Gas prices caused by oil companies, not the spike in crude...

shadow9d9

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2004
8,132
2
0
http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/energy/pr/?postId=6133

anta Monica, CA -- The Foundation for Taxpayer and Consumer Rights released a new study today of rising gasoline prices in California that found corporate markups and profiteering are responsible for spring price spikes, not rising crude costs or the national switchover to higher-cost ethanol, as the oil industry claims.

Click here to download and read the study.

Independent petroleum consultant Tim Hamilton analyzed gasoline price increases from January to April to find that:

* Increases in the "spot" market price of crude oil -- which is the highest price a major oil company would pay for crude oil -- accounted for only 12 cents per gallon. California's percentage sales tax increased fuel prices by another four cents per gallon. More than 40 cents of the 60-cent increase in gasoline prices over 3 1/2 months is attributable to increased refinery and marketing profit margins for the oil companies;
* Neither the MTBE phaseout nor the substitution of ethanol is a serious part of the increase. If the MTBE phaseout or ethanol blending specifically increased costs for oil companies in California, other states in the West using conventional unblended gasoline should be much less affected. Yet Washington State, which uses only conventional gasoline and has similar refinery capacity and crude oil sources, mirrored California's increase;
* The profit increase of 42 cents, on top of record profits last year, means California gasoline will cost consumers approximately $546 million more in April 2006 than in April of last year.

"While oil companies continue to blame crude oil prices and ethanol additives for the recent gasoline price spikes in California, the chief cause is increased profiteering by oil companies that have previously posted world record profits," said Hamilton.

"Oil companies are opportunistically using the rising world price for crude oil as an excuse to excessively raise gasoline prices and pump up their profits, even though the spot market price for crude has gone up far more slowly than gasoline prices," said FTCR President Jamie Court. "In addition, the spot price is higher than most oil companies pay, since they either harvest their own crude or pay more stable and often much lower contract prices.




Biiig surprise! Bush and his oil baron buddies win again!
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: shadow9d9
http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/energy/pr/?postId=6133

anta Monica, CA -- The Foundation for Taxpayer and Consumer Rights released a new study today of rising gasoline prices in California that found corporate markups and profiteering are responsible for spring price spikes, not rising crude costs or the national switchover to higher-cost ethanol, as the oil industry claims.

Click here to download and read the study.

Independent petroleum consultant Tim Hamilton analyzed gasoline price increases from January to April to find that:

* Increases in the "spot" market price of crude oil -- which is the highest price a major oil company would pay for crude oil -- accounted for only 12 cents per gallon. California's percentage sales tax increased fuel prices by another four cents per gallon. More than 40 cents of the 60-cent increase in gasoline prices over 3 1/2 months is attributable to increased refinery and marketing profit margins for the oil companies;
* Neither the MTBE phaseout nor the substitution of ethanol is a serious part of the increase. If the MTBE phaseout or ethanol blending specifically increased costs for oil companies in California, other states in the West using conventional unblended gasoline should be much less affected. Yet Washington State, which uses only conventional gasoline and has similar refinery capacity and crude oil sources, mirrored California's increase;
* The profit increase of 42 cents, on top of record profits last year, means California gasoline will cost consumers approximately $546 million more in April 2006 than in April of last year.

"While oil companies continue to blame crude oil prices and ethanol additives for the recent gasoline price spikes in California, the chief cause is increased profiteering by oil companies that have previously posted world record profits," said Hamilton.

"Oil companies are opportunistically using the rising world price for crude oil as an excuse to excessively raise gasoline prices and pump up their profits, even though the spot market price for crude has gone up far more slowly than gasoline prices," said FTCR President Jamie Court. "In addition, the spot price is higher than most oil companies pay, since they either harvest their own crude or pay more stable and often much lower contract prices.

Biiig surprise! Bush and his oil baron buddies win again!

This is the obvious but you couldn't put this in the Gas thread???
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
3
0
Nothing like installing ENRON into the White House..

ELF should pay a visit to some of these oil barons homes and factories
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
3
0
We should probably start more wars to create peace and stability in the world
 

LegendKiller

Lifer
Mar 5, 2001
18,256
68
86
the oil industry doesn't work on spot, but futures, spot doesn't mean crap when you need oil 3mo from now.

as far as record profits. track profit margin as a % of revenue, the story becomes less clear. add in the temporal differences of futures, benefits of raising prices+futures, and you have explained a large % of the difference.

anybody educated in high finance knows this.
 

