Gaza Pullout

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ViciouS

Golden Member
Apr 1, 2001
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Yes I know it's for the better of the world, but wow, it would suck if I just bought a house and I was forced to move out of it. I'm sure they are compensating the Jewish settlers but how well? I'd be so heated if I didn?t get the complete value of my home. Do these people have time to get there furniture and stuff, it seems pretty sudden.

This must be an incredibly expensive maneuver by the Israeli government.
 
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Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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I'm not sure exactly how much they get.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_unilateral_disengagement_plan_of_2004
On February 16, 2005, the Knesset finalized and approved the plan with 59 in favor, 40 opposed, 5 abstaining. A proposed amendment to submit the plan to a referendum was rejected (29-72). The approval of the Disengagement Law now only leaves the formality of a cabinet decision before the plan comes into effect.
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they have had plenty of time, the only ones left are the ones who dont want to leave or didnt realise that they were going through with it
 
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Jmman

Diamond Member
Dec 17, 1999
5,302
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What I find ironic is back when they first decided to move settlers there, they compensated them for moving into Gaza. Now they are compensating them to leave. I really don't think the issue for them is the money though, but the social/religious significance.....
 
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Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
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Originally posted by: Jmman
What I find ironic is back when they first decided to move settlers there, they compensated them for moving into Gaza. Now they are compensating them to leave. I really don't think the issue for them is the money though, but the social/religious significance.....
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so true, there are basicly two types of settlers, one who have a religous reasons to move there and one who have financial reasons.
 
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ViciouS

Golden Member
Apr 1, 2001
1,257
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Originally posted by: Czar
Originally posted by: ViciouS
Originally posted by: Czar
Originally posted by: ViciouS
what is the religous purpose of moving into gaza?
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to claim back the holy land
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Holy cow we are going to keep killing eachother over god till we are all dead....
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no doubt about that :(
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That being said, you are aware that my god is much more uber than yours, and i will crush you if you think other wise.
 
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Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
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Originally posted by: ViciouS
That being said, you are aware that my god is much more uber than yours, and i will crush you if you think other wise.
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that doesnt work on athiests :p
 
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mrCide

Diamond Member
Nov 27, 1999
6,187
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i think i read one quote saying something along the lines of 'they are taking our land and giving it to the palestinians thats wrong' which is so hypocritical and disgusting. then that one settler pulled a soldiers gun and killed 4 palestians.. go israeli settlers! i have no pity for them.

sharon has ulterior motives here anyhow, but it looks pretty to everyone else :)
 
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RichPLS

Senior member
Nov 21, 2004
477
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0
Originally posted by: Czar
Originally posted by: ViciouS
That being said, you are aware that my god is much more uber than yours, and i will crush you if you think other wise.
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that doesnt work on athiests :p
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It doesn't? What about when my uber god supplies me with armies, cash, military weapons and latest warfare technology (this means you fight dirty, we fight dirtier, but do not get our hands dirty), and you are either with us or against us, and I will crush you!

Does that work better?
 
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Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
Originally posted by: mrCide
i think i read one quote saying something along the lines of 'they are taking our land and giving it to the palestinians thats wrong' which is so hypocritical and disgusting. then that one settler pulled a soldiers gun and killed 4 palestians.. go israeli settlers!
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sad thing is that both sides are just about the same, which shows that humanity is simpler than people think ;)

we have
extremists who use violence when no other methood is available (the religous settlers and the most violent terrorist groups)
strategists who will not back out no matter what, they try to act as diplomats while they are not (sharon, arafat, some of the terrorist groups)
diplomats who want a common realistic sollution (abbas, maybe peres though I'm not sure about him anymore)
 
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Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
Originally posted by: RichPLS
Originally posted by: Czar
Originally posted by: ViciouS
That being said, you are aware that my god is much more uber than yours, and i will crush you if you think other wise.
Click to expand...
that doesnt work on athiests :p
Click to expand...

It doesn't? What about when my uber god supplies me with armies, cash, military weapons and latest warfare technology (this means you fight dirty, we fight dirtier, but do not get our hands dirty), and you are either with us or against us, and I will crush you!

Does that work better?
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if your god actually does that then he must be very materialistic

 
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mrCide

Diamond Member
Nov 27, 1999
6,187
0
76
Originally posted by: Czar
Originally posted by: mrCide
i think i read one quote saying something along the lines of 'they are taking our land and giving it to the palestinians thats wrong' which is so hypocritical and disgusting. then that one settler pulled a soldiers gun and killed 4 palestians.. go israeli settlers!
Click to expand...

sad thing is that both sides are just about the same, which shows that humanity is simpler than people think ;)

we have
extremists who use violence when no other methood is available (the religous settlers and the most violent terrorist groups)
strategists who will not back out no matter what, they try to act as diplomats while they are not (sharon, arafat, some of the terrorist groups)
diplomats who want a common realistic sollution (abbas, maybe peres though I'm not sure about him anymore)
Click to expand...

you're right. no one plays fair ball in the end. i'd love to see the day this spiral ends..
 
