Glad I am not the only one who thinks this

[tm37]

Ripped from Ben Maller.com

Still happy the chargers got LT/Brees.

 

[Ilmater]

Thank you, thank you for showing this to me. Vick is a worthless pile of sh1t. One day Atlanta will realize they wasted their time with him, and they'll be stuck with a franchise built around a guy who can't even do what he's supposed to do, PASS.

I LOVED when Atlanta was down quite a bit to Philly in the NFC championship game. "Hey, I know how to come back... just PASS THE BALL! What? You can't hit the broad side of a barn? Too bad."

I hate you Mike Vick. You're not a QB, you're a glorified track star.

 

[Double Trouble]

I've always enjoyed watching Vick, he's pretty much the most exciting player in the league when he starts running around. However, as a quarterback, he's mediocre at best. He can't consistenly throw the ball, and when defenses keep him in the pocket (Philly), the game is over for him. Luckily for him, the Falcons had a great running game and "D" this year so they got all the way to the NFC championship game, but Vick will have to learn to use his arm more than his feet.

Good article.....:thumbsup:

 

[RedRooster]

Good article, although I'd put forth that he could still be a Superbowl winning QB doing what he's doing now without drastically improving his passing game(although it would still need work) like the article infers. It's not so much that he can't throw, it's that his "vision" isn't nearly what it needs to be, and much of that comes with time/experience. Since he runs so much, he's had very little experience actually learning to read defenses and coverages. Partially the offensive co-ordinator's fault, and partially the fact that he's probably never had anyone whose been similar to him(Steve Young comes to mind) actually sit down and try to teach him anything.
By saying that he HAS to stop running to become a better quarterback is a stretch by this author, since I think with a bonafide #1 reciever(who can actually get open) and most definately a real quarterback coach/mentor, he could be an all around QB. The likes of which the league would never see again most definately.
He was basically playing with one reciever(a slow TE at that) and two runningbacks this year. Nobody has won anything with two RBs and a TE either.

He's going to have to learn quick though, his window is getting smaller by the year. 3 or 4 more years and he'll be peaking, having to run way less because of the obvious injuries, and if he can't "play QB" by then he's going to be an overpaid franchise no doubt. Who knows, maybe the west coast might click in his head this off-season, and he'll throw for 3500 next year.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Excellent article. I agree 100%. :thumbsup:

 

[tm37]

Originally posted by: RedRooster
Good article, although I'd put forth that he could still be a Superbowl winning QB doing what he's doing now without drastically improving his passing game(although it would still need work) like the article infers. It's not so much that he can't throw, it's that his "vision" isn't nearly what it needs to be, and much of that comes with time/experience. Since he runs so much, he's had very little experience actually learning to read defenses and coverages. Partially the offensive co-ordinator's fault, and partially the fact that he's probably never had anyone whose been similar to him(Steve Young comes to mind) actually sit down and try to teach him anything.
By saying that he HAS to stop running to become a better quarterback is a stretch by this author, since I think with a bonafide #1 reciever(who can actually get open) and most definately a real quarterback coach/mentor, he could be an all around QB. The likes of which the league would never see again most definately.
He was basically playing with one reciever(a slow TE at that) and two runningbacks this year. Nobody has won anything with two RBs and a TE either.

He's going to have to learn quick though, his window is getting smaller by the year. 3 or 4 more years and he'll be peaking, having to run way less because of the obvious injuries, and if he can't "play QB" by then he's going to be an overpaid franchise no doubt. Who knows, maybe the west coast might click in his head this off-season, and he'll throw for 3500 next year.

Steve Young has worked with him in the off season and while I agree he does not need to stop running he needs to be a better passer. To often he will rely on his legs and the average lenth of time in the NFL for a RB is only like 2.5 years or some thing. He will be forced to learn to pass IF they keep him in the pocket. Steve young was deadly because of his passing but the tachtics that NE used on manning would have not worked with young as he could run. He was pass first run second and had a good feel for the game.

If Vick has to make 2 reads he is done he runs, Tampa has proved that if you force him to throw you will beat him most of the time. All to often teams are afraid he is going to break the big one But he plays like a rookie. force him to make mistakes and he will.

 

[RedRooster]

Originally posted by: tm37

Originally posted by: RedRooster
Good article, although I'd put forth that he could still be a Superbowl winning QB doing what he's doing now without drastically improving his passing game(although it would still need work) like the article infers. It's not so much that he can't throw, it's that his "vision" isn't nearly what it needs to be, and much of that comes with time/experience. Since he runs so much, he's had very little experience actually learning to read defenses and coverages. Partially the offensive co-ordinator's fault, and partially the fact that he's probably never had anyone whose been similar to him(Steve Young comes to mind) actually sit down and try to teach him anything.
By saying that he HAS to stop running to become a better quarterback is a stretch by this author, since I think with a bonafide #1 reciever(who can actually get open) and most definately a real quarterback coach/mentor, he could be an all around QB. The likes of which the league would never see again most definately.
He was basically playing with one reciever(a slow TE at that) and two runningbacks this year. Nobody has won anything with two RBs and a TE either.