NTB

Diamond Member
Mar 26, 2001
5,179
0
0
Originally posted by: bctbct


That blog does little to explain the record profits, heres probably why



"In any case, I first checked out some facts on the internet (all figures are rough estimates rounded off)"

no, it says so right *in* the blog:

But keep in mind, they had to increase prices ahead of costs because they did not know just how high the cost per barrel could go.
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
3
0
Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Originally posted by: shadow9d9
http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/energy/pr/?postId=6133

Santa Monica, CA -- The Foundation for Taxpayer and Consumer Rights...

The foundation for Taxpayer and Consumer Rights? Please don't tell me CA tax payers have to pay for a worthless organization like that... :(

Ever since Texas based Enron faked an energy crisis and rolling blackouts in California THE PEOPLE OF AMERICA NEED TO BE PROTECTED FROM THESE TERRORISTS
 

BlancoNino

Diamond Member
Oct 31, 2005
5,695
0
0
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Originally posted by: shadow9d9
http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/energy/pr/?postId=6133

Santa Monica, CA -- The Foundation for Taxpayer and Consumer Rights...

The foundation for Taxpayer and Consumer Rights? Please don't tell me CA tax payers have to pay for a worthless organization like that... :(

Ever since Texas based Enron faked an energy crisis and rolling blackouts in California THE PEOPLE OF AMERICA NEED TO BE PROTECTED FROM THESE TERRORISTS

Ha! And just how would that foundation do that?

 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
3
0
Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Originally posted by: shadow9d9
http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/energy/pr/?postId=6133

Santa Monica, CA -- The Foundation for Taxpayer and Consumer Rights...

The foundation for Taxpayer and Consumer Rights? Please don't tell me CA tax payers have to pay for a worthless organization like that... :(

Ever since Texas based Enron faked an energy crisis and rolling blackouts in California THE PEOPLE OF AMERICA NEED TO BE PROTECTED FROM THESE TERRORISTS

Ha! And just how would that foundation do that?


By hopefully catching these criminals before they are allowed to do too much damage

read up on Enron rolling blackouts
 

BlancoNino

Diamond Member
Oct 31, 2005
5,695
0
0
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: BlancoNino
Originally posted by: shadow9d9
http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/energy/pr/?postId=6133

Santa Monica, CA -- The Foundation for Taxpayer and Consumer Rights...

The foundation for Taxpayer and Consumer Rights? Please don't tell me CA tax payers have to pay for a worthless organization like that... :(

Ever since Texas based Enron faked an energy crisis and rolling blackouts in California THE PEOPLE OF AMERICA NEED TO BE PROTECTED FROM THESE TERRORISTS

Ha! And just how would that foundation do that?


By hopefully catching these criminals before they are allowed to do too much damage

read up on Enron rolling blackouts

OR we can hold them accountable, throw them in prison and make them pay back everything they owe....

But I guess a taxpayer funded organization sitting there with nothing better to do until something comes along is better...?
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
3
0
Can you predict when these criminals will strike? Just be like me and want all politicians and CEO's watched 24x7 for criminal activity.. << that would probably save the taxpayers tons of money

How much do you think the Bush Family Savings and Loan scandals cost American Citizens?
 

GrammatonJP

Golden Member
Feb 16, 2006
1,245
0
0
http://www.usatoday.com/money/companies/earnings/2006-01-30-exxonmobil_x.htm

ExxonMobil amasses record $36B 2005 profit
By David J. Lynch, USA TODAY
ExxonMobil (XOM) reported the largest annual profit in U.S. corporate history Monday, a $36.1 billion jackpot that included a record-setting fourth quarter.
Exxon earned $10.7 billion, or $116 million every 24 hours, in 2005's final quarter, up 27% from the same period one year earlier.

Quarterly revenue of $99.7 billion was 19.5% higher than last year's fourth quarter. For the year, Exxon took in $371 billion ? equal to the total annual economic output of Argentina and Thailand.

--

How can they keep 36 BILLION DOLLARS Profit and rip us off like that
wouldn't it make sense to say make 1 BILLION and have lower gas prices ?
 

jlbenedict

Banned
Jul 10, 2005
3,724
0
0
Originally posted by: NTB
Originally posted by: bctbct


That blog does little to explain the record profits, heres probably why



"In any case, I first checked out some facts on the internet (all figures are rough estimates rounded off)"

no, it says so right *in* the blog:

But keep in mind, they had to increase prices ahead of costs because they did not know just how high the cost per barrel could go.


