GA-965P-DS3 v1.3 OC issue

[chiew]

Hey all,
I have the following:

Antec P180B v1.1 case
Antec Truepower Trio 650W PSU

E4300 (stock 1.8ghz at 9*300=2.7ghz, stock voltages)
Scythe Ninja Rev B CPU cooler
Gigabyte 965P DS3 v1.3 (F12 bios) w/ 40mm fan on northbridge

2x1gb crucial ballistix 8500
2x1gb crucial ballistix 6400
(all ram is at 1:1 ratio with my bus, so they are running at 600mhz (2*300) currently)

Windows XP Pro 32 bit OS

My issue is this:
I cannot get above 300 bus speed, no matter what I do. I have tried voltage increases on the core of up to 1.4V, and tried upping all different combinations of the FSB and MCH (+0.1 and +0.2). My RAM is supposed to be run at 2.2V according to manufacturer specifications, and I hear that the DS3 runs the RAM at 1.8V if you opt to use manual voltage settings (you must specify +0.4V to run the RAM at 2.2V). I have basically given up and used all stock voltages (no increase in core, FSB, or MCH), and have been running at 3*900 with 30C idle and 48C load. Not shabby, but I want to break into 3GHz.

I have been using Orthos to stress both cores and the RAM. Usually failures occur when I've run it for less than 10 minutes. Sometimes there will be a blue screen, sometimes the computer will just restart, either at stock settings or the settings I input. Temperatures during the test were acceptable (less than 60C at load in Speedfan v4.32).

Before adding the 40mm fan, the NB was too hot to touch for more than 10 seconds. Now I can touch it for as long as I want.

I should also mention that I followed this guide in almost everything:

http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1169366

The things in which I did deviate from what he specifies:
1) my "SATA ACHI Mode" is set to "Disabled" (if it is Enabled, I do not pass the Windows splash screen)
2) my PCI Express Frequency is 100Mhz (which is stock)

I was wondering if the problem could be the BIOS version. I am running F12. I have heard of others with various revision of the mobo (v1.3, v1.0, etc) touting different BIOS versions as the best. If people with my exact board (GA-965P-DS3 rev1.3) could please post the BIOS version they are using and the speeds they have been able to get (ie 9*300 etc), that would be great. Also please let me know what voltage your core, FSB and MCH are all at. Thank you in advance. Any advice is welcome

 

[Markfw]

Well, I have a DS3 @400 fsb..(with a Q6600) but before that, I had a E4300, and the best OC I could get was 2915 (nor sure the FSB right NOW)

That chip sucks for OC'ing, thats all I can say.

 

[myocardia]

Have you already pin-modded it? They don't overclock very far without pin-mods.

 

[SerpentRoyal]

Post screen shots of CPUz (CPU and MEMORY tabs). E4300 with L2 stepping should be able to reach 3.0GHz.

Clear CMOS. Run only a pair of 8500 (lose the 6400). Bump Vcore to 1.45, Vdimm to 2.1, Vnorthbridge to 1.4, 1:1 memory divider, and 5-5-5-15-2T memory timing. DO NOT RUN RAM AT DEFAULT SETTINGS!


The default setting for DDR2 800 (after clear CMOS) will set the RAM speed to 400MHz with the default 200MHz FSB. If you raise the FSB to 300MHz, then your RAM is probably doing 600MHz! That's way out of spec. This is the most common mistake among novice overclockers.

 

[chiew]

what is the stock northbridge voltage? you said to put it to 1.4V, but all i can do is +0.1, +0.2 (I don't know what those 0.1 and 0.2 are added to).

I currently can't upload any screenies since I don't know how. Kinda noob haha

In any case, CPUZ says that I have Revision L2

Memory is
Frequency = 300.0 Mhz
FSB: DRAM = 1:1
Cas# 4.0 clocks
RAS to CAS 4 clocks
RAS# precharge 4 clocks
Cycle Time 12 clocks
Command Rate 2T

 

[SerpentRoyal]

The nominal northbridge voltage is 1.25. Read the manual to locate the correct parameter to adjust the northbridge voltage. Again, make sure that the RAM is running at 1:1 divider with 2.1Vdimm and 5-5-5-15-2T timing. I can spot check some of your settings with those two screenshots in CPUz. Reread my previous post.

You don't need pin-mod with the E4300 and a decent MB, especially at 300MHz FSB. You could have a dud chip. Go back and check your RAM speed.

 

[chiew]

[
The default setting for DDR2 800 (after clear CMOS) will set the RAM speed to 400MHz with the default 200MHz FSB. If you raise the FSB to 300MHz, then your RAM is probably doing 600MHz! That's way out of spec. This is the most common mistake among novice overclockers.

