gasoline production is going to hit a wall soon

[ElFenix]

and you think gas prices now are high

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Yeah, we definately have a supply problem. The question should be - what can we do short-term to hold off a shortage until we can build more refinerys. One suggestion I have is Ethynol(for more than one reason). It is a 10% additive. Another is getting more hybrids on the road quicker than planned. We probably need to do a variety of things as there isn't one smoking gun answer to the problem.

Oh and we could get off our fat asses and ride a bike. I have decided that by the end of the summer I want to be riding my bike to work a couple days a week. I live 11.4 miles from my office.

CkG

 

[HappyPuppy]

Environmentalists and NIMBY's have made it nearly impossible to build new refineries.

 

[Spencer278]

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Yeah, we definately have a supply problem. The question should be - what can we do short-term to hold off a shortage until we can build more refinerys. One suggestion I have is Ethynol(for more than one reason). It is a 10% additive. Another is getting more hybrids on the road quicker than planned. We probably need to do a variety of things as there isn't one smoking gun answer to the problem.

Oh and we could get off our fat asses and ride a bike. I have decided that by the end of the summer I want to be riding my bike to work a couple days a week. I live 11.4 miles from my office.

CkG

Province/State: Iowa

Well it is easy to see at least one of your reasons.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: Spencer278

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Yeah, we definately have a supply problem. The question should be - what can we do short-term to hold off a shortage until we can build more refinerys. One suggestion I have is Ethynol(for more than one reason). It is a 10% additive. Another is getting more hybrids on the road quicker than planned. We probably need to do a variety of things as there isn't one smoking gun answer to the problem.

Oh and we could get off our fat asses and ride a bike. I have decided that by the end of the summer I want to be riding my bike to work a couple days a week. I live 11.4 miles from my office.

CkG

Province/State: Iowa

Well it is easy to see at least one of your reasons.

*cookie*

Now the question is - do you want gov't subsidies to keep farmers farming or would you rather them grow a marketable product that will help(could to a point) the gas issue we may face? A renewable resource, an additive to reduce petrol needs by up to 10%, and will create a profitable market for those currently heavily subsidized by the gov't.
Hmm...I know what my choice is.

CkG

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: HappyPuppy
Environmentalists and NIMBY's have made it nearly impossible to build new refineries.

That's BS and you know it.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

I'm still waiting to hear the 'no war for oil' clowns' response to the simple question--where's all the oil that we went to war to steal in '91 and '03? (aside from the undisclosed location on Bush's ranch)...do all you little tree-hugging peaceniks who chanted that nonsense now feel stupid?

 

[Strk]

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Yeah, we definately have a supply problem. The question should be - what can we do short-term to hold off a shortage until we can build more refinerys. One suggestion I have is Ethynol(for more than one reason). It is a 10% additive. Another is getting more hybrids on the road quicker than planned. We probably need to do a variety of things as there isn't one smoking gun answer to the problem.

Oh and we could get off our fat asses and ride a bike. I have decided that by the end of the summer I want to be riding my bike to work a couple days a week. I live 11.4 miles from my office.

CkG

We could also work towards getting ultra-low sulfer diesel fuel widely produced in the US, as well as biodiesel or biodiesel/ultra low sulfer diesel mixed versions. Considering a midsize seden using diesel gets around 45mpg, I think I know which I'd prefer.

 

[Spencer278]

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
I'm still waiting to hear the 'no war for oil' clowns' response to the simple question--where's all the oil that we went to war to steal in '91 and '03? (aside from the undisclosed location on Bush's ranch)...do all you little tree-hugging peaceniks who chanted that nonsense now feel stupid?

Bush's plan is to keep the iraq oil off the market and therefor drive up the cost of oil and make money for his oil budies.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: Spencer278

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
I'm still waiting to hear the 'no war for oil' clowns' response to the simple question--where's all the oil that we went to war to steal in '91 and '03? (aside from the undisclosed location on Bush's ranch)...do all you little tree-hugging peaceniks who chanted that nonsense now feel stupid?

Bush's plan is to keep the iraq oil off the market and therefor drive up the cost of oil and make money for his oil budies.

