Gaming PC, second time building need advice for 3 machines.

[mithcol]

Hi, about 2 years ago I used this forum for help with putting together a gaming build that I was very happy with (and had a great time putting together on a warm summer day, still remember the feeling ). I am happy to see those who helped still post on this forum helping other novice builders like me. Im about to build my second third and fourth computer (all identical) so I wanted to come here again for advice on parts.

1. What YOUR PC will be used for.
strictly gaming


2. What YOUR budget is.
500 per computer including case (not including monitor, mouse, keyboard, OS)


3. What country YOU will be buying YOUR parts from.
usa

5. IF YOU have a brand preference. That means, are you an Intel-Fanboy, AMD-Fanboy, ATI-Fanboy, nVidia-Fanboy, Seagate-Fanboy, WD-Fanboy, etc.
I dont know know much about this stuff


6. If YOU intend on using any of YOUR current parts, and if so, what those parts are.
no parts


7. IF YOU plan on overclocking or run the system at default speeds.
not sure what this means but the games i will play are Diablo3, Path of Exile, Guild wars 2, Dota2. I would like to run them all on high settings, if I have to increase the budget to do that I will consider it.


8. What resolution, not monitor size, will you be using?
I would also like to take your advice on a good gaming monitor up to around $300 (no need for 3d)


9. WHEN do you plan to build it?
2-3 weeks


Thanks again everyone for your help.

 

[mfenn]

Does the budget include OS? That really makes a difference in a low cost build like this one (20% of overall).

 

[mithcol]

Does the budget include OS? That really makes a difference in a low cost build like this one (20% of overall).

I have an OS, edited up there to. Thanks

 

[RayTheKing]

A pentium with a 7770/A10-6800k with fast RAM is probably the sweet spot for your budget. However, I don't think you'll be able to get really good frames on on high in GW2 at a ≥1080p resolution.

 

[RayTheKing]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814121704
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819116950
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813135353
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820313344
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811146075
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817139026
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822148840
Sadly, it goes around 60 bucks under your budget when you include Win7/8. You can downgrade the GPU (7770 or NV equivalent) and get 4 GB of RAM in order to get the budget down to 500-ish.

PS: I didn't include the optical drive as you can boot the OS on the PC through a USB drive. If you do need a drive, there are always a few decent ones in the 15-20 dollar range. However, they don't do Blu Ray

 

[Essence_of_War]

CPU: Athlon x4 760k - $77(!!) temp out of stock, but you can still order it at $77 and amazon will deliver when available.
MoBo: MSI FM2/A75MA-E35 - $56 - the cheapest you can go and still get usb 3.0 and sata 6Gb/s ports in case you ever want an SSD.
RAM: 2x4GB Team Vulcan - $62 after promo, ends 10/7
GPU: Sapphire 7790 - $115 AR
HDD : 1 TB Seagate Barracuda - $60 after promo till 10/9
Case: Rosewill Line-M mAtx - $37, order soon!
PSU: XFX 550W Pro - $62 AR, promo, a SeaSonic design, excellent
ODD : Lite-On - $15 w/ promo if you buy it by 10/9

= $484

I think it'd be tough to do much better than that for <$500.

Edit: for monitors, for strictly gaming I'd go with:
Asus 24'' 144Hz
OR
Dell u2412hm if you prefer 16:10 and IPS to higher refresh + TN.

 

[monkeydelmagico]

I think it'd be tough to do much better than that for <$500.

Not really tough:


http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboB...=Combo.1397357

and

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102999

$508 before rebates......$448.- after. 1 class higher CPU and GPU for less money AR.

Edit: For 3 builds if you want all the rebates might have to have items shipped or redeemed at other adresses

 

[lehtv]

Nice build monkeydelmagico but you failed to mention it has a significantly worse PSU and case, a board with no SATA 6gb/s or USB 3.0 (ouch), and a smaller hard drive.

EDIT: here's another take (many deals will not be active in 2-3 weeks though)

Intel i3-3240 3.4GHz $110 AP
Asrock H77M $65
2x4GB Team Vulcan $59 AP
Sapphire 7850 $145 AR
Seagate 1TB $60 AP
Corsair CX600 $38 AR AP
Rosewill Ranger-M $25 AP

= $502 AR AP

A built in DVD drive shouldn't be needed these days, can install Windows from USB. If there are occasions you still need DVDs, get a USB DVD drive to share with the PC's. E.g. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16827151262 $31 (compared to ~$50 if you buy an internal DVD drive for each PC)

 

[monkeydelmagico]

Nice build monkeydelmagico but you failed to mention it has a significantly worse PSU and case, a board with no SATA 6gb/s or USB 3.0 (ouch), and a smaller hard drive.