How is the RAM at 600Mhz a bad thing?
My Crucial sticks are rated as the following:

8500 (1066mhz)
2.2V 5-5-5-15

6400 (800mhz)
2.2V 4-4-4-12

their 667mhz version sticks do
2.2V 3-3-3-12

since my ram is at 600mhz, I tried running them 3-3-3-12, and it is OK at my 9*300 overclock. In the trials that I tried going above 300 bus speed, I loosened the timings to 5-5-5-15.

You said 2.1V dimm? Aren't my sticks rated at 2.2V?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820148069

Also, if you can show me how to post screenshots, I would be more than willing.

 

[chiew]

Clear CMOS. Run only a pair of 8500 (lose the 6400). Bump Vcore to 1.45, Vdimm to 2.1, Vnorthbridge to 1.4, 1:1 memory divider, and 5-5-5-15-2T memory timing. DO NOT RUN RAM AT DEFAULT SETTINGS!

I think I get what you're trying to say. I am NOT running my ram at 600x2 = 1200mhz effective. I am running them at 300x2 = 600mhz effective, as I changed my multiplier to 2x for the RAM (300bus speed, so twice that is 600).

 

[chiew]

Originally posted by: myocardia
Have you already pin-modded it? They don't overclock very far without pin-mods.

I don't plan on pin modding it. Sorry. It has been able to get me to 9*300, and the forum you linked me to had people who had problems getting above 266mhz bus.

 

[SerpentRoyal]

Originally posted by: chiew
what is the stock northbridge voltage? you said to put it to 1.4V, but all i can do is +0.1, +0.2 (I don't know what those 0.1 and 0.2 are added to).

I currently can't upload any screenies since I don't know how. Kinda noob haha

In any case, CPUZ says that I have Revision L2

Memory is
Frequency = 300.0 Mhz
FSB: DRAM = 1:1
Cas# 4.0 clocks
RAS to CAS 4 clocks
RAS# precharge 4 clocks
Cycle Time 12 clocks
Command Rate 2T

Use only two sticks of 8500 and change timing to 5-5-5-15. You need to go into the manual and local the adjustment for northbridge. Bump this value up by 0.2 from nominal. Set CPU multiplier to 9x. If you still cannot get past 300MHz, then run Memtest for one hour to confirm that memory is okay.

Still having problem? Raise Vcore to 1.5, and FSB to 350MHz. There may be a FSB hole with this board and the E4300. If you're local to S Cal, then I can bench your chip with my reference rig.

Can you provide the build date and full code number of this chip? This info is on the box.

BTW, also flash to the latest BIOS before you try these suggestions.

 

[chiew]

On the box it says
FPO/Batch# Q646A634
Pack date was 3/27/07
Interestingly, it says to the left of pack date:
"VERSION #: D80681-003 1.35V max."
Is it possible that this chip has a lower max voltage than other chips? I've noticed that whenever I increase voltages the system loses stability.

 

[chiew]

Thank you for the offer, but I am in the bay area. That was very generous of you though.

I should also note that this CPU gets pretty hot when turned up to 1.4V or more. Not sure if I would want to try 1.5V.

Another interesting thing is upon booting up, and watching the processor usage, I see that it spikes up every now and then and sometimes stays around 30%. Is that normal for just logging in (Windows just starting up?).

 

[SerpentRoyal]

I have BX80557E4300SL9TB
Q641A373
01/18/07 with 1.35V max

Chip is stable up to 3.6GHz with 1.505Vcore


We also purchased four other E4300s during Fry's anniversary sale a few weeks back. All had 01/18/07 as the build date and capable of at least 3.24GHz. If you can't go much higher after flashing the latest BIOS and implementing my other suggestions, then we may have to conclude that the latest L2 E4300 are speed binned by Intel.

Here are my settings:

FSB...384MHz
CPU multi...9x
memory ratio...1:1.25
Vcore...1.465
Vdimm...2.0
Vnorthbridge...1.25
Vsouthbridge...1.5
VTT...1.2
RAM timing...5-4-4-9-2T

I'm using the Abit IP35-E

 

[SerpentRoyal]

Originally posted by: chiew
On the box it says
FPO/Batch# Q646A634
Pack date was 3/27/07
Interestingly, it says to the left of pack date:
"VERSION #: D80681-003 1.35V max."
Is it possible that this chip has a lower max voltage than other chips? I've noticed that whenever I increase voltages the system loses stability.

That's a very interesting observation. Normally, adding more voltage will only raise the CPU core temperature when the chip is at the upper limit of FSB. Bumping Vcore up to 1.45 (<10%) should not cause instability.

