they are still oppressive, and will imprison people for political or religious reasons. You don't like Obama, Pelosi or Reid? You'd be begging for a warm hug from Barney Frank if you were at the tender mercies of China.

I have to give Google a big thumbs up for this.
Tens of millions? Try over one hundred million or more by letting them starve to death and about as many by slaughtering them to take over their homeland.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,872
4,214
126
Tens of millions? Try over one hundred million or more by letting them starve to death and about as many by slaughtering them to take over their homeland.
They suck and then some. Did you see this from an above post?

We want to make clear that this move was driven by our executives in the United States, without the knowledge or involvement of our employees in China who have worked incredibly hard to make Google.cn the success it is today.
They're concerned about people involved with their operations, and should be.
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
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They suck and then some. Did you see this from an above post?



They're concerned about people involved with their operations, and should be.
Politics... i fucking hate politics....

At least i'm back on familiar grounds now, i'll tell you about that later in a PM.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,386
2
81
Good for Google. Many US companies did what's in the "best interest" of their stockholders by selling to genocidal dictatorships. It might be in the best interest of a business to sell Bin Laden high tech terror. No thanks.

While it's been a while that China has killed some tens of millions, they are still oppressive, and will imprison people for political or religious reasons. You don't like Obama, Pelosi or Reid? You'd be begging for a warm hug from Barney Frank if you were at the tender mercies of China.

I have to give Google a big thumbs up for this.
This!
 

rchiu

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2002
3,846
0
0
Good for Google. Many US companies did what's in the "best interest" of their stockholders by selling to genocidal dictatorships. It might be in the best interest of a business to sell Bin Laden high tech terror. No thanks.

While it's been a while that China has killed some tens of millions, they are still oppressive, and will imprison people for political or religious reasons. You don't like Obama, Pelosi or Reid? You'd be begging for a warm hug from Barney Frank if you were at the tender mercies of China.

I have to give Google a big thumbs up for this.
It's not just big US companies that's kissing up to China for the "best interest", it's also the US politicians. Have you seen how soft Obama was on China during his last visit and how chicken $hit US politicians are when it comes to sensitive issues like arm deals to Taiwan, human right in Tibet and Xinjiang?

Yeah, another big thumbs up for Google and hope they follow through with actions and not just PR.
 

bfdd

Lifer
Feb 3, 2007
13,312
1
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Again this has nothing to do with Google giving a big FU to China. It has everything to do with Google not being able to get a stranglehold in China like they have in the Western world. That's it. It's not profitable for them to be there so they're leaving. There are no morals in business.
 

Sacrilege

Senior member
Sep 6, 2007
647
0
0
As others say, they appear to be taking a moral stance on the issue. Of course the business issue also is important, but for them it is not their pathetic market share in China but the fact that their code apparently was compromised. That can personally be a big deal, if only in a "on principle" manner. It is demoralizing to have something you worked on stolen.
 
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rchiu

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2002
3,846
0
0
Again this has nothing to do with Google giving a big FU to China. It has everything to do with Google not being able to get a stranglehold in China like they have in the Western world. That's it. It's not profitable for them to be there so they're leaving. There are no morals in business.
Oh really, go read the announcement again. Does Google have to mention the attack to get human right info, freedom of speech, media censorship and other sensitive issues Chinese government don't want to hear? Google have the option to go away quietly if want to just leave Chinese market you know.

And with their cash, Google could've invested in many other non-search related operations and startups in China if they play nice with the Chinese gov. but they essentially cut off that possibility with this press release.

I am not saying Google is a saint with this press release but they are doing much more than anyone, big business and politicians alike, to standup against the fvcked up Chinese communists.
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
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It's not just big US companies that's kissing up to China for the "best interest", it's also the US politicians. Have you seen how soft Obama was on China during his last visit and how chicken $hit US politicians are when it comes to sensitive issues like arm deals to Taiwan, human right in Tibet and Xinjiang?

Yeah, another big thumbs up for Google and hope they follow through with actions and not just PR.
Fuck China.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
48,402
9,248
126
Again this has nothing to do with Google giving a big FU to China. It has everything to do with Google not being able to get a stranglehold in China like they have in the Western world. That's it. It's not profitable for them to be there so they're leaving. There are no morals in business.
I agree this was a straight business decision. Which is why Google is so being public about the Chinese govt's underhanded attempt to compromise their security and potentially do significant damage to Google's brand and IP.
 

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