Gabe Newell: "Linux is the future of gaming", announcements forthcoming

[Pheran]

I was torn about which forum to post this in since the announcement might be a console-like "Steam Box", but since Steam right now is in the realm of PC gaming, I chose here.

Linux is the future of gaming

Gabe Newell, the co-founder and managing director of Valve, said today that Linux is the future of gaming despite the minuscule share of the market it has today.
...
"Next week we're going to be rolling out more information about how we get there and what are the hardware opportunities we see for bringing Linux into the living room," Newell said.

I definitely support the effort to bring more games to Linux, especially since Win7 may be the last Microsoft OS I ever run if they don't come to their senses.




Discussion continues here: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2343687


Anandtech Moderator
KeithTalent

 

[Red Storm]

I look forward to what they have to show.

 

[drebo]

He's full of shit and just blowing smoke.

The only reason he's saying this is because he wants other developers to develop for his piece of shit Steambox, which isn't going to happen.

Linux is not unified enough to be useful to anyone outside of tech-savvy tinkerers. Every distro has a different idea of what Linux should be and the driver model sucks ass (although it is better than it used to be.)

The only way Linux works is if it's handled like Apple does OSX: limited set of "approved" hardware that's tested and tested and tested some more. The problem is that this flies in the face of what a PC traditionally was supposed to be and people aren't really going to stand for it.

Anecdotally, my wife had an original EeePC from ASUS with their Linux on it. She was able to use it, but only just. She much preferred her old Windows XP because it was easier, faster, and less obtuse. Granted, this is just one distro, but I foresee the same issues regardless of what the distro is.

If Valve wants to release Valvlix and support it, more power to them. But to expect that gamers and game companies are going to move that direction is just plain silly.

 

[pcslookout]

He's full of shit and just blowing smoke.

The only reason he's saying this is because he wants other developers to develop for his piece of shit Steambox, which isn't going to happen.

Linux is not unified enough to be useful to anyone outside of tech-savvy tinkerers. Every distro has a different idea of what Linux should be and the driver model sucks ass (although it is better than it used to be.)

The only way Linux works is if it's handled like Apple does OSX: limited set of "approved" hardware that's tested and tested and tested some more. The problem is that this flies in the face of what a PC traditionally was supposed to be and people aren't really going to stand for it.

Anecdotally, my wife had an original EeePC from ASUS with their Linux on it. She was able to use it, but only just. She much preferred her old Windows XP because it was easier, faster, and less obtuse. Granted, this is just one distro, but I foresee the same issues regardless of what the distro is.

If Valve wants to release Valvlix and support it, more power to them. But to expect that gamers and game companies are going to move that direction is just plain silly.

Yep.

 

[Pheran]

The only way Linux works is if it's handled like Apple does OSX: limited set of "approved" hardware that's tested and tested and tested some more. The problem is that this flies in the face of what a PC traditionally was supposed to be and people aren't really going to stand for it.

You seem to be missing the point - I would expect that's exactly what a Steam Box would be - a standardized set of hardware. People aren't going to stand for a standardized piece of hardware that can play games? Quick, someone contact the millions of game console owners.

I'm not saying it's guaranteed to succeed - far from it. But this objection doesn't make sense to me.

 

[dougp]

Didn't we do this last year when he was complaining about Windows 8?

 

[pcslookout]

Didn't we do this last year when he was complaining about Windows 8?

Yes.

 

[Red Storm]

For those of you who are happy with gaming being tied to Windows and having to buy an OS just to play games, please feel free to continue to enjoy the current setup. Those of us who want an alternative, and more importantly a move away from Microsoft, we look forward to projects that get us one step closer to a free OS utilized by game devs.

 

[smackababy]

This just in! Gabe Newell spewing more garbage the Valve fanboys are going to eat up. Unless their Steambox comes with DirectX support (which would involve them licensing the libraries from MS for a good chunk of money), it will fail. It can come boxed with HL3 and it still won't be anything other than "pay this extra money for HL3".

He wants to compete with consoles now? Sorry, won't happen. And developers aren't going to just suddenly drop DirectX for some new Linux OS because Gabe says it's the future. When it gets more marketshare than OSX, we might start to talk about it even being relevant, until then, I'll enjoy working Bluetooth and Wifi drivers out of the box with Windows.

 

[blackened23]

You seem to be missing the point - I would expect that's exactly what a Steam Box would be - a standardized set of hardware. People aren't going to stand for a standardized piece of hardware that can play games? Quick, someone contact the millions of game console owners.

I'm not saying it's guaranteed to succeed - far from it. But this objection doesn't make sense to me.

So he's going to take a linux distro and "lock it down" and force standardized hardware. I'm sure that'll fly well with linux fans.

I love valve and steam but - I also think he's full of shit this time.

