Game of Thrones - TV Series (NO BOOK SPOILERS)

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desura

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2013
4,627
129
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The whole point of GoT is that it isn't a fairy tale with a clear protagonist and a "good triumphs over evil" happy ending. It's a story where the people who believe that good always triumphs end up dead at the hands of people who don't waste their time believing in such simplistic bullshit.
It could still have been done without killing Ned Stark so quickly.

Sean Bean was the heart and soul of the show IMO. He really brought the Irish into the role.
 

GagHalfrunt

Lifer
Apr 19, 2001
25,301
1,990
126
It could still have been done without killing Ned Stark so quickly.

Sean Bean was the heart and soul of the show IMO. He really brought the Irish into the role.
Yeah, okay. And Hamlet would have been so much better if Claudius didn't kill his father so everyone could have lived happily ever after.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,981
14
81
Most here would have missed those two innuendos.

Arya is probably one of the most badass characters.

She is just running down her list of names no matter at what cost, what favor, what political catastrophe it causes.

...and now she has her Needle. Passes as guy or girl. Disappears from crowds.

She is a fucking killing machine.

Jaime should stick her on his hand and strap her on!
 

Sable

Golden Member
Jan 7, 2006
1,098
36
91
For me, I still haven't quite recovered from the death of Ned Stark. If I were a tv exec, the big change I would have made from the books would have been him living. Season 2 really suffered IMO from Ned Stark having died. Season 3 (I'm almost finished) is finally picking up the pieces...
Ha, wait till the end of season 4...
 

cubby1223

Lifer
May 24, 2004
13,525
42
86
For me, I still haven't quite recovered from the death of Ned Stark. If I were a tv exec, the big change I would have made from the books would have been him living. Season 2 really suffered IMO from Ned Stark having died. Season 3 (I'm almost finished) is finally picking up the pieces...
The way I saw it, the death of Ned Stark allows his children to grow independently without the boundary of a powerful parent directing them.




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I'm late to the Game of Thrones watching, so if this has been discussed before, be kind. What bothers me is how early on when Daenerys was, to put it bluntly, her brother's property to pass around to the barbarians, her plot line was given at least 15 minutes every episode. Now that she is an independent and strong leader, she has been getting like 5 minutes every second episode. I've not read the books, don't know what percentage of pages are to her plot line, but I mean, come on, the dragons are way more interesting than many of the scenes that consume the remainder of the show!
 

AViking

Platinum Member
Sep 12, 2013
2,264
1
0
I'm late to the Game of Thrones watching, so if this has been discussed before, be kind. What bothers me is how early on when Daenerys was, to put it bluntly, her brother's property to pass around to the barbarians, her plot line was given at least 15 minutes every episode. Now that she is an independent and strong leader, she has been getting like 5 minutes every second episode. I've not read the books, don't know what percentage of pages are to her plot line, but I mean, come on, the dragons are way more interesting than many of the scenes that consume the remainder of the show!
There's not much more to tell on her story line. I really don't think we want to hear people complain for 10 minutes that her dragons are eating their sheep. It's boring.
 

AViking

Platinum Member
Sep 12, 2013
2,264
1
0
That's just odd. Granted, I didn't read the books, and I would say that Season 2 was the weakest season so far, but the weakest season in one of the best television shows of all time is still incredible. "Hating" it just seems ridiculous.
You didn't read the books is key...

Season 1 stayed pretty true. Season two drifted a lot and with the books fresh in my mind it bothered me. That's the whole point with what I said above - now that it has been a while since I read the books I can enjoy the show much more since details are forgotten.
 

KeithTalent

Elite Member | Administrator | No Lifer
Administrator
Nov 30, 2005
50,243
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116
Boy, some people just cannot help themselves. :\ Welp, guess I am done with this thread now too. It's been fun.

KT
 

desura

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2013
4,627
129
101
I always thought that Sean Bean was Irish because of his name and because he played an IRA terrorist in one of the Tom Clancy films. Guess not. He's as English as they come.

Just finished the "red wedding" last night. Left a ghastly feeling.

Kinda fucked up because with the typical hero narrative, a boy becomes a man with the death of his father. So by most conventions, it should have been Robb Stark's story.
 
Feb 6, 2007
16,439
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Kinda fucked up because with the typical hero narrative, a boy becomes a man with the death of his father. So by most conventions, it should have been Robb Stark's story.
To be fair, there are still a lot of Starks running around. Or, more accurately, sitting around (Sansa), riding around (Arya), getting dragged around (Bran) and who really knows (Rickon)... But, yeah, it's definitely not the traditional "you killed my father, prepare to die" story.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,028
75
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Boy, some people just cannot help themselves. :\ Welp, guess I am done with this thread now too. It's been fun.

KT
I don't think there were any spoilers after the incident of the guy claiming what he was saying wasn't, when it was. I suppose the books being split up might be construed as a spoiler, but it is really supposed to be one 2,000 page book that all happens at the same time, and rather than split it up at a logical break point, GRRM decided to just remove half the characters and put them in the next book.
I suppose Tyrion being in the upcoming books is a spoiler, because you know he doesn't die this season, at the very least.


Honestly, I think they will split books 4 and 5 into at least 3 seasons. So, GRRM has around 4 years to finish the 6th and likely another 2 if that isn't the end of the series.

