"GeForce And Radeon Take On Linux"

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
This is an article about how the latest cards perform with Linux.

http://www.tomshardware.com/2006/07/12/...ce_and_radeon_take_on_linux/index.html

The bottom line is that the top-of-the-line graphics cards from both ATI and Nvidia do work (and work well) with Linux. While Nvidia currently exposes more of its underlying card capabilities under Linux than does ATI, the latter has made significant strides. Beyond simply getting its X1000-series and other recent graphics card families to work in Linux environments, ATI is still negotiating with top-tier Linux distributions to incorporate its proprietary drivers into mainstream products. At the same time, the Linux gaming community is getting a major boost from continued support and development efforts from both parties. Mere months ago, much of this capability was nonexistent.

Personally I use a 7800GT now and some games like Quake 3 and Wolfenstein: ET run great. I've also tried UT2004. Visual quality is equal, and all that is left is for game companies to release binaries for Linux (and perhaps make the control panels as good as the Windows ones).
 

josh6079

Diamond Member
Mar 17, 2006
3,261
0
0
Good to hear! It's always good when companies try to branch out to fit more of the consumers needs. Personally, I'm not comfortable with moving away from old familiar Windows yet, but maybe if Linux continues to get further support in these areas it will be a possibility. ATI seems to be getting into shape with their OpenGL performance increases and now Linux, closer competition such as this just means better products for us!! Just curious, what is Linux doing about DX10? I know Vista will have it, but what about Linux? Will it have to install DX10 on it or what?
 

postmortemIA

Diamond Member
Jul 11, 2006
7,721
40
91
That article doesn't seem too credible. First, most users stil moan about ATi's linux drivers. Second, the author doesn't seem to be an exactly Linux guru - maybe for purpose, but screenshots are form freshly installed Fedora Core with ugliest font ever. Third, he hasn't shown the powerful nVIDIA control panel, rather some overclocking tool.
 

schneiderguy

Lifer
Jun 26, 2006
10,801
91
91
Originally posted by: josh6079
Good to hear! It's always good when companies try to branch out to fit more of the consumers needs. Personally, I'm not comfortable with moving away from old familiar Windows yet, but maybe if Linux continues to get further support in these areas it will be a possibility. ATI seems to be getting into shape with their OpenGL performance increases and now Linux, closer competition such as this just means better products for us!! Just curious, what is Linux doing about DX10? I know Vista will have it, but what about Linux? Will it have to install DX10 on it or what?

linux + directx = :confused:
 

josh6079

Diamond Member
Mar 17, 2006
3,261
0
0
Originally posted by: schneiderguy
Originally posted by: josh6079
Good to hear! It's always good when companies try to branch out to fit more of the consumers needs. Personally, I'm not comfortable with moving away from old familiar Windows yet, but maybe if Linux continues to get further support in these areas it will be a possibility. ATI seems to be getting into shape with their OpenGL performance increases and now Linux, closer competition such as this just means better products for us!! Just curious, what is Linux doing about DX10? I know Vista will have it, but what about Linux? Will it have to install DX10 on it or what?

linux + directx = :confused:

Oh really? Linux doesn't use DX?
 

schneiderguy

Lifer
Jun 26, 2006
10,801
91
91
Originally posted by: josh6079
Originally posted by: schneiderguy
Originally posted by: josh6079
Good to hear! It's always good when companies try to branch out to fit more of the consumers needs. Personally, I'm not comfortable with moving away from old familiar Windows yet, but maybe if Linux continues to get further support in these areas it will be a possibility. ATI seems to be getting into shape with their OpenGL performance increases and now Linux, closer competition such as this just means better products for us!! Just curious, what is Linux doing about DX10? I know Vista will have it, but what about Linux? Will it have to install DX10 on it or what?

linux + directx = :confused:

Oh really? Linux doesn't use DX?

nope it only supports openGL afaik :)
 

TanisHalfElven

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2001
3,512
0
76
Originally posted by: postmortemIA
That article doesn't seem too credible. First, most users stil moan about ATi's linux drivers. Second, the author doesn't seem to be an exactly Linux guru - maybe for purpose, but screenshots are form freshly installed Fedora Core with ugliest font ever. Third, he hasn't shown the powerful nVIDIA control panel, rather some overclocking tool.


its now really easy to install ati drivers for linux. took me 4 commands to do it in ubuntu.
it almost robotic.