 

[smackababy]

For those of you who are happy with gaming being tied to Windows and having to buy an OS just to play games, please feel free to continue to enjoy the current setup. Those of us who want an alternative, and more importantly a move away from Microsoft, we look forward to projects that get us one step closer to a free OS utilized by game devs.

When OpenGL stops playing catch up to DX and stops having to advertise as having Direct X like features, I'll stop buying Windows for gaming.

 

[Kalmah]

I'm going to remain optimistic for now until we see what exactly gets announced. It does kind of feel like valve might be climbing out on a limb with this but i also find it hard to believe they will do something foolish.

 

[drebo]

You seem to be missing the point - I would expect that's exactly what a Steam Box would be - a standardized set of hardware. People aren't going to stand for a standardized piece of hardware that can play games? Quick, someone contact the millions of game console owners.

I'm not saying it's guaranteed to succeed - far from it. But this objection doesn't make sense to me.

Oh, no, I get the point just fine. But, what you described is called a "Console." And there are already three very well established consoles out. Game developers will make their games for the existing consoles and for Windows (maybe.) Expecting them to port their game to a fourth or fifth platform is not very likely.

Developers are not going to port their games to Linux unless Linux grabs a large percentage of the PC market, and that's just not going to happen under the current Linux ideology.

 

[Red Storm]

When OpenGL stops playing catch up to DX and stops having to advertise as having Direct X like features, I'll stop buying Windows for gaming.

It's not going to happen with the flick of a switch, we need companies like Valve to try and make a push towards Linux use for it to become a reality. The potential upside is we get a free OS for gaming, no more needing to buy Windows. The potential downside is that nothing happens and we keep on gaming as we have been. What is there to lose? Nothing, so I don't understand the people who are bitching about Valve. They aren't taking away your Windows games so why are you complaining? We're PC gamers, more options, more competition is always better for us.

 

[drebo]

For those of you who are happy with gaming being tied to Windows and having to buy an OS just to play games, please feel free to continue to enjoy the current setup. Those of us who want an alternative, and more importantly a move away from Microsoft, we look forward to projects that get us one step closer to a free OS utilized by game devs.

I buy Windows not because I like to play games (although, the same could be said about consoles...what, you buy this hardware and OS just to play games? WTF?!) but because it's far more efficient for desktop work than Linux is.

Don't get me wrong, I've got dozens and dozens of Linux servers, and they're great. But when it comes to getting shit done, Windows has far more and far better tools.

So, no, I don't buy Windows to play games...I buy it to do everything and not have to worry about driver incompatibilities, installs breaking the kernel, etc.

I don't like the idea of going back to NT4 levels of driver support (this is about where Linux is right now.)

 

[smackababy]

It's not going to happen with the flick of a switch, we need companies like Valve to try and make a push towards Linux use for it to become a reality. The potential upside is we get a free OS for gaming, no more needing to buy Windows. The potential downside is that nothing happens and we keep on gaming as we have been. What is there to lose? Nothing, so I don't understand the people who are bitching about Valve. They aren't taking away your Windows games so why are you complaining? We're PC gamers, more options, more competition is always better for us.

The problem is Gabe's rhetoric will spawn thousands of morons on the internet spewing "Linux is the future! Windows 8 sucks" even more than they already are. I can't say I would be hurt if Windows went away for gaming (which it won't, Direct X alone still leads game development, yeah thanks MS). The problem is you then fracture the PC community. Do we really want more Windows vs Linux trolls running around fighting like the PS4 vs Xbox One ones?

Gabe is basically saying "You can buy (yes buy, they aren't running a charity) our Steam box and have Linux games now!" It might eventually be free, but there will be monetizing for Valve. People want to think Gabe is all about openness, but he still holds the key to his walled garden in Steam. Everyone can't just go publish and distribute games on it and let the market sort it out.

 

[drebo]

It's not going to happen with the flick of a switch, we need companies like Valve to try and make a push towards Linux use for it to become a reality. The potential upside is we get a free OS for gaming, no more needing to buy Windows. The potential downside is that nothing happens and we keep on gaming as we have been. What is there to lose? Nothing, so I don't understand the people who are bitching about Valve. They aren't taking away your Windows games so why are you complaining? We're PC gamers, more options, more competition is always better for us.

We aren't bitching about Valve. We're bitching about Gabe Newell making sweeping generalizations about the industry when in reality, they're nothing more than poorly disguised marketing statements about his own company.

It's basically the same thing as when Carmack opens his mouth. It's all bullshit because it doesn't reflect reality.

Like I said before, if Valve releases its own brand of Linux with a limited hardware compatibility list and official support, more power to them. But it isn't going to change anything from the point of view of the consumer or other game developers (unless he gets 30-40% market penetration, of course.)

