Gaming/Video card industry

[Vdubchaos]

I'm somewhat frustrated, I can't possibly be the only one.

But I think there will be plenty that will relate.

I will start off with Gaming industry.

Current state of the industry is somewhat......boring? Consoles are slowing down any kind of graphic progress. Games in general have not taking ANY graphics leap since Crysis (which is a shame IMO). CEOs are cashing in with giving us the same crap over and over (let's face it, COD BO/MOH are both "revisions/upgrades" vs completely new engines). It just seems like gamers are being squeezed out of cash with outdated crap and there is very little difference in graphics from 3 years ago (if ANY).

Then the entire "Console" like business purpose of add on packs/download content......just leaves me with sour taste.

Which brings me to Video card industry.

AMD/Nvidia seems to be on the same page as of late. Whatever happened to AMD beating Nvidia by $100 not $10-20. Seems like they are communicating on releases/products. Where we stand today, there is almost no difference between going with Nvidia or AMD (at whatever price point). <<<<I know there is few exceptions.

There is no more "CLEAR winner" in the price range (when I say price range I mean 100-300 price point). Anything past that is irrelevant TO ME (even if money was no object, sorry but $300 is my limit). Seems like you really can't go wrong with either one. Perhaps there is some play in Mail in Rebate or Warranty savings, but that's nothing significant.

Whatever happen to days of "my $250 ATI does what Nvidia does for $350-400+".

So while many of us are thinking "price wars", Nvidia/ATI is laughing all the way to the bank.....Truth is, GPUs are VERY expensive where we stand today and offer little bump in performance (mostly due to Game graphics advancement)

I simply cannot justify ANY kind of GPU upgrade today until I see some better quality games. I've seen the difference in graphics between my 4870 and maxed out settings on all the games I play. (BC2, MW2, Fifa 2011, F1 2010)

Difference is MINIMAL at best, and frankly I can't justify the upgrade until a new benchmark of Gaming graphics is set (which I have a feeling Crysis 2 will not accomplish).

Perhaps Unreal 4 will be it? No clue, but it's not looking good.

Personally I'm losing interest in gaming all together on daily basis.

Just wondering everyone else feelings on the subject.

 

[Athadeus]

I say buy games for their gameplay, and if graphic immersion helps improve the gameplay, spend as much as you feel worth for it.

Unfortunately, I am so dissatisfied with the gaming industry, that I am not really even interested in improving graphics for them. I would actually really like price increases, if it would help drive some casuals out and give games more longevity before the next shooter of the month. I know there's better ways to deal with the former issue, but I don't see developers slowing down for corporate greed.

 

[Vdubchaos]

Can't disagree there.

Although I do realize that graphics are not everything, there is a pretty good reason why many of us buy GPUs for our PCs and not consoles.

I think gaming industry somewhat sets the tone for what Video Card industry does.

if games suck, no matter how great the video card is....game is still going to suck.

Without even getting into the fact that AMD/Nvidia has been basically selling us the same thing for past 2+ years (started of with scaled back product).

Really wondering what's next.

 

[Wreckage]

I have plenty of games to keep me happy and a card that performs well for under $200. I also play console games. So I guess, I'm doing alright. There is plenty to complain about, but not enough to deter me from enjoying game.s

 

[cmdrdredd]

I disagree about consoles. They aren't holding anything back. It's not really anyone's fault that they sell more copies of Call of Duty on the Xbox 360 in one day than they do on PC for a year. Consoles are going to sell more and there's nothing you or I can do to change it. It's also more friendly to those who are not techies. There's no need for the right driver versions, DX versions, sound drivers, correct CPU performance, upgrades etc. It just works on a console. Also I think the fact that most people play their console on a TV over 2x the size of their computer monitor makes a difference in some circles. Really I don't think consoles are holding anything back, but rather the developers are holding back from using the full potential of a top of the line PC.

They are going where the industry trends go and that's what smart business do.

I do find fault with Nvidia and AMD. While they can pump out incredible cards, there is not really a need with so few games. Then they still want $400 for the latest thing. I don't know...seems like a waste to me.

Then the entire "Console" like business purpose of add on packs/download content......just leaves me with sour taste.

Then don't buy it...it's really simple.

 

[Vdubchaos]

I disagree about consoles. They aren't holding anything back. It's not really anyone's fault that they sell more copies of Call of Duty on the Xbox 360 in one day than they do on PC for a year. Consoles are going to sell more and there's nothing you or I can do to change it. It's also more friendly to those who are not techies. There's no need for the right driver versions, DX versions, sound drivers, correct CPU performance, upgrades etc. It just works on a console. Also I think the fact that most people play their console on a TV over 2x the size of their computer monitor makes a difference in some circles. Really I don't think consoles are holding anything back, but rather the developers are holding back from using the full potential of a top of the line PC.