 

josh6079

Diamond Member
Mar 17, 2006
3,261
0
0
Originally posted by: schneiderguy
Originally posted by: josh6079
Originally posted by: schneiderguy
Originally posted by: josh6079
Good to hear! It's always good when companies try to branch out to fit more of the consumers needs. Personally, I'm not comfortable with moving away from old familiar Windows yet, but maybe if Linux continues to get further support in these areas it will be a possibility. ATI seems to be getting into shape with their OpenGL performance increases and now Linux, closer competition such as this just means better products for us!! Just curious, what is Linux doing about DX10? I know Vista will have it, but what about Linux? Will it have to install DX10 on it or what?

linux + directx = :confused:

Oh really? Linux doesn't use DX?

nope it only supports openGL afaik :)

Well ya learn something new everyday. Thanks.
 

redbox

Golden Member
Nov 12, 2005
1,021
0
0
Originally posted by: schneiderguy
Originally posted by: josh6079
Originally posted by: schneiderguy
Originally posted by: josh6079
Good to hear! It's always good when companies try to branch out to fit more of the consumers needs. Personally, I'm not comfortable with moving away from old familiar Windows yet, but maybe if Linux continues to get further support in these areas it will be a possibility. ATI seems to be getting into shape with their OpenGL performance increases and now Linux, closer competition such as this just means better products for us!! Just curious, what is Linux doing about DX10? I know Vista will have it, but what about Linux? Will it have to install DX10 on it or what?

linux + directx = :confused:

Oh really? Linux doesn't use DX?

nope it only supports openGL afaik :)

Is there something about linux that would make it impossible to add DX support? I know DX10 is bundled with Vista but that wasn't always the case with DX was it? I just don't know the logistics of it but I wouldn't have any problem playing games on a linux box if the support was there I kinda liked the os last time I used it.
 

Cookie Monster

Diamond Member
May 7, 2005
5,161
32
86
Linux and OpenGL doesnt mix very well for ATi..

But its good to hear that their getting there. However, who does use linux nowadays? 5% of the entire PC users?

 

Sc4freak

Guest
Oct 22, 2004
953
0
0
Originally posted by: redbox
Originally posted by: schneiderguy
Originally posted by: josh6079
Originally posted by: schneiderguy
Originally posted by: josh6079
Good to hear! It's always good when companies try to branch out to fit more of the consumers needs. Personally, I'm not comfortable with moving away from old familiar Windows yet, but maybe if Linux continues to get further support in these areas it will be a possibility. ATI seems to be getting into shape with their OpenGL performance increases and now Linux, closer competition such as this just means better products for us!! Just curious, what is Linux doing about DX10? I know Vista will have it, but what about Linux? Will it have to install DX10 on it or what?

linux + directx = :confused:

Oh really? Linux doesn't use DX?

nope it only supports openGL afaik :)

Is there something about linux that would make it impossible to add DX support? I know DX10 is bundled with Vista but that wasn't always the case with DX was it? I just don't know the logistics of it but I wouldn't have any problem playing games on a linux box if the support was there I kinda liked the os last time I used it.

