Game of Thrones - TV Series (NO BOOK SPOILERS)

[zinfamous]

Meryn fucking Trant?

It just hit me as I was now re-washing the equipment I've been using all day. (guys--if my chromatin preps are fucked today, I blame you all for the distraction).

This makes tons of sense: We know he's a shitty swordsman, vis-a-vis the Hound. Tywin almost certainly knows it. Jamie certainly knows it. He's also a de-facto representative of the crown's justice.

But the people don't know it. That, and Meryn Trant would be feared/respected by "the people," being the Executioner.

choosing him in a contest against Jamie satisfies the need for the crown to appear strong before the people, and handicap the fight so as not to hurt Jamie.

 

[KeithTalent]

It just hit me as I was now re-washing the equipment I've been using all day.

D:

KT
caps

 

[zinfamous]

I talked about that earlier in this thread.

Problem is, this is a contradiction. The deal was if Oberyn serves justice to Tyrion (a.k.a. find him guilty as Tywin has declared), then Tywin would set up the opportunity for Tyrion to serve justice to the Mountain.

If killing the Mountain is his goal, he is motivated to declare Tyrion guilty, not to champion for his innocence. Personally, if I were Oberyn, I'd sit it out. I mean, there are two possible outcomes if the Mountain champions for the crown. (1) He wins, Tyrion is found guilty, and Tywin then pays back the debt with the opportunity to serve justice to the Mountain, or (2) The Mountain loses, Tyrion is found innocent not by Oberyn's sword skills, and justice has been served.

Oberyn is a smart guy, take your chances the Mountain will be killed off, and if not you have your chance in round 2, maybe even with a less than full strength Mountain, and have the opportunity to fight on your own terms more suitable to winning.

That also somewhat suggests that Tywin was expecting a trial by combat all along, so that he could put the two together.

I'm sure that, when confronted by the request from Oberyn to make this deal, Tywin wasn't considering that the meeting would happen at the trial.

 

[Phoenix86]

It just hit me as I was now re-washing the equipment I've been using all day. (guys--if my chromatin preps are fucked today, I blame you all for the distraction).

This makes tons of sense: We know he's a shitty swordsman, vis-a-vis the Hound. Tywin almost certainly knows it. Jamie certainly knows it. He's also a de-facto representative of the crown's justice.

But the people don't know it. That, and Meryn Trant would be feared/respected by "the people," being the Executioner.

choosing him in a contest against Jamie satisfies the need for the crown to appear strong before the people, and handicap the fight so as not to hurt Jamie.

I need to stop advancing your theories when mine is clearly correct.

 

[VulgarDisplay]

I still dont understand why everyone thinks the mountain is a fugitive. He's not. Tywin said he could arrange meeting with the mountain for oberyn. How does he do that if the mountain is a fugitive?

Also, the kings justice is ilyn Payne, not meryn "fucking" trant.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

I still dont understand why everyone thinks the mountain is a fugitive. He's not. Tywin said he could arrange meeting with the mountain for oberyn. How does he do that if the mountain is a fugitive?

Also, the kings justice is ilyn Payne, not meryn "fucking" trant.

I was mixing up the conversation Tywin had with Oberyn and Ned Stark's declaration of the Mountain as a fugitive from Season 1. So when Tywin said that men at war do things beyond the scope of their leaders knowledge, I took that as an admission that the Mountain was still on the lam, which doesn't make much sense given that the Mountain was at Harrenhall with Tywin in Season 2. My mistake.

Is Ilyn Payne still around though? I mean, theoretically, yes, he is, but the actor who plays him is undergoing cancer treatment so he's not available and Meryn Trant is showing up pretty frequently. It's almost like they wrote Ilyn Payne out of the show for convenience (which is strange given how they seem to have no problem recasting other roles).