They are going where the industry trends go and that's what smart business do.

The issue is that Consoles are DX9 and devs are not fully utilizing DX11 since Consoles don't support it.

That's what holding it back....mostly.

 

[bryanW1995]

I've thought about potential collusion recently. I still think it's possible, but amd probably wouldn't have worked so hard to keep their info secret if they were colluding. Both companies have put forth a lot of effort to be price/performance competitive in the $100-300 market for most of their existence.

There are a few historical instances where this wasn't the case: R300, 8800gtx, and 58x0. r300 was absurd and, amd lived off that reputation for years. 8800gtx/g80 had no competition for 6 months, then dominated for another 12+ months, though at least 2900xt was priced competitively and 3870 came out relatively soon afterwards. 58x0, like g80, had no competition for 6+ months, then the competition that came out was received in a very lukewarm manner. however, by this summer gtx 460 was out, nvidia got crazy on prices, 58x0 came out, and nvidia regained the upper hand. add up all those instances and you have maybe 2.5-3 years of uncompetitive climate and 10+ years of competitive price/performance cards. Right now we're back to a competitive situation, but with both camps limping a bit and a still weak economy we're not likely to see another balls to the wall price war for a while.

 

[Vdubchaos]

You forgot 4800 series, between 4850 and 4870 AMD basically dominated "best bang for the buck" for good year +.

Both Nvidia's cards with similar performance (at the time) were $100+ more...

 

[frozentundra123456]

At least the lack of progress in graphics means I can still use my 4 year old system to play most games at moderate resolutions with enough graphics to enjoy the gameplay. More frustrating to me is the lack of really innovative games and the fact that so many of the games coming out are sequels. Not to mention that the sequels usually are inferior to the original (i.e. Supreme Commander 2, Modern Warfare 2, Black Ops (good game, terrible porting job). Only good sequel that i can think of is Mass Effect 2.

 

[Concillian]

Video industry is fine. "A" never had a price overly competitive for long, "N" always responded with price drops within a few weeks or a month. Maybe you get ONE card at ONE point in time that blows everything away. There are only so many 4200 Ti / 9500 / 8800GTS / 4850 cards that exist. It doesn't happen every generation.

Gaming industry is a mess, but not because of graphics. Console ports have massive control issues, some games have serious DRM issues, and developers are soon to be forcing after sale content packs to minimize resell-ability of games.

 

[cmdrdredd]

The issue is that Consoles are DX9 and devs are not fully utilizing DX11 since Consoles don't support it.

That's what holding it back....mostly.

Wrong...nothing stops them from using DX11. The reason they don't is because it's not cost effective to build two engines of the same thing with only minor differences in graphic fidelity.

again, NOTHING is stopping the developer from using everything available. The fact is they don't want to devote resources to what is not generating the most money. Some people blame pirating and whatnot, but I don't agree there 100&#37;. I'm sure it's a concern but lets be realistic. Most people who purchase PC games don't have the highest end top of the line hardware anyway. Why devote hundreds or thousands of hours to d3evelope a game for DX11 when a very small percentage of purchasers will have the necessary hardware to run it well? It's not going to generate profits.

Think about it from the perspective of a business for a minute and you will see why it works the way it does. It's easier to protect content on consoles and PC sales are very very small fractions of console sales. Add the fact that most people who would be potential customers don't have $500 video cards to run the game. It becomes a matter of what is going to make money, I don't fault them for going where the money is. By most standards what you see on a console game in this day and age is considered pretty damn good. Sure if you did everything DX11 offers you could get more but why? Where's the profit. That's what I see. Again there is no blame to the consoles for lack of development. The companies that make the games are under no obligation to port games from consoles. It's their choice.

 

[Arkadrel]

Too little focus on actual gameplay/game story....

MMOs with a bazillion bugs.... RTS online games like sc2 where people hack/cheat... action RPGs = /sigh (bring back turn based please).

Im in the "Not happy with Gaming Industry".

 

[happy medium]

Im in the "Not happy with Gaming Industry".

Me too...🙁

 

[Athadeus]

Too little focus on actual gameplay/game story....

MMOs with a bazillion bugs.... RTS online games like sc2 where people hack/cheat... action RPGs = /sigh (bring back turn based please).

Im in the "Not happy with Gaming Industry".

I am sure that cheating is not a big problem in SC2; I play it very often.

 

[MustangSVT]

I dont like how they've been recycling same performance with new name for awhile. and the prices didnt change much. but now it is a bit better with 460s and 68xxs.

And for gaming, I dont like how everything is "consolized" but I understand they are not getting profits from PC as much.