EDIT: here's another take (many deals will not be active in 2-3 weeks though)

Intel i3-3240 3.4GHz $110 AP
Asrock H77M $65
2x4GB Team Vulcan $59 AP
Sapphire 7850 $145 AR
Seagate 1TB $60 AP
Corsair CX600 $38 AR AP
Rosewill Ranger-M $25 AP

= $502 AR AP

A built in DVD drive shouldn't be needed these days, can install Windows from USB. If there are occasions you still need DVDs, get a USB DVD drive to share with the PC's. E.g. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16827151262 $31 (compared to ~$50 if you buy an internal DVD drive for each PC)

Nice build lehtv but you failed to mention that a dual core is considered to be inadequate for the newest crop of games. The rest of your build is far superior.... for a price.

Regardless, should the OP decide to take most of your build and substitute this FX 6300 and mobo combo it would save him $20.- AR allowing for a DVD drive...

 

[RayTheKing]

For 15 bucks more, OP can get a HD 7870 Ghz:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814127722

 

[mfenn]

Nice build lehtv but you failed to mention that a dual core is considered to be inadequate for the newest crop of games. The rest of your build is far superior.... for a price.

Regardless, should the OP decide to take most of your build and substitute this
combo it would save him $20.- AR allowing for a DVD drive...

You can't compare core counts between AMD and Intel. An FX-6300 only has 3 floating point units (one shared between each two integer cores), so its gaming performance isn't quite as good as the raw core count might lead you to believe. The higher IPC of the Ivy Bridge dual-core largely makes up for the third effective floating point core in the AMD.

That being said, I think the (a) the games the OP is interested in aren't CPU-limited and (b) the two CPUs are close enough in performance that it makes sense to save the $10 by going with the AMD combo.

The rest of lehtv's build is great.

 

[lehtv]

Nice build lehtv but you failed to mention that a dual core is considered to be inadequate for the newest crop of games. The rest of your build is far superior.... for a price.

The games he mentioned were Dota2, GW2, Diablo 2 and Path of Exile.

Dota2: FX-8350 performs worse than i3-3220, with only GTX 650 Ti as graphics card

GW2: Basically, a Sandy Bridge pentium is better than an AMD octocore

Diablo 3: runs great on anything

Can't find info on Path of Exile.

As for the newest games, an Ivy Bridge is still much faster per core than a Vishera. The majority of new games are 4-core, in such games i3-3220 = AMD FX 4000 or higher. The number of heavily hyperthreaded games is very small. And it doesn't seem like the OP is interested in games like Battlefield 3 or Crysis 3, but in the event that better multicore performance is required, these PC's are quite easy to upgrade to a used i5-35xx or a new Xeon 1230 V2.

 

[Essence_of_War]

Not really tough:


http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboB...=Combo.1397357

and

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102999

$508 before rebates......$448.- after. 1 class higher CPU and GPU for less money AR.

Edit: For 3 builds if you want all the rebates might have to have items shipped or redeemed at other adresses

Eh, you got a better CPU and GPU, but that board is missing sata6Gb/s and USB 3.0 (which I specifically noted that I was willing to pay extra for, btw), that PSU is not from one of Rosewill's known-to-be-good lines, and you're overpaying for HDD capacity. Admittedly, lacking sata6 isn't super important NOW since OP doesn't have the budget for SSDs NOW, but it seems kind of lame to hamstring yourself for a common (and easy!) upgrade later. And while I consider USB 3.0 to be non-negotiable, I understand that other people may evaluate that differently.

That FX combo is pretty good though. A straight swap puts it just out of the OP's budget range, but if OP takes lehtv's advice and gets a usb dvd player to share between all 3 for installing OS and what not, I'd go for it. :thumbsup:

 

[monkeydelmagico]

As for the newest games, an Ivy Bridge is still much faster per core than a Vishera. The majority of new games are 4-core, in such games i3-3220 = AMD FX 4000 or higher. The number of heavily hyperthreaded games is very small. And it doesn't seem like the OP is interested in games like Battlefield 3 or Crysis 3, but in the event that better multicore performance is required, these PC's are quite easy to upgrade to a used i5-35xx or a new Xeon 1230 V2.

Definitely agree on the upgrade path. I still think the FX 6300 is the better performer at the current time. I'm sure we could go back and forth with benchmark data but I'll concede because I'm not sure how well the AMD AM3 will upgrade. A couple years down the road swapping out the i3 for an i5/i7 and a GPU upgrade makes your build much more attractive in my opinion.