Just finished the "red wedding" last night. Left a ghastly feeling.

Kinda fucked up because with the typical hero narrative, a boy becomes a man with the death of his father. So by most conventions, it should have been Robb Stark's story.
GRRM did a really good job painting the picture of basic good vs evil and then a good job showing that the perception is not always true, as quite a few believe Rhaegar eloped, not went out and kidnapped; the Targaryans weren't all such awful people, as viewed by Robert.
 

GagHalfrunt

Lifer
Apr 19, 2001
25,301
1,990
126
Kinda fucked up because with the typical hero narrative, a boy becomes a man with the death of his father. So by most conventions, it should have been Robb Stark's story.
When I read the books ages ago long before HBO got the rights Robb's death was far more shocking to me than Ned's death. Ned's was an incredible moment, it was the key event, but after he died and Robert died and Renly died it looked like the path was clear. Robb for the forces of good, Joffrey for the forces of evil, Danny on the other side of the world and each would eventually consolidate their forces for some cataclysmic showdown. Robb getting whacked totally stuck a pin in that idea. At that point not only did I not have the slightest clue about the potential players in the endgame, I didn't believe that anyone was safe. From that point I read every subsequent chapter expecting the worst.
 

desura

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2013
4,627
129
101
To be fair, there are still a lot of Starks running around. Or, more accurately, sitting around (Sansa), riding around (Arya), getting dragged around (Bran) and who really knows (Rickon)... But, yeah, it's definitely not the traditional "you killed my father, prepare to die" story.
Yes, and no. Most of them are too young to really make a difference now. At this point, their holdings are all lost and they'll become wandering mystics.

Sansa is the oldest but she is always crying. And judging by the timeline of the seasons so far, by the conclusion Bran might be like 15 or 16.
 

Feneant2

Golden Member
May 26, 2004
1,418
30
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Best episode in the series I think... the writing was top notch, a good amount of violence, comedy/satire, nudity, etc. This episode was probably the closest to reading the book in terms of everything being gratuitously over the top- loved every moment of it.
 

desura

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2013
4,627
129
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The problem is that by killing off so many hero characters so aggressively, there is a good chance that there won't be enough heart left in the entire thing to make it through. Right now it is looking like the series is headed in two annoying directions:

"free the slaves" dragon queen

and

"ice zombies attack".

I would have delayed Ned's death until the end of season 2, and at worst I would have sent Robb into exile someplace.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,028
75
86
The problem is that by killing off so many hero characters so aggressively, there is a good chance that there won't be enough heart left in the entire thing to make it through. Right now it is looking like the series is headed in two annoying directions:

"free the slaves" dragon queen

and

"ice zombies attack".

I would have delayed Ned's death until the end of season 2, and at worst I would have sent Robb into exile someplace.
The story is about the political situation in a medieval land with some magic elements long since past that resurface. And, in those times, guess what? People died; lots of them. Even the most idealistic good guy could be manipulated and killed. People without power wanted it and would strive, by any means, to get it.

Delaying Ned's death ruins pretty much the entire story. We don't need another season of Ned playing detective and Robert playing fat drunkard. Robb was marching on the throne, with the intent to destroy the person sitting atop it (just like his father and Robert years before). There was no exile far enough to send him to where he would cease to be a threat. He raised an army and marched on the king. The only way to stop him (and anyone else) was to kill him and his family. The Lannisters were forced into action, as they only had power because people feared them. The Starks no longer fearing them gives way for others to take the same liberties, eroding their power. Power can only be given or taken, and if someone won't give it, you have to take it. Tywin understands this. The Targaryans understood this.

And, what you would have done is pretty irrelevant. You're neither an accomplished fantasy writer, nor a television director. If you happen to be either, please feel free to correct me.
 
Feb 6, 2007
16,439
1
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The problem is that by killing off so many hero characters so aggressively, there is a good chance that there won't be enough heart left in the entire thing to make it through. Right now it is looking like the series is headed in two annoying directions:

"free the slaves" dragon queen

and

"ice zombies attack".

I would have delayed Ned's death until the end of season 2, and at worst I would have sent Robb into exile someplace.
You would have ruined the show. Who honestly complains about a series spiraling towards a conclusion that seems poised to bring a global war between all of humanity, ice zombies and dragons? "Yeah, that sounds epic and all, but what I really want to see is more of this emo prince whining about his daddy and making boneheaded war decisions because he's too busy boning a hot nurse to think rationally..."
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,981
14
81
The problem is that by killing off so many hero characters so aggressively, there is a good chance that there won't be enough heart left in the entire thing to make it through. Right now it is looking like the series is headed in two annoying directions:

"free the slaves" dragon queen

and

"ice zombies attack".

I would have delayed Ned's death until the end of season 2, and at worst I would have sent Robb into exile someplace.
It would have changed the whole story.

GRRM writes in a way where it's not all rainbows and happy endings.
 

smackababy

Lifer
Oct 30, 2008
27,028
75
86
It would have changed the whole story.

GRRM writes in a way where it's not all rainbows and happy endings.
He also has a very nice sense of irony. The fact that Jaime sacrifices his honor to remove one mad king (saving half a million people) and Cersei sacrifices pretty much everyone besides her family putting another on the throne.
 

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