I'd like to see you go up to Microsoft and say, "Hey, can I have source code and documentation for DirectX? You know, so I can implement it into Linux, which happens to be your only major PC OS competitor..."
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
Originally posted by: josh6079
Good to hear! It's always good when companies try to branch out to fit more of the consumers needs. Personally, I'm not comfortable with moving away from old familiar Windows yet, but maybe if Linux continues to get further support in these areas it will be a possibility. ATI seems to be getting into shape with their OpenGL performance increases and now Linux, closer competition such as this just means better products for us!! Just curious, what is Linux doing about DX10? I know Vista will have it, but what about Linux? Will it have to install DX10 on it or what?

Linux doesn't have DirectX but I don't think a new architecture has been proposed. They will likely just continue adding extensions to OpenGL. As for Cedega TransGaming and WINE, I have no clue what they're going to do about it. They have a lot of work to do to reroute DX10 calls to OpenGL/direct ones, especially when the fundamental driver architecture has changed.

Originally posted by: sandorski
What Linux needs is not to be a total PITA!!

It sure isn't for me. In fact, I prefer Linux now after using it for a while. It's so much easier to fix things. As a matter of fact I can't stand XP anymore now, even after using it since it's been out. Dual-boot is the ideal situation for a gamer.

Right now the control panel has a thermal monitor, some basic AA/AF force adjustments, and various vertical synchronization (sync to VBlank for texture, sync to VBlank for blitter).

I don't view Linux as a gaming platform quite yet (that is, if I have to pay for emulation (TransGaming) to make it supported). Plus I prefer to keep my software GPL-based and avoid closed-source whenever possible. That said, if the next Return to Castle Wolfenstein has a Linux version you can bet I'll be using Linux for it and not Windows. The regular open-source wine is usually too hard to configure, and you'll likely run into speedbumps along the way.

If games use libSDL (cross-platform), it's very easy to port games. The main problem is the rendering engine. The actual logic and physics code remains the same, and can be complied with the gcc C compiler just like VC++ on Windows. That is not the problem. The issue is that Linux has no native support for DX and people keep coding games under DX instead of a cross-platform library. Many games have Linux server support but no Linux client support, like BF2 and Prey.
 

R3MF

Senior member
Oct 19, 2004
656
0
0
Originally posted by: redbox

Is there something about linux that would make it impossible to add DX support? I know DX10 is bundled with Vista but that wasn't always the case with DX was it? I just don't know the logistics of it but I wouldn't have any problem playing games on a linux box if the support was there I kinda liked the os last time I used it.

not really, and there is no need either.

Linux uses OpenGL, which currently resides at version 2. once the majority of hardware is v2 compliant the will introduce v2 Pure and fade out v2 compatibility if i understood an OpenGL 2 white paper a couple of years back.
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
I'm not sure why OpenGL is not more used. Does Direct3D support something that OpenGL doesn't?
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
12,974
0
71
I (and many) actually found it easier to start on OpenGL than Direct3D but I suppose it varies. D3D is more object-oriented and likely more what modern C++ programmers are used to. I just wondered if D3D supported any shader capabilities that the OpenGL extensions couldn't provide.
 

redbox

Golden Member
Nov 12, 2005
1,021
0
0
Originally posted by: R3MF
Originally posted by: redbox

Is there something about linux that would make it impossible to add DX support? I know DX10 is bundled with Vista but that wasn't always the case with DX was it? I just don't know the logistics of it but I wouldn't have any problem playing games on a linux box if the support was there I kinda liked the os last time I used it.

not really, and there is no need either.

Linux uses OpenGL, which currently resides at version 2. once the majority of hardware is v2 compliant the will introduce v2 Pure and fade out v2 compatibility if i understood an OpenGL 2 white paper a couple of years back.

ya I guess there really isn't a need for it I just wanted to know if it could be done. I doubt though that microsoft would be so cool with it.
 

aka1nas

Diamond Member
Aug 30, 2001
4,335
1
0
Originally posted by: xtknight
I'm not sure why OpenGL is not more used. Does Direct3D support something that OpenGL doesn't?