Oh, yea; I forgot.

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: Strk

We could also work towards getting ultra-low sulfer diesel fuel widely produced in the US, as well as biodiesel or biodiesel/ultra low sulfer diesel mixed versions. Considering a midsize seden using diesel gets around 45mpg, I think I know which I'd prefer.

ultra-low sulfur diesel/biodiesel > *

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx

Originally posted by: Spencer278

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
I'm still waiting to hear the 'no war for oil' clowns' response to the simple question--where's all the oil that we went to war to steal in '91 and '03? (aside from the undisclosed location on Bush's ranch)...do all you little tree-hugging peaceniks who chanted that nonsense now feel stupid?

Bush's plan is to keep the iraq oil off the market and therefor drive up the cost of oil and make money for his oil budies.

Oh, yea; I forgot.

Oh, yeah; I conveniently forgot.


Fixed your memory lapse for you.

 

[Ozoned]

Diesel, anyone?

What I mean is that in a typical crude heating tower you can manipulate the temperatures and the level where you precipitate a certain fuel, or its raw form..

We could easily create a diesel that is lighter than the present and increase output of diesel, while maintaining current gasoline refining capabilities..

The pollution created using more diesel would be less than using ethanol.

Many Ethanol Plants are being built across the corn belt, but there is still the one basic flaw with ethanol.

It takes almost as much energy to produce a gallon of ethanol as the same gallon of ethanol contains. So we have a cleaner burning fuel, but we have the pollution it creates plus the pollution created to make it.

Then you have to factor in the energy used to cultivate, plant, irrigate, farm, harvest, handle, and transport the corn or other grains.

There are many uses for the by-products of the process used to make ethanol, but with current technology the process's are not profittable without current government ethanol subsidies, and that money comes from highway and bridge funds..I *think* that that is currently somewhere around
500 million a year....Well, Enough of with that..


I have heard of these gasoline production probs for years, but i've never had a problem getting gas, never.




edited a cost figure

 

[dmcowen674]

''It takes almost as much energy to produce a gallon of ethanol as the same gallon of ethanol contains. So we have a cleaner burning fuel, but we have the pollution it creates plus the pollution created to make it.''

Who cars, as long as we break free from being hostage to the Sand Thugs.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
''It takes almost as much energy to produce a gallon of ethanol as the same gallon of ethanol contains. So we have a cleaner burning fuel, but we have the pollution it creates plus the pollution created to make it.''

Who cars, as long as we break free from being hostage to the Sand Thugs.

If you would stop driving huge vans, and Kerry would stop flying in haircutters, perhaps we could reduce our dependency-- the Flying Squirrel [Gulfstream V] would consume approximately 660-700 Gallons [5500-5700 pounds] flying from Washington DC to Pittsburgh.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
''It takes almost as much energy to produce a gallon of ethanol as the same gallon of ethanol contains. So we have a cleaner burning fuel, but we have the pollution it creates plus the pollution created to make it.''

Who cars, as long as we break free from being hostage to the Sand Thugs.

If you would stop driving huge vans, and Kerry would stop flying in haircutters, perhaps we could reduce our dependency-- the Flying Squirrel [Gulfstream V] would consume approximately 660-700 Gallons [5500-5700 pounds] flying from Washington DC to Pittsburgh.

Who's driving huge Vans?

I have a small Caravan with the small V6 and get over 20 mpg.

 

[Ozoned]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
''It takes almost as much energy to produce a gallon of ethanol as the same gallon of ethanol contains. So we have a cleaner burning fuel, but we have the pollution it creates plus the pollution created to make it.''

Who cars, as long as we break free from being hostage to the Sand Thugs.

If you would stop driving huge vans, and Kerry would stop flying in haircutters, perhaps we could reduce our dependency-- the Flying Squirrel [Gulfstream V] would consume approximately 660-700 Gallons [5500-5700 pounds] flying from Washington DC to Pittsburgh.

Who's driving huge Vans?

I have a small Caravan with the small V6 and get over 20 mpg.

That aint enough,,,

I mean look at what your mentor Cad is going to do, what do you say to riding your bike to work a couple days a week?