 

[BladeVenom]

Is Ilyn Payne still around though? I mean, theoretically, yes, he is, but the actor who plays him is undergoing cancer treatment so he's not available and Meryn Trant is showing up pretty frequently. It's almost like they wrote Ilyn Payne out of the show for convenience (which is strange given how they seem to have no problem recasting other roles).

Spoiler

Bronn is taking the place of Ilyn Payne. Jaime would have practiced against Ilyne, since Ilyne wouldn't talk.

 

[DesiPower]

Trail by mother fvckin combat, OH MY GOD, wow just wow... can this get any more crazy... wow

 

[VulgarDisplay]

Hard to believe tyrion is going to kill Jaime this Sunday.






J/k obviously

 

[nageov3t]

Hard to believe tyrion is going to kill

Spoiler

Daryl

this Sunday.

fixed

 

[MagickMan]

I rewatched the season thus far, and the next preview and here are my thoughts...

Spoiler

I think Oberyn will get his wish, he'll end up fighting Gregor Clegane in Tyrion's trial. In a major screw-up, Cersei will choose the Mountain as her champion, believing it will keep anyone from wanting to take Tyrion's side, given his monstrous reputation. However, she miscalculates how much the Dornish prince wants revenge, and he leaps at the chance to fight Clegane. In the end, he kills the big bastard through sheer skill, maybe bleeding him out by inflicting dozens of small wounds.

 

[MagickMan]

I still dont understand why everyone thinks the mountain is a fugitive. He's not. Tywin said he could arrange meeting with the mountain for oberyn. How does he do that if the mountain is a fugitive?

Also, the kings justice is ilyn Payne, not meryn "fucking" trant.

People have gotten Gregor (the Mountain) and Sandor (the Hound) confused.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

My thoughts...

Spoiler

Rewatched the season thus far, and I think Oberyn will get his wish, he'll end up fighting Gregor Clegane in Tyrion's trial. In a major screw-up, Cersei will choose the Mountain as her champion, believing it will keep anyone from wanting to take Tyrion's side. However, she miscalculates how much the Dornish prince wants revenge, and he leaps at the chance to fight Clegane. In the end, he kills the big bastard through sheer skill, maybe bleeding him out by inflicting dozens of small wounds.

You don't need spoiler tags around this if it's just speculation. If it's expressly stated in the books, you shouldn't be posting it in here regardless. But this thread is basically people without book knowledge wildly speculating about what we assume will happen (and generally being very wrong).

 

[MagickMan]

Nope, I stopped reading the series well before this point. That just seems to be the most logical outcome, given the players involved. Given there are people around here who don't even watch show previews (I do), I figured it was best to just cover it up.

 

[zinfamous]

I still dont understand why everyone thinks the mountain is a fugitive. He's not. Tywin said he could arrange meeting with the mountain for oberyn. How does he do that if the mountain is a fugitive?

Also, the kings justice is ilyn Payne, not meryn "fucking" trant.

ah shit, then.

well wtf is Meryn Trant other than some dude who didn't kill Syrio D) and testified to some bullshit?

was he also the dude that stabbed that baby?

 

[manimal]

whats up with Shae's necklace at the trial? Is that house sigil?

 

[bononos]

See, this is why you and Zin make yourselves look so bad arguing these nonsensical points. All you do with each passing breath is demonstrate that you either don't watch the show, don't understand the show, or both.

When Tywin met Oberyn in the brothel to ask him to be one of the judges he expressly PROMISED to arrange a way to get Gregor and Oberyn together. So Tywin calls Gregor back, Gregor is the Crown's champion and Tywin pays his debt to Oberyn. What part of that is so difficult for you?

How would Tywin be so sure that Tyrion would call for a trial by combat and that Oberyn would agree to be his champion?
Tywin wanted Tyrion to admit his guilt and beg for mercy and be sent to the wall. I would think that serving up the Mountain doesn't mean having to fight the freak.

 

[bononos]

The teasers for season 4 shows a duel and you can make out or at least make a good guess on both persons especially if you freeze it.

