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Good anti-Evolution article.

edro

Lifer
Fact or Fiction.




During a lecture at the American Museum of Natural History in 1981, prominent evolutionist Colin Patterson asked his esteemed audience of evolutionists a surprising question:

Can you tell me anything you know about evolution, any one thing...that is true? I tried that question on the geology staff at the Field Museum of Natural History and the only answer I got was silence. I tried it on the members of the Evolutionary Morphology seminar in the University of Chicago, a very prestigious body of evolutionists, and all I got there was silence for a long time and eventually one person said 'I do know one thing--it ought not to be taught in high school.'[1]

Many people today accept evolution is a "fact." But is this truly the case? As indicated by the response to Colin Patterson's question, it would seem that the case for evolution is not as rock solid as many think. To be truly informed about the issue, we must also examine the other side of the story. I think that we will see that evolution is by no means a proven fact. On the contrary, there are good reasons to reject the theory of evolution. This work is not intended to be an in-depth treatment, but only to show a few of the problems in the evolutionary theory and, most importantly, to stimulate critical thinking about the issue.

The Problem of Mutations
Natural selection (the mechanism of evolution) can only retain or destroy a characteristic that already exists. What evolution needs to explain, however, is how those characteristics got there in the first place. Thus, it is said that mutations (random errors in copying the genetic code) in the DNA have produced the significant changes over time. Because of the complexity involved, however, it would take literally millions of tiny mutations to produce even a single new organ such as a heart. To think that such a complex organ could be constructed by such random events seems very odd. Furthermore, about 99.9% of mutations are either harmful or neutral (have no significant effect). Mutations simply cannot provide a sufficient mechanism to produce changes because mutations that are both not lethal and not neutral would need to be much more frequent.

For example, the mathematician D.S. Ulam argued that "it was highly improbable that the eye could have evolved by the accumulation of small mutations, because the number of mutations would have to be so large and the time available was not nearly long enough for them to appear." [2] Famous astronomer Sir Fred Hoyle conceded that the chances that life just occurred on earth are about as unlikely as a "tornado sweeping thorough a junkyard and constructing a Boeing 747." [3]

The Problem of the Fossil Record
The fossil record simply does not support evolution. In the 1800s Darwin admitted that "We have seen in the last chapter that whole groups of species sometimes appear to have abruptly developed; and I have attempted to give an explanation of this fact, which if true would be fatal to my views." [4] Darwin also questioned "why, if species have descended from other species by insensibly fine graduations, do we not everywhere see innumerable transitional forms?" [5] The issue is not about the missing link. It is about the millions of missing links.

The gaps in the fossil record have still not been filled, even though many paleontologists agree that the fossil record today is complete. In the words of prominent evolutionist Stephen Jay Gould: "The history of most fossil species includes two features particularly inconsistent with gradualism:

1. Stasis. Most species exhibit no directional change during their tenure on earth. They appear in the fossil record looking pretty much the same as when the disappear; morphological change is usually limited and directionless.

2. Sudden appearance. In any local area, a species does not arise gradually by the steady transformation of its ancestors; it appears all at once and fully formed."[6]

As Gould says, not only do most species just suddenly appear with no record of a long, gradual period of development, but there is also no record of change for the species' during their stay on earth. If the micro-mutation theory is correct (that all organs and organisms came about through slow, small modifications), we would expect to find some creatures with half-formed feet or a half-formed wing. There are no examples of this in the fossil record. [7] Further, such transitional stages during the animal's adaptation period would not help it survive, but actually hurt it. For example, an animal that slowly evolves wings from appendages would become very awkward for climbing or grasping and so he would be made easy prey.

Philip Johnson brings out the ramifications of this: "In short, if evolution means the gradual change of one kind of organism into another kind, the outstanding characteristic of the fossil record is the absence of evidence for evolution." [8] Even if a few decent candidates for ancestor status to a species could be found, this would not be enough to rescue the theory of evolution, which acknowledges a world-wide history of continual development.