 

[sm625]

Because its 3 machines in what is obviously a single-use (gaming only) type scenario, I would recommend only 2x2GB of RAM. That money is better spent on more video card. Also check prices on 3 and 6 DIMM kits since you need 6 DIMMS and they may or may not be cheaper than 3 pairs.

You have to look at your budget as $1500 and then look at how much you are spending on each component. $200+ on RAM is simply way too much. Ideally for the perfect gaming build you want to spend half ($750) on GPU and half($750) on everything else. You wont get there by spending $200 on memory.

The same logic applies to storage. $200 is too much storage. I am guessing you are not going to need as much space because you wont be installing a boatload of games on these. I would consider purchasing a LOT of 4-5 used raptor 80GB HDDs off ebay. (Search: raptor lot) About a year ago I bought 3 for $40. You should be able to pick up 4 or 5 for under $15 apiece. That gives you a spare and puts you way ahead. By cutting those corners I think you might be able to fit 3 7870s into the budget.

 

[mfenn]

Because its 3 machines in what is obviously a single-use (gaming only) type scenario, I would recommend only 2x2GB of RAM. That money is better spent on more video card. Also check prices on 3 and 6 DIMM kits since you need 6 DIMMS and they may or may not be cheaper than 3 pairs.

You have to look at your budget as $1500 and then look at how much you are spending on each component. $200+ on RAM is simply way too much. Ideally for the perfect gaming build you want to spend half ($750) on GPU and half($750) on everything else. You wont get there by spending $200 on memory.

The same logic applies to storage. $200 is too much storage. I am guessing you are not going to need as much space because you wont be installing a boatload of games on these. I would consider purchasing a LOT of 4-5 used raptor 80GB HDDs off ebay. (Search: raptor lot) About a year ago I bought 3 for $40. You should be able to pick up 4 or 5 for under $15 apiece. That gives you a spare and puts you way ahead. By cutting those corners I think you might be able to fit 3 7870s into the budget.

Which build are you referring to? Lehtv's outline would spend $177 on RAM and $180 on storage.

At any rate, 80 GB is probably not enough storage per machine. For this type of "ready-made LAN party" system, you want to have a LOT of games installed at once so you can pick up and play whatever. Nothing kills the mood faster than waiting for 3 people to download a 5 GB game.

 

[mithcol]

Hey guys, thanks for all that advice, I really enjoyed trying to figure out what most of it means and I Think Ive got most of it figured out. I also wanted to point out that I forgot to mention two other games to my list Civilization 5 and Age of empires 3. Dont know how much of a difference that could make but thought it should be mentioned.

Also Im still looking for a suggestion for a monitor for this build. Around $200-$300.

thanks again for all this, I would be completely lost without this forum.

 

[Essence_of_War]

I'll re-iterate my monitor recommendations from above:

Asus VG248QE - 24'', 1920x1080, 144Hz refresh TN
OR
Dell u2412m - 1920x1200, 24'' 60Hz IPS.

They're on the higher end of your monitor budget they're both great picks.

This one's on the lower budget end, but also excellent:
Dell u2312hm 23'' - 1920x1080 23'' 60Hz IPS

 

[mithcol]

I'll re-iterate my monitor recommendations from above:

Asus VG248QE - 24'', 1920x1080, 144Hz refresh TN
OR
Dell u2412m - 1920x1200, 24'' 60Hz IPS.

They're on the higher end of your monitor budget they're both great picks.

This one's on the lower budget end, but also excellent:
Dell u2312hm 23'' - 1920x1080 23'' 60Hz IPS

Missed it from above, thanks Essence.

Im leaning towards one of the dells but I heard alot of controversy about the MS on the monitors not being good for gaming? Though the reviews on Amazon say its fine for even fast games, but then theres others who say playing on anything over 2ms is horrible. Your input?

Also could you give me a brief explanation between the 2 dells that I can understand? except the screen size.

 

[Essence_of_War]

The difference between the two dells is basically just aspect ratio, you get more vertical resolution with the 24'', but actual in-game FOV will depend on game engine. I happen to like 16:10, but I think in practice most games will give slightly larger FOV with the 16:9.

Here are in-depth reviews of them both:
2312hm
2412m

Both of them have low input lag, but whereas the 24'' is ~9ms (~1/2 a frame @ 60Hz) the 23'' had almost no detectable lag (<1/20th of a frame @ 60Hz)

 

[mfenn]

but then theres others who say playing on anything over 2ms is horrible. Your input?

Anybody two says that about a 60Hz monitor is drinking the Kool-aid IMHO. There's so much room to cheat on response time specs that the difference between a 2ms monitor and a 8ms monitor is just who is willing to lie more.

What's more important is input latency as Essence pointed out.