He's going to have to learn quick though, his window is getting smaller by the year. 3 or 4 more years and he'll be peaking, having to run way less because of the obvious injuries, and if he can't "play QB" by then he's going to be an overpaid franchise no doubt. Who knows, maybe the west coast might click in his head this off-season, and he'll throw for 3500 next year.

Steve Young has worked with him in the off season and while I agree he does not need to stop running he needs to be a better passer. To often he will rely on his legs and the average lenth of time in the NFL for a RB is only like 2.5 years or some thing. He will be forced to learn to pass IF they keep him in the pocket. Steve young was deadly because of his passing but the tachtics that NE used on manning would have not worked with young as he could run. He was pass first run second and had a good feel for the game.

If Vick has to make 2 reads he is done he runs, Tampa has proved that if you force him to throw you will beat him most of the time. All to often teams are afraid he is going to break the big one But he plays like a rookie. force him to make mistakes and he will.

I agree, making him throw to that putrid recieving corp right now is the best way to beat them. I think by trying to implement the west coast is how they're going to fix this, and a good first step, which'll allow him to do the only thing that will make him better. And that's to throw more short high percentage passes which don't require four reads to find. Something like the all slants play IND runs, or screens or something which don't require him to throw 50 yards to a double teamed #3 reciever would certainly help his confidence and his passing%. Yards don't matter, if you can complete 60-65% of your passes even if they're within 5 yards of the scrimmage line things are going to happen.
It almost seems like he's still a rookie when it comes to throwing, everything is frantic and if he didn't have legs he'd be pretty much like Eli and his situation still.
Running two backs and a rushing offense isn't going to make him any better, that's for sure. Hopefully this year taught him something. I doubt it, but I still like the guy and see loads of potential.

 

[jjones]

He's just another Crudell Stewart. Vicki fans just hang in there, I remember hearing all of the same things about Crudell that I hear about Vick now, and look what Crudell achieved... oh wait... he didn't achieve anything.

 

[RedRooster]

Originally posted by: jjones
He's just another Crudell Stewart. Vicki fans just hang in there, I remember hearing all of the same things about Crudell that I hear about Vick now, and look what Crudell achieved... oh wait... he didn't achieve anything.

It's not even on the same level.
Vick is producing, Kordell never did.

 

[MrChad]

Well, let's look at the last three seasons.

2002 (with Vick): 9-6-1, made playoffs, lost in Division championship
2003 (without Vick): 5-11, missed playoffs
2004 (with Vick): 11-5, made playoffs, lost in NFC championship

That speaks pretty well for Vick. Atlanta seems to be a better team with him than without him.

 

[jjones]

Originally posted by: RedRooster

Originally posted by: jjones
He's just another Crudell Stewart. Vicki fans just hang in there, I remember hearing all of the same things about Crudell that I hear about Vick now, and look what Crudell achieved... oh wait... he didn't achieve anything.

It's not even on the same level.
Vick is producing, Kordell never did.

He may have better legs than Crudell, which is serving him for the moment, but he is still as sh!tty a passer and has just as sh!tty judgement as Crudell. And just like Crudell, pretty soon he won't be able to rely on his legs.

Edit: oh, and by the way, Crudell took the Steelers to the AFC Championship twice, and had a 46-29 record with the Steelers, so I think you can call that producing.

 

[Nitemare]

Originally posted by: Ilmater
Thank you, thank you for showing this to me. Vick is a worthless pile of sh1t. One day Atlanta will realize they wasted their time with him, and they'll be stuck with a franchise built around a guy who can't even do what he's supposed to do, PASS.

I LOVED when Atlanta was down quite a bit to Philly in the NFC championship game. "Hey, I know how to come back... just PASS THE BALL! What? You can't hit the broad side of a barn? Too bad."

I hate you Mike Vick. You're not a QB, you're a glorified track star.

Call him what he is, a great running tailback who lines up behind center who has trouble not fumbling.

Barry Sanderish type legs, Ahman Green fumbling ability, and John Madden's throwing ability

 

[RedRooster]

Originally posted by: jjones

Originally posted by: RedRooster

Originally posted by: jjones
He's just another Crudell Stewart. Vicki fans just hang in there, I remember hearing all of the same things about Crudell that I hear about Vick now, and look what Crudell achieved... oh wait... he didn't achieve anything.