Because of the evidence of the fossil record, many scientists are abandoning the micro-mutation theory of Darwin (that evolution took place gradually through many favorable mutation s) in favor of the macro-mutation theory (that evolution occurred in sudden jumps, not gradually over long periods of time. This is what Steven Jay Gould argues for). However, the macro-mutation theory still requires many intermediate species--no one holds that one organism became another in a single generation. So the absence of any transitional forms still posses a problem. Additionally, it is just not likely that a structures as complex as an eye or a wing could have been produced only through mutations in the course of a few generations. There are definite bound aries within which mutations must operate: "...mutations are incapable of producing evolution because they cannot alter and effect the existing structure of genes: they cannot create new genetic material or new genetic potential." [9] Additionally, in order for evolution to occur rapidly, in the course of a few generations, there would need to be several large mutations in a short period of time. We have already seen that large, beneficial mutations are just not frequent enough to cause such "sudden changes."

Micro-mutationists do not accept that the fossil record disproves their theory, arguing that the transitional forms lived, but were not preserved. Thus, they say, evolution still happened through gradual processes over millions of years. Macro-mutationists also hold that their transitional forms were not preserved (since the transition occurred during such a short period of time). In other words, they are saying that the fossil record is not complete. However, many paleontologists are persuaded that the fossil record is complete. Further, it really doesn't matter whether it is complete or not. If it is complete, then the fossil record does not support evolution. If it is not complete, then what right do evolutionists have to fill these gaps with imaginary animals for which there is no evidence of their existence? Lastly, stasis (the absence of directional change in a species during its existence) is positive documentation that organisms remained as they were, and did not change into other organisms.

Since there are no transitional links and intermediate forms in the fossil record, there is no actual evidence that evolution has occurred.

The Problem of Probabilities
Carl Sagan (an evolutionist) and other prominent scientists have estimated the chance of man evolving at roughly 1 chance in 10 followed by two billion zeros. [10] According to Borel's law, anything beyond 1 chance in 10 followed by 50 zeros is impossible. [11] The infintesimal probability of evolution happening makes it impossible.

One Common Piece of Evidence for Evolution Investigated
A common evidence for evolution has been what used to be called the "biogenetic law." This states that the development of an organism's embryo reproduces the evolutionary development of that kind of animal. However, very few modern embryologists espouse this view today. Columbia University biologist Walter J. Bock concluded that this theory has "...been demonstrated to be wrong by numerous...scholars." [12] Professor C.H. Waddington said "The type of analogical thinking that leads to theories that development is based on the recapitulation of ancestral stages or the like no longer seems at all convincing or even very interesting to biologists." [13]

The Problem of the "Ape men"
Five transitional forms which were once considered to be ancestors of humans have been disproved. Nebraska man's existence was hypothesized on the basis of a single tooth, which was later shown to be a pig's tooth. Java man was found to be a gibbon, not an "ancestor" for man. Piltdown man was found to be a hoax in 1953; Australopithecines were found to be only ancient apes which never "evolved" into men; and both Neanderthal and Cro-Magnan man are Homo Sapiens themselves, and thus cannot be transitional forms for Homo Sapiens.
 
I have been pro-evolution for some time, but this article opens my eyes a little bit to the actual probabilities of the mutation theory.
 
I personally believe that we really don't know much about how we or anything on this planet came to be. Period.
 
Originally posted by: NL5
I personally believe that we really don't know much about how we or anything on this planet came to be. Period.

I guess it's easy to favor such an intellectually acquiescent stance than educate yourself. 🙂
 
Originally posted by: NL5
ummmm...WTF?

You can show how we got here? Wow! Please clarify.

You said "don't know much"; that shows that you've made absolutely no attempts to educate yourself. Just search for evolution in the forums, and you'll find plenty of resources to eludicate these matters at your leisure.

[edit]Typo[/edit]
 
Well, actually, I am educated in the field of Biology. The THEORY of evolution is full of holes, and how life started is still completely unproven.