I mean, look at how many game developers are developing for OSX.

 

[Veliko]

It's not going to happen with the flick of a switch, we need companies like Valve to try and make a push towards Linux use for it to become a reality. The potential upside is we get a free OS for gaming, no more needing to buy Windows. The potential downside is that nothing happens and we keep on gaming as we have been. What is there to lose? Nothing, so I don't understand the people who are bitching about Valve. They aren't taking away your Windows games so why are you complaining? We're PC gamers, more options, more competition is always better for us.

The complaint is that Gabe's comments are just self-serving bullshit.

 

[ImpulsE69]

But....Windows 8 DOES suck..so I don't see anything wrong with this. The best part is none of us are out anything if it fails like we would be buying Windows 8

The difference here is just that. No impact. Unlike most sweeping generalizations that other heads of companies spout:

EA?
MS?
etc etc.

I highly doubt Valve would just stop selling games that run on Windows until there was no market for it. It loses no money either way. Now...let's talk about Microsoft in that scenario...

 

[smackababy]

But....Windows 8 DOES suck..so I don't see anything wrong with this. The best part is none of us are out anything if it fails like we would be buying Windows 8

The difference here is just that. No impact. Unlike most sweeping generalizations that other heads of companies spout:

EA?
MS?
etc etc.

I highly doubt Valve would just stop selling games that run on Windows until there was no market for it. It loses no money either way. Now...let's talk about Microsoft in that scenario...

With exception to not like the Metro UI (which you can get to the original desktop mode anyway), what exactly about Windows 8 sucks? The better memory management? The more secure kernel? The better performance? Yeah... Exactly. More blind hate, which is the problem with Gabe saying anything.

If EA, MS, Ubisoft, Activision, Bank of America, etc comes out and says something: nobody listens because we know they are full of crap. However, if Lord Gabe says something, all the moron Valve fanboys froth at the mouth to anyone who sees just how full of crap he is.

 

[sweenish]

But....Windows 8 DOES suck..so I don't see anything wrong with this. The best part is none of us are out anything if it fails like we would be buying Windows 8

The difference here is just that. No impact. Unlike most sweeping generalizations that other heads of companies spout:

EA?
MS?
etc etc.

I highly doubt Valve would just stop selling games that run on Windows until there was no market for it. It loses no money either way. Now...let's talk about Microsoft in that scenario...

Except where it doesn't. Outside of a UX that you don't have to see for more than 10 seconds a day, 8 is superior to 7 in almost every way.

 

[WildW]

The way I see it, a Steam-box should be a gaming-optimized linux PC, not a linux console. It ought to offer a cheaper way into PC gaming with all its mouse-and-keyboardy-goodness. There is something not quite right about the idea of buying a linux console to run PC ports of console games.

 

[Red Storm]

The way I see it, a Steam-box should be a gaming-optimized linux PC, not a linux console. It ought to offer a cheaper way into PC gaming with all its mouse-and-keyboardy-goodness. There is something not quite right about the idea of buying a linux console to run PC ports of console games.

I believe the end goal is you have a server that has all your games installed on it, and you will be able to stream those games to any device on your LAN. So any machine in your house can be your gaming rig be it the big desktop, the sleek ultrabook or your mobile phone.

Except where it doesn't. Outside of a UX that you don't have to see for more than 10 seconds a day, 8 is superior to 7 in almost every way.

The UI is important. In Windows 7 I can search for a program or file without having my entire screen taken away to a phone UI. I understand why that's needed on a tiny 4 inch screen, but it is absolutely not needed on a 24 inch monitor. That may be one thing, but it's something I use every single day on Windows multiple times so for me Metro is always popping up reminding me how awful it is on a standard keyboard and mouse computer.

 

[desura]

For those of you who are happy with gaming being tied to Windows and having to buy an OS just to play games, please feel free to continue to enjoy the current setup. Those of us who want an alternative, and more importantly a move away from Microsoft, we look forward to projects that get us one step closer to a free OS utilized by game devs.

Yup. Desktops aren't main computers anymore. Laptops are.

Desktops do haev games though...it really sucks configuring out like a $500 pc gaming rig and then realizing that you have to fork over $100 for Windows.

 

[EightySix Four]

It cracks me up that Valve is so angry and concerned about the Windows Store that they are trying to make Linux their main target platform. It makes me laugh even more that the fanboys will eat it up and miss that this is not a technological issue, it is a business one and they are playing right into Valve's hands.

Microsoft showed their cards when they announced the Xbox One with essentially Steam with better features. Whether they launch the Xbox One with it or not, they're still going to push that direction and make sure the PR can keep up. Valve must be terrified of having a Steam competitor baked into one of the most popular consoles and every new computer that ships from the factory.