It's not even on the same level.
Vick is producing, Kordell never did.

He may have better legs than Crudell, which is serving him for the moment, but he is still as sh!tty a passer and has just as sh!tty judgement as Crudell. And just like Crudell, pretty soon he won't be able to rely on his legs.

Edit: oh, and by the way, Crudell took the Steelers to the AFC Championship twice, and had a 46-29 record with the Steelers, so I think you can call that producing.

If everyone gave up on 24 year olds with 2 years of experience under their belts, like you do, we'd sure have a mess of Kurt Warner's throwing the ball in the NFL nowadays. We'll see where Vick is at in 10 years, and then we can compare to Kordell if you want. But the start of his career has been far more impressive and important to the game as a whole than Kordell's career ever could be. Times 10.

 

[SP33Demon]

I think Vick will be a good to great passer with more exp. Much like the McNabb transformation, Vick will have to evolve to have more patience and better smarts vs defensive schemes.

 

[nitsuj3580]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
I think Vick will be a good to great passer with more exp. Much like the McNabb transformation, Vick will have to evolve to have more patience and better smarts vs defensive schemes.

I agree. I'm the biggest McNabb fan there is (he was at Syracuse when I was there, best 4 years of 'Cuse football) but Vick is not that far off from him.

I would be curious how well Vick would do if he got a big time receiver. Look what TO did for McNabb. Much like McNabb in the past, Vick has no one to throw to yet still took his team to the NFC title game. If they can get a big time receiver, I think Vick's passing stats will soar dramatically.

 

[geno]

I agree with the article somewhat. Most people either see him as superman, or a worthless sideshow. He's a below average throwing quaterback who picks up nearly RB-level yardage per game. He's a different breed of QB, people want to compare his passing stats (which like I said are below average) to the likes of Peyton Manning. However, he's proven that the scrambling quaterback isn't as safe as your normal QB, look at all the injuries he's had every season.

He definitely is way overrated, however the media is catching on and I don't see that happening too much anymore. My take is this: He's as effective overall as an average NFL quarterback, but nothing amazing like Brady/Manning. His glamorous acrobatics don't make him a better QB, and until he learns to make use of his receivers, he'll remain in the land of mediocrity to me.

 

[PoPPeR]

yep. All the higher ups in the NFL are idiots. They obviously have no idea how to run a football team. All those scouts and advisors and stuff? Idiots

 

[TheNinja]

Let's break it down:

Bads:
Trouble reading Defenses
Nobody to throw to except Crumpler
Gives up on the pass too early and takes off running

Goods:
Insanely fast so it keeps defenses scared that he'll run
Cannon for an arm
Puts people in the seats and brings $$$ to the team/league


I'd say give him another year or two and see if his "bads" have been addressed. If he hasn't improved these in the next 2 years, then I'll give up and call him a glorified running back. But for now I'll give him a chance.

 

[AmigaMan]

I hear Moss is looking for a new team...wonder if a Moss/Vick combo would work as well as the TO/McNabb combo worked. Although, as a Panthers Fan, I hope Vick breaks his legs again for next season...

 

[rh71]

I have never really watched him until I watched the Philly game last week... he was horrendous at passing... not even accurate most times and the Eagles were mostly using a run defense. I thought to myself... the hype about him must be his running ability/agility... big deal.

 

[Queasy]

Oh dear Lord. Vick has played all of two full seasons and an odd smattering of games and this was his first season in the west coast offense. His statistics are comparable to Donovan McNabb's at the same point in his career.

Give the Falcons offense another year or two to develop and I imagine Vick will do just fine. They've got one of the best general managers in the game so they're going to be busy trying to get weapons to put around Vick and an offensive line that can block for him.

If you watched the NFC Championship game you'll notice that McNabb had all day to sit in the pocket and throw the ball most of the time while the Eagles were able put pressure on Vick with just four defensive lineman.

 

[Anonemous]

Originally posted by: Nitemare

Originally posted by: Ilmater
Thank you, thank you for showing this to me. Vick is a worthless pile of sh1t. One day Atlanta will realize they wasted their time with him, and they'll be stuck with a franchise built around a guy who can't even do what he's supposed to do, PASS.

I LOVED when Atlanta was down quite a bit to Philly in the NFC championship game. "Hey, I know how to come back... just PASS THE BALL! What? You can't hit the broad side of a barn? Too bad."

I hate you Mike Vick. You're not a QB, you're a glorified track star.

Call him what he is, a great running tailback who lines up behind center who has trouble not fumbling.

Barry Sanderish type legs, Ahman Green fumbling ability, and John Madden's throwing ability

lol he's a hybrid!