I am not a creationist by any stretch, and would have to say if anything I believe in evolution. However, I believe that when all is said and done, the "proof" will vary dramatically from where the theory sits now. Furthermore, if we ever come to fully understand DNA, I think that alone will answer once and for all where we came from/how we came to be.
 
Hmmm... Let me address this part first. The theory of evolution IS regarded as fact by the scientific world. The first paragraph made me think that posting the article was just troll bait, but I don't think that's Edro's purpose here.

I didn't read the whole article, but I'll address two parts of it: "As Gould says, not only do most species just suddenly appear with no record of a long, gradual period of development,"
This person has absolutely no clue about the time spans being addressed. Suppose something gradually happened over a span of 20,000 years. To us, that would be a HUGE amount of time. But, in the geologic record, it's merely a blip. For only 1 example - for how many years were tyranosaurs on earth? Not a mere few thousand... a heck of a lot longer than that.

I refer you to just one species with a transitional record. Humans. Ever heard of the Lucy fossil? Now, find out how many fossils have been found of the same age. The answer is "we haven't found many." To think that even 1% of animals fossilize would be ridiculous.
 
What I like about this article is that it takes a very scientific and logical stance against existing evolutionary theories - but doesn't attempt to fill that in with more scientific (or religious) theories. As humans we'll never know everything, as scientists we need to admit that.

If evolution and mutations were to work, I would hypothesize that positive environmental conditions would encourage species population which would increase diversity, then negative environmental conditions would stress out the population where natural selection favored those with specialties for survival. Then at the peak of environmental distress, small groups would be forced to imbreed many generations - causing an increase in genetic mutations, additional chromosomes, cancers, etc. Then when the environmental conditions improved again, a sudden surge in population would stabilize genetic health, but by the time environmental stress weeded them out again - the last generations would look nothing like the first generations, forming different families and genuses, and possibly altered organs.

There is another far-fetched possibility - all animals are a product of retro-evolution. Maybe when the first single-cells came to be, the conditions that allowed RNA/DNA to replicate, also allowed it to increase in size exponentially - to the point we had this huge mutli-cell organism that was basically a bag of cancer, sucking up all the nutrients it could. Then over time it's offspring competed, and natural selection started forming specialized organs out of genetic combinations - of dna that already had all the code - just not in the right combination yet. So then this continued for millions of years, and eventually the differentiated life forms started shedding the excessive genetic code that was inactive.

So basically monkeys evolved from us. 😛 Okay I know that is a strange theory...
 
fiction
fiction again

The famous "keynote address" at the American Museum of Natural History in 1981 was nothing of the sort. It was a talk to the "Systematics Discussion Group" in the Museum, an (extremely) informal group. I had been asked to talk to them on "Evolutionism and creationism"; fired up by a paper by Ernst Mayr published in Science just the week before. I gave a fairly rumbustious talk, arguing that the theory of evolution had done more harm than good to biological systematics (classification). Unknown to me, there was a creationist in the audience with a hidden tape recorder. So much the worse for me. But my talk was addressed to professional systematists, and concerned systematics, nothing else.

in other words, his criticism was in regards to systematics only, and not on evolution as a whole. this talk was intentionally taken out of context by creationists.

all the points purported to be made against evolutoin are addressed in numerous books by dawkins and gould, go read up if you're interested.
 
Secondly... the probabilities. You CAN NOT USE PROBABILITIES to deny that something could happen if it happened. I don't know what Borel's law is, but if it's an actual law, it's being grossly misused. Example to prove it:

I could flip a coin...
I could roll the dice...

But to make this fast and quick, I'm going to make a 10 sided die, and number the sides 1 to 10.

I roll it once. it turns up a 2. The odds of that happening were 1 in 10.

I roll it twice. In order, it comes up 4, then 3. The odds of getting that combination in that order are 1 in 10 followed by another 0. (1 in 100)

Now, instead, I roll the die 52 times. The numbers that came up, and the order they come up in are:
2284725981235069871325908459873131698798436123409867

Now, according to you, that would have been impossible. The odds of that happening were 1 in 10 with 51 zeros after it. (and according to Borel, if you're referring to his work correctly)

Hopefully, I just proved the writer of that article is certifiably "Doesn't know what he's talking about."
 