OpenGL has had a rough time getting new technologies like shaders implemented into the standard API in a timely manner. Mainly this has to do with the fact that it is an API designed by commitee, with all the plusses and minuses that entails. MS has managed to be more aggressive with adding new features to DirectX and has managed to swing a lot of developers to coding in DirectX only.
 

bersl2

Golden Member
Aug 2, 2004
1,617
0
0
Originally posted by: aka1nas
Originally posted by: xtknight
I'm not sure why OpenGL is not more used. Does Direct3D support something that OpenGL doesn't?

OpenGL has had a rough time getting new technologies like shaders implemented into the standard API in a timely manner. Mainly this has to do with the fact that it is an API designed by commitee, with all the plusses and minuses that entails. MS has managed to be more aggressive with adding new features to DirectX and has managed to swing a lot of developers to coding in DirectX only.

OpenGL has a system of extensions whereby those who implement OpenGL can add new operations outside of the core. Although this leads to many extensions that do the same thing, a library such GLEW and a little bit of simplifying abstraction can make drawing operations seamless; and unlike with D3D, IIRC, OpenGL operations are permitted to be implemented in software, so that fallback for simple operations is possible. Basically, OpenGL lets hardware companies be hardware companies instead of being design slaves to a single software behemoth.
 

tuteja1986

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2005
3,676
0
0
Originally posted by: bersl2
Originally posted by: aka1nas
Originally posted by: xtknight
I'm not sure why OpenGL is not more used. Does Direct3D support something that OpenGL doesn't?

OpenGL has had a rough time getting new technologies like shaders implemented into the standard API in a timely manner. Mainly this has to do with the fact that it is an API designed by commitee, with all the plusses and minuses that entails. MS has managed to be more aggressive with adding new features to DirectX and has managed to swing a lot of developers to coding in DirectX only.

OpenGL has a system of extensions whereby those who implement OpenGL can add new operations outside of the core. Although this leads to many extensions that do the same thing, a library such GLEW and a little bit of simplifying abstraction can make drawing operations seamless; and unlike with D3D, IIRC, OpenGL operations are permitted to be implemented in software, so that fallback for simple operations is possible. Basically, OpenGL lets hardware companies be hardware companies instead of being design slaves to a single software behemoth.

Thats a lie :(
 

bersl2

Golden Member
Aug 2, 2004
1,617
0
0
Originally posted by: tuteja1986
Originally posted by: bersl2
Originally posted by: aka1nas
Originally posted by: xtknight
I'm not sure why OpenGL is not more used. Does Direct3D support something that OpenGL doesn't?

OpenGL has had a rough time getting new technologies like shaders implemented into the standard API in a timely manner. Mainly this has to do with the fact that it is an API designed by commitee, with all the plusses and minuses that entails. MS has managed to be more aggressive with adding new features to DirectX and has managed to swing a lot of developers to coding in DirectX only.

OpenGL has a system of extensions whereby those who implement OpenGL can add new operations outside of the core. Although this leads to many extensions that do the same thing, a library such GLEW and a little bit of simplifying abstraction can make drawing operations seamless; and unlike with D3D, IIRC, OpenGL operations are permitted to be implemented in software, so that fallback for simple operations is possible. Basically, OpenGL lets hardware companies be hardware companies instead of being design slaves to a single software behemoth.

Thats a lie :(

If you remove the pathos from the argument, it's not a lie. D3D must be completely hardware-accelerated (IIRC), and adding hardware to accelerate drawing operations outside of those designated by that specification, controlled absolutely by a single entity---especially the one that has the monopolist's tight grip on the desktop computer---tends not to be a useful move. This can be seen (and I do see it thus) as a limiting factor on innovation. This can be circumvented by increased use of and support for OpenGL with its system of extensions.

Please, if you want to object to strong emotional language like "slaves", that is perfectly reasonable; but don't say that it's a lie that Microsoft is the one dictatating a large chunk of what they think a video card should be to the hardware companies.