 

[The Boston Dangler]

ah shit, then.

well wtf is Meryn Trant other than some dude who didn't kill Syrio D) and testified to some bullshit?

was he also the dude that stabbed that baby?

the king's guard that killed robert's bastard in the whorehouse was janus slynt (if that doesn't sound like vulgar slang for vagina, idk what does). afaik, that is the only fight he's won. when tyrion was hand of the king, he gave slynt his walking papers and sent him to the wall where he's currently douchecanoe #2.

 

[JEDI]

I rewatched the season thus far, and the next preview and here are my thoughts...

Spoiler

I think Oberyn will get his wish, he'll end up fighting Gregor Clegane in Tyrion's trial. In a major screw-up, Cersei will choose the Mountain as her champion, believing it will keep anyone from wanting to take Tyrion's side, given his monstrous reputation. However, she miscalculates how much the Dornish prince wants revenge, and he leaps at the chance to fight Clegane. In the end, he kills the big bastard through sheer skill, maybe bleeding him out by inflicting dozens of small wounds.

well, since the preview shows the Mountain, it's a no brainer that the crown will pick him as their champion.

why else would he all of a sudden appear in the episode? we haven't seen him since season 1 in the joust tourny.

now who Tyrion will pick is still up for grabs: Jamie or bronn
Jamie would be the obvious political choice. tywin would order the mountain not to kill Jamie but still win. that gives Jamie a chance since the mountain is holding back.

wildcard: oberyn might volunteer

 

[quikah]

the king's guard that killed robert's bastard in the whorehouse was janus slynt (if that doesn't sound like vulgar slang for vagina, idk what does). afaik, that is the only fight he's won. when tyrion was hand of the king, he gave slynt his walking papers and sent him to the wall where he's currently douchecanoe #2.

Janus slynt was captain of the gold cloaks (city watch).

 

[The Boston Dangler]

Janus slynt was captain of the gold cloaks (city watch).

indeed he was. they're all shiny goons to me

 

[MagickMan]

well, since the preview shows the Mountain, it's a no brainer that the crown will pick him as their champion.

why else would he all of a sudden appear in the episode? we haven't seen him since season 1 in the joust tourny.

now who Tyrion will pick is still up for grabs: Jamie or bronn
Jamie would be the obvious political choice. tywin would order the mountain not to kill Jamie but still win. that gives Jamie a chance since the mountain is holding back.

wildcard: oberyn might volunteer

There's no wildcard about it, I can't see the prince of Dorne passing up the chance to kill Gregor, legally and in front of witnesses, if Cersei chooses the Mountain (which I think is most likely), and Tyrion would be a fool to not let him, there's no one more deadly in all the 7 kingdoms.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

How would Tywin be so sure that Tyrion would call for a trial by combat and that Oberyn would agree to be his champion?
Tywin wanted Tyrion to admit his guilt and beg for mercy and be sent to the wall. I would think that serving up the Mountain doesn't mean having to fight the freak.

He didn't. At that point he didn't care. He promised to get Gregor back into town for Oberyn to extract his revenge as payment for Oberyn to be a judge on the trial. At that point Tywin just assumed Oberyn would kill Gregor some other way. He didn't care, it got him what he wanted from Oberyn. Now that he's bringing Gregor into town anyway he'll use Gregor as the Crown's champion.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

There's no wildcard about it, I can't see the prince of Dorne passing up the chance to kill Gregor, legally and in front of witnesses, if Cersei chooses the Mountain (which I think is most likely), and Tyrion would be a fool to not let him, there's no one more deadly in all the 7 kingdoms.

Of course Oberyn will volunteer. He's got Gregor coming into town specifically so that he'll have a chance to kill him. Tywin will use Gregor as the Crown's champion and Oberyn will stand up for Tyrion so that he gets to kill Gregor before anyone else has a chance. Of all the convoluted plotting that goes on in GOT this is one of the simplest things to figure out and still a couple of people here can't grasp it.