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
''It takes almost as much energy to produce a gallon of ethanol as the same gallon of ethanol contains. So we have a cleaner burning fuel, but we have the pollution it creates plus the pollution created to make it.''

Who cars, as long as we break free from being hostage to the Sand Thugs.

If you would stop driving huge vans, and Kerry would stop flying in haircutters, perhaps we could reduce our dependency-- the Flying Squirrel [Gulfstream V] would consume approximately 660-700 Gallons [5500-5700 pounds] flying from Washington DC to Pittsburgh.

Who's driving huge Vans?

I have a small Caravan with the small V6 and get over 20 mpg.

You are part of the problem, then...you complain about SUV's all the time, yet drive a van that gets 20.983 mpg? I bet it's not even made in America, is it?

 

[Ozoned]

Originally posted by: ElFenix
and you think gas prices now are high

ElFenix, I feel used... You knew this was going to happen.....

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Ozoned

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
''It takes almost as much energy to produce a gallon of ethanol as the same gallon of ethanol contains. So we have a cleaner burning fuel, but we have the pollution it creates plus the pollution created to make it.''

Who cars, as long as we break free from being hostage to the Sand Thugs.

If you would stop driving huge vans, and Kerry would stop flying in haircutters, perhaps we could reduce our dependency-- the Flying Squirrel [Gulfstream V] would consume approximately 660-700 Gallons [5500-5700 pounds] flying from Washington DC to Pittsburgh.

Who's driving huge Vans?

I have a small Caravan with the small V6 and get over 20 mpg.

That aint enough,,,

I mean look at what your mentor Cad is going to do, what do you say to riding your bike to work a couple days a week?

Gladly if there was a job within 11.4 miles to ride my bike to.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Ozoned

Originally posted by: ElFenix
and you think gas prices now are high

ElFenix, I feel used... You knew this was going to happen.....

do what?

 

[drnickriviera]

Originally posted by: Strk
We could also work towards getting ultra-low sulfer diesel fuel widely produced in the US, as well as biodiesel or biodiesel/ultra low sulfer diesel mixed versions. Considering a midsize seden using diesel gets around 45mpg, I think I know which I'd prefer.

Which car are you referring to? I know the Jetta TDI would get those numbers, but I don't consider that a mid size.

Our 95' E300D gets 30-32 no matter what, city, highway. Little less in the winter. It doesn't have a turbo so in accelerates like a pig. Out 87' 300D gets 25-27

 

[dmcowen674]

I liked the part in the article that says the U.S. Govt will have to ration the gas and only the richest will be able to afford it. Way to go (need a thumbs up Icon).

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

We need to start doing heavy and serious R&D on non fossil fuels and do it now. If we had an administration willing to pursue this as adamantly as this dumb ass Iraq war, we might get somewhere. No chance of that. Neither side wants to rock the boat.

 

[Spencer278]

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Originally posted by: Spencer278

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY
Yeah, we definately have a supply problem. The question should be - what can we do short-term to hold off a shortage until we can build more refinerys. One suggestion I have is Ethynol(for more than one reason). It is a 10% additive. Another is getting more hybrids on the road quicker than planned. We probably need to do a variety of things as there isn't one smoking gun answer to the problem.

Oh and we could get off our fat asses and ride a bike. I have decided that by the end of the summer I want to be riding my bike to work a couple days a week. I live 11.4 miles from my office.

CkG

Province/State: Iowa

Well it is easy to see at least one of your reasons.

*cookie*

Now the question is - do you want gov't subsidies to keep farmers farming or would you rather them grow a marketable product that will help(could to a point) the gas issue we may face? A renewable resource, an additive to reduce petrol needs by up to 10%, and will create a profitable market for those currently heavily subsidized by the gov't.
Hmm...I know what my choice is.

CkG

I vote for none of the above. It not like the farmers would starve to death if we stoped subsidening them. But if I Had to choose one or the other I would vote pay them to sit on their ass. At least that why we can Have the richest people pay for the farmers thru higher income tax then force the poor to subsidize the farmers thru higher gas prices.