Why would one be more predispotioned to believe a spiritual force made every single animal, insect and man right on down to each speck of sand on the beach? I don't claim to understand how we got here more than anyone else does but I find that theory rather inplausible as well.

Also, if there were not gradual changes in mankind why is it that we are growing taller and less hairy? This is not fiction but noted fact. If we are to hold to the theory that everything is created as it was and as it always will be why are we humans experiencing these changes? Why do people on Earth whom are exposed to intensely sunny climates have much darker skin than those who are not? Was it not adaptation or was it supposedly done by design by some unknown being?
 
A lot of bad logic here. Part of it seems to dispute evolution as a whole, other parts evolution as the origin of man, and yet still more parts evolution as the origin of parts of animals.

There is very little doubt that the process of natural selection exists. There is overwhelming evidence for this. This is intuitively obvious if you accept the principles of inheritance. What isn't obvious is how random mutations work. However, there is quite a lot of evidence that it DOES work, even if not at such a grand scale as to go from ectoplasm to eyeball.

The 99.9% figure as well as the "xxx argued blah blah" are very weak arguments based either on conjecture or assuming something has merit because someone says so. They also are snippets of information that may be taken out of context.

For example, Borel's "law" is not a law but a principle or rule of thumb. It exists on a sliding scale according to the phenomenon being observed. Furthermore, Borel himself, in his own book, discounted the applicability of his rules of thumb to the creation of life, by noting that the rules of matter and biology must be taken into account and may predispose life-forming matter in a way that makes referring to random chance meaningless. He uses the example of matter forming into crystals.

"It does not seem possible to apply the laws of probability calculus to the phenomenon of the formation of a crystal in a more or less supersaturated solution. At least, it would not be possible to treat this as a problem of probability without taking account of certain properties of matter, properties that facilitate the formation of crystals ..."

[ed: typos]
 
This is all glaring crap:
The Problem of Mutations
Natural selection (the mechanism of evolution) can only retain or destroy a characteristic that already exists

For example, the mathematician D.S. Ulam argued that "it was highly improbable that the eye could have evolved by the accumulation of small mutations, because the number of mutations would have to be so large and the time available was not nearly long enough for them to appear." [2] Famous astronomer Sir Fred Hoyle conceded that the chances that life just occurred on earth are about as unlikely as a "tornado sweeping thorough a junkyard and constructing a Boeing 747." [3]

The Problem of Probabilities
Carl Sagan (an evolutionist) and other prominent scientists have estimated the chance of man evolving at roughly 1 chance in 10 followed by two billion zeros. [10] According to Borel's law, anything beyond 1 chance in 10 followed by 50 zeros is impossible. [11] The infintesimal probability of evolution happening makes it impossible.

I'm going to stop here because i'm just plain sick of all these melangers who contort the english language to suit their arguments rather posit any sound analysis.
 
To tell you the truth I though it was a poinless article.
Just states that the evolution theory (micro and macro) are not very well founded.
Yet it does not go into any other possibilites of how we got the way we are now.
imo at least.
 
Originally posted by: PanzerIV
Why would one be more predispotioned to believe a spiritual force made every single animal, insect and man right on down to each speck of sand on the beach? I don't claim to understand how we got here more than anyone else does but I find that theory rather inplausible as well.

Also, if there were not gradual changes in mankind why is it that we are growing taller and less hairy? This is not fiction but noted fact. If we are to hold to the theory that everything is created as it was and as it always will be why are we humans experiencing these changes? Why do people on Earth whom are exposed to intensely sunny climates have much darker skin than those who are not? Was it not adaptation or was it supposedly done by design by some unknown being?

The main reason we are growing taller is a simple one.....Nutrition. It has steadily improved over the past several centuries.
 
