Get rid of garbage on a SSD running Vista?
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I like to do a SE and start off fresh with a new install.
Most of the smarter people will just use the Windows diskpart clean command.
From what I read a SE is a ssd command that resets every cell to empty or the way it came from the factory.
The diskkpart clear command deletes the configuration information at the start and end of drive and leaves it to the garbage collection of firmware to cleans the rest.
Most of the smarter people will just use the Windows diskpart clean command.
From what I read a SE is a ssd command that resets every cell to empty or the way it came from the factory.
The diskkpart clear command deletes the configuration information at the start and end of drive and leaves it to the garbage collection of firmware to cleans the rest.
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If there is toolbox made for your your ssd mfg intel samsung then there is no problem.
Then you can use the toolbox software to secure erase your ssd which is fairly simple process.
Some SSDs wont supply supply toolkits example my Seagate 600.
No toolkit then you are forced to use a 3rd parties software which I would save for a last resort only.
razel
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Feel free to reinstall Vista without having to worry about anything. Your SSD can take care of itself.
The clean command in diskpart is useful for those who have pooched their partition layout or boot records and want a clean layout. Secure erase is useful prior to selling your SSD to ensure everything is erased.
Performance wise, unless you are a tech site investigating TRIM issues or how well SSD controllers do garbage collection, I don't worry about it.
The clean command in diskpart is useful for those who have pooched their partition layout or boot records and want a clean layout. Secure erase is useful prior to selling your SSD to ensure everything is erased.
Performance wise, unless you are a tech site investigating TRIM issues or how well SSD controllers do garbage collection, I don't worry about it.
Cerb
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No, they won't. Just like in the last thread, that does nothing for this. Diskpart clean removes partition and bootloader info, so you won't get NTLDR is missing (when you know it's not), or an infinite repeat of, "GRUB " all over, or a GRUB error (I mean, I installed, Windows, what is GRUB still doing anywhere on the drive, right?).
All the SSD sees when that happens are a few sectors being written over with zeroes (well, probably zeroes, but still, written over with data), no different than any other sectors on the drive.
If your SSD was performing well enough for you at the time, don't worry about it.
So all clean command does is does is remove the GRUB from the hard drive's MBR correct.
Cerb
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That's just an example. What the OP's looking for is to TRIM the whole drive. Diskpart clean just removes the tables with partition info. In Windows 7 or newer, this should also cause a TRIM over the whole drive. Vista and older don't support that feature.
Sunburn74
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Most modern drives have some form of garbage collection. To have garbage collection kick in you need idle time where there is no SSD activity. Garbage collection is independent of the OS.
1) Do your install or whatever you want
2) Overnight leave a motherboard bios page up. Garbage collection should occur slowly trimming your drive overnight. (Crucial reps have stated you actually only need about 30 mins, but I'm not sure this is true of all SSDs)
Do this every now and then. I used to do it maybe once every 6 months. The so called write penalties from non-trim environments are really overblown. Sure they show up in benchmarks, but in real world use, you'll probably never notice these penalties at all.
1) Do your install or whatever you want
2) Overnight leave a motherboard bios page up. Garbage collection should occur slowly trimming your drive overnight. (Crucial reps have stated you actually only need about 30 mins, but I'm not sure this is true of all SSDs)
Do this every now and then. I used to do it maybe once every 6 months. The so called write penalties from non-trim environments are really overblown. Sure they show up in benchmarks, but in real world use, you'll probably never notice these penalties at all.
Cerb
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1. All SSDs have GC. It's a part of the wear leveling process necessary for correct functioning with p/e cycles that keep getting lower.
2. Idle time needs vary by drive. Many need none, and almost all new ones are in that category. Also, many seem to handle themselves well without any, given light usage for awhile. The Samsung 840 Pro and Evo, FI, can be brought down to quite low write speeds with relative ease, but even in a notebook, with no meaningful idle time, recover over some hours of light use.
If the OP has a very old drive, like a C300, or something, moving to a new SSD would not be a bad idea. The M500, 840 Evo, Ultra Plus, Extreme II, 600, and some others, too, handle themselves quite well with light use, even without TRIM. Fresh performance won't be much improved from an older drive, but performance over time will be greatly improved.
2. Idle time needs vary by drive. Many need none, and almost all new ones are in that category. Also, many seem to handle themselves well without any, given light usage for awhile. The Samsung 840 Pro and Evo, FI, can be brought down to quite low write speeds with relative ease, but even in a notebook, with no meaningful idle time, recover over some hours of light use.