But Still PC is so much more fun compared to consoles imo due to mods and some open source games.

 

[dust]

Seeing how there are just a handful of games that really stress current hardware, I have no reason to be unhappy with the video card industry. Gaming is what sucks, especially since they started drooling over DLC's.

I have yet to experience a title that would be unplayable on my crappy cf solution and this fact has been holding me to upgrade. I remember that two years ago I got 2 9800gtx's just for trial and finally settled for the 4870 and the Rampage, but it was a huuuge improvement over my old 7800gt/PentiumD platform. How I wish that was the case now!!

 

[busydude]

Video game industry is similar to the movie industry, divided between:

1) unoriginal high budget movies/games with countless sequels.. commercial movies/games which cater lowest common denominator.. just like games.. with few exceptions(Like 1 in 25, just a wild guess)

2) Independent movies/games with less investment which concentrate on story/script/gameplay rather than mindless effects(IQ).

Right now, I am looking more at indie games than AAA high budget overpriced crap.

 

[DaveSimmons]

I had quite a bit of fun playing Fallout New Vegas on my new $180 AMD 6850.

There are piles of other good games out there if you care more about gameplay than Dx11 -- including 290 oldies on sale at GoG.com starting at $3.

I wouldn't mind if some developers would step up and create some games I want to play, with best-case image quality that makes me want a GTX 580. But I can't blame AMD or nvidia for the fact that it isn't cost-effective for the publishers to do that yet.

Nvidia has found out they can't overcharge anymore except at the highest end, so with their very reasonable pricing it makes no sense to complain about both companies now offering equivalent value. That's how competition is supposed to work.

Maybe we will have to wait until 2012-2013 for DX11-level hardware in consoles to make a leap forward in image quality worthwhile. That's too bad, but meanwhile I'll keep enjoying good games with (only) good graphics.

 

[SirGCal]

Personally I'm so sick of consoles... They bring gaming down so bad. Poor graphics, bad console to pc ports, pathetically bad controlls... UGG. If they would use something like Steam to release their software, piracy wouldn't be nearly as bad. But charging $300 for a REALLY old glorified PC, then refusing the next gen just cause the current gen is still selling, just erks the crap out of me. I have a 360, haven't turned it on in over 2 years... My PC is so much more capable and fun... Anyhow on topic, I like the new video cards, but hate the gaming industry cause they are gong big-business and focusing on consoles and the same-old storylines instead of coming up with new engines, interesting physics capabilities, etc. I'm excited about the new valve engine soon but you don't hear things like that in the gaming industry like you used to. They've stagnetted (I butchered that spelling) on the consoles...

 

[RussianSensation]

I am finding that the older I get, the more easily bored I am when playing video games. I actually enjoy reading books, journals, articles, news, magazines, playing sports, socializing with friends a lot more than playing video games today. I find most of the time I feel 'brain dead' when playing games, which is why I have started to love racing games - I just relax. When I was younger, like 9 or even 15 years old even, I could play video games for hours every day and never get bored....However, I did replay Starcraft 1 and Braid not long ago and really enjoyed both of those experiences. I guess I am just tired of these 'on rails' Call of Duty type of games.

 

[busydude]

I am finding that the older I get, the more easily bored I am when playing video games. I actually enjoy reading books, journals, articles, news, magazines, playing sports, socializing with friends a lot more than playing video games today. I find most of the time I feel 'brain dead' when playing games, which is why I have started to love racing games - I just relax. When I was younger, like 9 or even 15 years old even, I could play video games for hours every day and never get bored....However, I did replay Starcraft 1 and Braid not long ago and really enjoyed both of those experiences. I guess I am just tired of these 'on rails' Call of Duty type of games.

I have the exact same sentiment as yours. Am sick of on rails type of gameplay.. now I spend most of the time playing Indie games, Online FPS and Racing.

Maybe ADHD crept in as we get older 😛

 

[Soulkeeper]

we've got a lot to look forward to next year
28nm for GPUs
Doom4 and other big titles will come out too 🙂
Maybe things have been slow the last year, but i'm hoping next year will be great.

 

[nemesismk2]

we've got a lot to look forward to next year
28nm for GPUs
Doom4 and other big titles will come out too 🙂
Maybe things have been slow the last year, but i'm hoping next year will be great.

I've always been a big fan of Doom so hopefully Doom 4 is released for the PC 🙂

 

[Josh123]

This is kind of what I was asking about in my post a few minutes ago. My old 8800GTS is still going strong and runs mostly all games that are out fine even at high settings. Granted it would have problems if I had a higher resolution LCD but still. I don't think gaming companies are pushing out games with higher end graphics. I am on the same boat about consoles holding back PC development.