Originally posted by: DrPizza
Secondly... the probabilities. You CAN NOT USE PROBABILITIES to deny that something could happen if it happened. I don't know what Borel's law is, but if it's an actual law, it's being grossly misused. Example to prove it:

I could flip a coin...
I could roll the dice...

But to make this fast and quick, I'm going to make a 10 sided die, and number the sides 1 to 10.

I roll it once. it turns up a 2. The odds of that happening were 1 in 10.

I roll it twice. In order, it comes up 4, then 3. The odds of getting that combination in that order are 1 in 10 followed by another 0. (1 in 100)

Now, instead, I roll the die 52 times. The numbers that came up, and the order they come up in are:
2284725981235069871325908459873131698798436123409867

Now, according to you, that would have been impossible. The odds of that happening were 1 in 10 with 51 zeros after it. (and according to Borel, if you're referring to his work correctly)

Hopefully, I just proved the writer of that article is certifiably "Doesn't know what he's talking about."


lol, just fantastic. 😉
 
Originally posted by: NL5
Originally posted by: PanzerIV
Why would one be more predispotioned to believe a spiritual force made every single animal, insect and man right on down to each speck of sand on the beach? I don't claim to understand how we got here more than anyone else does but I find that theory rather inplausible as well.

Also, if there were not gradual changes in mankind why is it that we are growing taller and less hairy? This is not fiction but noted fact. If we are to hold to the theory that everything is created as it was and as it always will be why are we humans experiencing these changes? Why do people on Earth whom are exposed to intensely sunny climates have much darker skin than those who are not? Was it not adaptation or was it supposedly done by design by some unknown being?

The main reason we are growing taller is a simple one.....Nutrition. It has steadily improved over the past several centuries.

Yeah that 67lbs of high fructose corn syrup I ingest yearly makes me tall ;-)
 
Originally posted by: Homerboy
Originally posted by: NL5
Originally posted by: PanzerIV
Why would one be more predispotioned to believe a spiritual force made every single animal, insect and man right on down to each speck of sand on the beach? I don't claim to understand how we got here more than anyone else does but I find that theory rather inplausible as well.

Also, if there were not gradual changes in mankind why is it that we are growing taller and less hairy? This is not fiction but noted fact. If we are to hold to the theory that everything is created as it was and as it always will be why are we humans experiencing these changes? Why do people on Earth whom are exposed to intensely sunny climates have much darker skin than those who are not? Was it not adaptation or was it supposedly done by design by some unknown being?

The main reason we are growing taller is a simple one.....Nutrition. It has steadily improved over the past several centuries.

Yeah that 67lbs of high fructose corn syrup I ingest yearly makes me tall ;-)

LOL.
 
Originally posted by: BullsOnParade
This is all glaring crap:
The Problem of Mutations
Natural selection (the mechanism of evolution) can only retain or destroy a characteristic that already exists

For example, the mathematician D.S. Ulam argued that "it was highly improbable that the eye could have evolved by the accumulation of small mutations, because the number of mutations would have to be so large and the time available was not nearly long enough for them to appear." [2] Famous astronomer Sir Fred Hoyle conceded that the chances that life just occurred on earth are about as unlikely as a "tornado sweeping thorough a junkyard and constructing a Boeing 747." [3]

The Problem of Probabilities
Carl Sagan (an evolutionist) and other prominent scientists have estimated the chance of man evolving at roughly 1 chance in 10 followed by two billion zeros. [10] According to Borel's law, anything beyond 1 chance in 10 followed by 50 zeros is impossible. [11] The infintesimal probability of evolution happening makes it impossible.

I'm going to stop here because i'm just plain sick of all these melangers who contort the english language to suit their arguments rather posit any sound analysis.

Yeah.. The odds don't matter. The fact is we are here. If we weren't here, we wouldn't be looking at the odds would we? ANY SPECIES looking at its own probability of existence is going to say "isn't it wonderful that we are here?". So there's a 100% chance of a scientific species recognizing the small probability of its existence...
 
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