Don't believe everything you read on the internet

 

Looney

Lifer
Jun 13, 2000
21,938
5
0
Originally posted by: NTB
Originally posted by: bctbct


That blog does little to explain the record profits, heres probably why



"In any case, I first checked out some facts on the internet (all figures are rough estimates rounded off)"

no, it says so right *in* the blog:

But keep in mind, they had to increase prices ahead of costs because they did not know just how high the cost per barrel could go.

What? You increase prices with the expected costs that will go up? What kind of business model is that? If you buy one barrel of oil for $50... why would you need to increase the price on the gas from that oil because you expect the next barrel of oil to be $60? Why wouldn't you sell the $50 barrel for what it's worth, and then if you're paying more for the $60, then increase the prices to cover the costs of the extra costs you're paying.

You know why they don't? Because they have no competition. They're a monopolitistic cartel that fixed prices. In any other industry, if a manufacturer was to increase the prices due to 'expected costs', but no other manufacturers did then they wouldn't stay in business long.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,917
6,570
126
The oil industry has and is investigated to death. Their profits are about 5.5% with an average 5.8% the norm for similar sized corporations. Oil prices reflect market fears not corporate manipulation.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: Looney
Originally posted by: NTB
Originally posted by: bctbct


That blog does little to explain the record profits, heres probably why



"In any case, I first checked out some facts on the internet (all figures are rough estimates rounded off)"

no, it says so right *in* the blog:

But keep in mind, they had to increase prices ahead of costs because they did not know just how high the cost per barrel could go.

What? You increase prices with the expected costs that will go up? What kind of business model is that? If you buy one barrel of oil for $50... why would you need to increase the price on the gas from that oil because you expect the next barrel of oil to be $60? Why wouldn't you sell the $50 barrel for what it's worth, and then if you're paying more for the $60, then increase the prices to cover the costs of the extra costs you're paying.

You know why they don't? Because they have no competition. They're a monopolitistic cartel that fixed prices. In any other industry, if a manufacturer was to increase the prices due to 'expected costs', but no other manufacturers did then they wouldn't stay in business long.

Actually they do have to buy the oil futures now, so they hedge their bet by raising the price at the pump now to pay for it.

It isnt the same kind of business model you will find at, say dell, where Intle has a price sheet that is negotiated qtrs out.

And eventhough the price of gas sucks ass, we bring it on ourselves by continuing to pay the inflated price. That is why I always suggest to simply stop buying the gas. If the country cut back on gas consumption by 10%, it could really cause a good drop in prices due to an oversupply of gas into the market.

The same thing that is happening now, happened in reverse in the mid to late 1990s. OPEC was pumping to much oil for the demand of the world and as a result the prices fell through the floor. I think at one point a barrel of oil was about 7 bucks or something. That translated into 69 cent gas where I lived. And if you look at the profit margins in the mid to late 1990s, I am willing to bet they arent far off what we have today. The only difference is with the lower price of oil, and the lower price of gas at the pump, they didnt have as high a profit in raw dollars as they do now.

I am sure you werent complaining about the low price of gas back then were you?

You take the good with the bad with a comodity like Oil.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: GrammatonJP
http://www.usatoday.com/money/companies/earnings/2006-01-30-exxonmobil_x.htm

ExxonMobil amasses record $36B 2005 profit
By David J. Lynch, USA TODAY
ExxonMobil (XOM) reported the largest annual profit in U.S. corporate history Monday, a $36.1 billion jackpot that included a record-setting fourth quarter.
Exxon earned $10.7 billion, or $116 million every 24 hours, in 2005's final quarter, up 27% from the same period one year earlier.

Quarterly revenue of $99.7 billion was 19.5% higher than last year's fourth quarter. For the year, Exxon took in $371 billion ? equal to the total annual economic output of Argentina and Thailand.

--

How can they keep 36 BILLION DOLLARS Profit and rip us off like that
wouldn't it make sense to say make 1 BILLION and have lower gas prices ?

What do you suggest, they pay you for using their product?
They can keep the 36 billion because people like you and I continue to buy their product.
And why would a corporation run by anybody but socialists artificially lower their profit margin and run their stock into the ground?

So no, I dont think it would make sense for them to make 1 billion on 400 billion in sales and lower the price of gas. That would be one of the most insane business decisions in the history of the world and get the board of directors and the executives fired in a hurry.