A

arsbanned

Banned
Dec 12, 2003
4,853
0
0
Originally posted by: ViciouS
Yes I know it's for the better of the world, but wow, it would suck if I just bought a house and I was forced to move out of it. I'm sure they are compensating the Jewish settlers but how well? I'd be so heated if I didn?t get the complete value of my home. Do these people have time to get there furniture and stuff, it seems pretty sudden.

This must be an incredibly expensive maneuver by the Israeli government.
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Don't worry, the American taxpayer will pay.
 
R

RichPLS

Senior member
Nov 21, 2004
477
0
0
Originally posted by: Czar
Originally posted by: RichPLS
Originally posted by: Czar
Originally posted by: ViciouS
That being said, you are aware that my god is much more uber than yours, and i will crush you if you think other wise.
Click to expand...
that doesnt work on athiests :p
Click to expand...

It doesn't? What about when my uber god supplies me with armies, cash, military weapons and latest warfare technology (this means you fight dirty, we fight dirtier, but do not get our hands dirty), and you are either with us or against us, and I will crush you!

Does that work better?
Click to expand...
if your god actually does that then he must be very materialistic
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Well, Isreal's uber godly sent "representitive" has been doing this for 40 years...Sadly, Istreal has foresaken the gods and are giving up the fight...



 
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Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
Originally posted by: rdubbz420
Wasn?t Gaza captured from Egypt in 67? So why do they have to give it up?
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no one has recognized Israelis claim of Gaza, not even the Israelis themselves, so they are not giving anything up
 
MiniDoom

MiniDoom

Diamond Member
Jan 5, 2004
5,305
0
76
Originally posted by: Czar
Originally posted by: rdubbz420
Wasn?t Gaza captured from Egypt in 67? So why do they have to give it up?
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no one has recognized Israelis claim of Gaza, not even the Israelis themselves, so they are not giving anything up
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well it's not Egypt anymore right?
 
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polm

Diamond Member
May 24, 2001
3,183
0
0
Compensation, for many, will never be enough. That goes for both Israeli's and the Arabs who have lost their homes.
 
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imported_Condor

Diamond Member
Sep 22, 2004
5,425
0
0
Originally posted by: ViciouS
Yes I know it's for the better of the world, but wow, it would suck if I just bought a house and I was forced to move out of it. I'm sure they are compensating the Jewish settlers but how well? I'd be so heated if I didn?t get the complete value of my home. Do these people have time to get there furniture and stuff, it seems pretty sudden.

This must be an incredibly expensive maneuver by the Israeli government.
Click to expand...

And the horrible thing is that it won't help a bit. It will just encourage the terrorist to heat up their campaign because they won one!

 
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MrMajestyk

Member
Apr 8, 2003
185
0
0
Originally posted by: Czar
I'm not sure exactly how much they get.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_unilateral_disengagement_plan_of_2004
On February 16, 2005, the Knesset finalized and approved the plan with 59 in favor, 40 opposed, 5 abstaining. A proposed amendment to submit the plan to a referendum was rejected (29-72). The approval of the Disengagement Law now only leaves the formality of a cabinet decision before the plan comes into effect.
Click to expand...
they have had plenty of time, the only ones left are the ones who dont want to leave or didnt realise that they were going through with it
Click to expand...

The financial compensation is considerable.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4151742.stm

However, they forfieted 30% of these numbers if they had not withdrawn on the due date.

What puzzles me is WHY is Sharon moving on this. He has never given the Palestinians an inch.

The US is the only one with influence, helped by the massive aid Israel gets from the US.

I suspect Bush told Sharon he had to yield on this and the US govt is bankrolling the operation.
 
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Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
There are a few reasons I think made this all happen.

1. Sharon saw that in no way he could realisticly hold all that land, he does not have religous duty to claim the holy land as he said himself in an interview once, he is an athiest and only wants what is best for the safety of Israel. This is a long term plan which started with the wall in the west bank. In the end Israel will claim what is inside the wall without talking to anyone and expect people to accept it.

2. Bush has been a strong supporter of the roadmap and continualy has to remind Israel when it violates it. Mostly with expanding settlements. It could be that Bush managed to influence Sharon somewhat. The pullout is though definetly an idea brought forth by Sharon or someone close to him, not from Bush and co.

3. In the last few days Sharon said to the jewish extremists who have been attacking palestinians in both west bank and gaza that they should attack him instead since he is responsible. It is possible that Sharon is creating his own legacy by making this image of a hopefull settlement with the palestinians and possibly making himself a martir like Rabin.

I think nr1 is by far the most likely possibility but its possible that it has been influenced by the last two, hard to say.
 
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