If the OP has a very old drive, like a C300, or something, moving to a new SSD would not be a bad idea. The M500, 840 Evo, Ultra Plus, Extreme II, 600, and some others, too, handle themselves quite well with light use, even without TRIM. Fresh performance won't be much improved from an older drive, but performance over time will be greatly improved.
harobikes333
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Charlie98
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I'm running XP on my daughter's laptop with an 840Pro... I run GC about once a month and it's golden. I'd roll with it... :biggrin:
harobikes333
Platinum Member
Yeah...? I haven't done anything with the SSD as of yet... I take it the SDD comes with software that would correct any TRIM related issues, etc if ran monthly...?
Sunburn74
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There is no special software. SSDs perform garbage collection at the level of the drive. All it needs is idle time. The operating system doesn't need to be up (in other words, it doesn't matter what your operating system is). Its unclear how much idle time exactly is needed to restore a drive to near peak condition. Maybe 30 mins, maybe 10 hours. I don't think anyone really fully knows and it probably varies from drive to drive.
All I can say is, you leave your PC on overnight with the mobo bios page up, you will have effectively trimmed that drive. How frequently you want to do that is up to you. I personally did it once per 6 months when I didn't have access to TRIM. Even after I gained TRIM I noticed no significant real world performance difference on my vertex 3s.
EDIT:
Actually this study by Xbit labs answers the question perfectly. They test several drives in new, full, after 30 mins of garbage collection in a non-TRIM enabled environmetn, and after exposure to a TRIM environment
As you can see for some drives all you need is 30 mins of idle time for garbage collection to equal having TRIM. Some drives however 30 mins gets you some significant garbage collection, but not as much as being able to run a TRIM command.
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/storage/display/samsung-840-evo_6.html#sect0
Like I said before, probably just leaving a PC overnight will absolutely fully get your drive back to peak condition
All I can say is, you leave your PC on overnight with the mobo bios page up, you will have effectively trimmed that drive. How frequently you want to do that is up to you. I personally did it once per 6 months when I didn't have access to TRIM. Even after I gained TRIM I noticed no significant real world performance difference on my vertex 3s.
EDIT:
Actually this study by Xbit labs answers the question perfectly. They test several drives in new, full, after 30 mins of garbage collection in a non-TRIM enabled environmetn, and after exposure to a TRIM environment
As you can see for some drives all you need is 30 mins of idle time for garbage collection to equal having TRIM. Some drives however 30 mins gets you some significant garbage collection, but not as much as being able to run a TRIM command.
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/storage/display/samsung-840-evo_6.html#sect0
Like I said before, probably just leaving a PC overnight will absolutely fully get your drive back to peak condition
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Cerb
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Except that the drive does not get TRIM without TRIM, and each, as you can see, behaves differently. Some will do better than that benchmarks shows, while some no better. Some will need to be used, rather than idle, to gain performance back, not doing much until they need to erase and write anyway. Others, like the SF drives, never reach peak performance again, without a secure erase.
Just leaving it overnight, or however long, assumes behavior that you don't know exists, without knowing the specific drive in question. The only sure way to get SSDs back to peak is a secure erase, without narrowing down what SSD it is.
The best thing to do is buy an SSD with reasonably good steady state performance. If it can maintain acceptable performance after filled with random writes, anything else can be just a nice bonus.
Just leaving it overnight, or however long, assumes behavior that you don't know exists, without knowing the specific drive in question. The only sure way to get SSDs back to peak is a secure erase, without narrowing down what SSD it is.
The best thing to do is buy an SSD with reasonably good steady state performance. If it can maintain acceptable performance after filled with random writes, anything else can be just a nice bonus.
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norseamd
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Cerb
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Charlie98
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Many (most?) SSDs include or have available a 'toolbox' of some sort that do various tasks, Samsung's probably being the most comprehensive. I have experience with Samsung, Intel and Plextor's utilities... the Samsung and Intel tools have a manual TRIM utility, the Plextor does not.
Because XP does not support TRIM, the Samsung SSD I put in works well because I can manually TRIM the drive; I thought Vista supported TRIM...?
Charlie98
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norseamd
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I still use the 256GB C300s and they still give great performance.
While they have no TRIM the less space taken by OS & programs allows GC time to work even when the drive is in use.
While they have no TRIM the less space taken by OS & programs allows GC time to work even when the drive is in use.
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