I'm wondering if there's something else that is not kosher with your chip.

 

[SerpentRoyal]

Originally posted by: chiew
Thank you for the offer, but I am in the bay area. That was very generous of you though.

I should also note that this CPU gets pretty hot when turned up to 1.4V or more. Not sure if I would want to try 1.5V.

Another interesting thing is upon booting up, and watching the processor usage, I see that it spikes up every now and then and sometimes stays around 30%. Is that normal for just logging in (Windows just starting up?).

Which OS? With a clean install of WXP and no AV or other proggies running in the background, CPU load should remain under 5% two minutes into the boot.

You'll get HDD activities with Vista up to about 5 minutes as data from the HDD is paged to RAM (default setting). Again, CPU load should not exceed 10% with that CPU.

Have you installed the INTEL INF drivers? Disable C1E, EIST, and any thermal throttling in BIOS and retest. It has been a while since my exposure to that MB.

If problem persists, then you may want to swap CPU if purchased locally. Beware of open box item at Fry's.

 

[SerpentRoyal]

Originally posted by: chiew

[
The default setting for DDR2 800 (after clear CMOS) will set the RAM speed to 400MHz with the default 200MHz FSB. If you raise the FSB to 300MHz, then your RAM is probably doing 600MHz! That's way out of spec. This is the most common mistake among novice overclockers.

How is the RAM at 600Mhz a bad thing?
My Crucial sticks are rated as the following:

8500 (1066mhz)
2.2V 5-5-5-15

6400 (800mhz)
2.2V 4-4-4-12

their 667mhz version sticks do
2.2V 3-3-3-12

since my ram is at 600mhz, I tried running them 3-3-3-12, and it is OK at my 9*300 overclock. In the trials that I tried going above 300 bus speed, I loosened the timings to 5-5-5-15.

You said 2.1V dimm? Aren't my sticks rated at 2.2V?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820148069

Also, if you can show me how to post screenshots, I would be more than willing.

Download MWSNAP to capture stuffs on your screen. Register at http://www.xtremesystems.org if you want to post pictures.

 

[chiew]

Which OS? With a clean install of WXP and no AV or other proggies running in the background, CPU load should remain under 5% two minutes into the boot.

You'll get HDD activities with Vista up to about 5 minutes as data from the HDD is paged to RAM (default setting). Again, CPU load should not exceed 10% with that CPU.

Have you installed the INTEL INF drivers? Disable C1E, EIST, and any thermal throttling in BIOS and retest. It has been a while since my exposure to that MB.

If problem persists, then you may want to swap CPU if purchased locally. Beware of open box item at Fry's.

Windows XP Pro 32bit.
When I have time this coming fall I will try harder at this OC. Right now I don't have too much time (aka I should be studying), but I just wanted to get an idea of what I could be doing wrong.

What are the INF drivers? I disabled C1E, EIST, and other features that people recommended to turn off (ie in the guide i linked people to above).

I have thought about dumping my build and starting brand new. I know a 50% OC of 900mhz is nothing to sneeze at (considering a couple years ago people were probably struggling for like 400 more mhz), but I feel like I went the wrong route for my build. My original thinking was that tech depreciates so fast that it isn't worth investing in top of the line stuff. And that is true. My first computer upon coming to college (in 2004) was a Dell P4 3GHz single core with 925X chipset (I didn't even know what it was back then). It had 1gb 533mhz DDR2 ram, and if i remember correctly DDR2 was just coming out. 80GB hard drive, haha. In any case, that computer lasted me three years. I think that was partly because I didn't know much about computers back then and wasn't really an enthusiast, or a semi-enthusiast like I am now. If I knew a thing or two back then I probably wouldn't have gotten a 925X or the DDR2, since those were JUST coming out and proabbly had an associated premium. So that all scared me off from buying the new things coming out now.

Btw, this was my first build and my first OC. I think if I were smarted I would've waited and read more and learned. The good thing is my roommate is looking into getting a value desktop, and I have offered to build it for him. He says he'd be interested in using some of my parts (esp the 800mhz ram). I'm hoping to dump almost everything (except the 2x500GB drives and the 1066mhz ram) and just start from the ground up with something that I can be happy with for a few years, just like my previous computer. I think that will happen once Penryn comes out.

The other thing is I wanted this build to be relatively silent. I succeded in silencing my 7800GT by removing the whiny stock cooler and installing a Artic Cooling accelero x1, which is basically silent. However, the 40mm NB fan that I added is VERY annoying sound wise. I know I could get a fan controller for it, but I think that'd be a waste. I'd rather go with a passively cooled NB, and I know P35's run cool in comparison.

Case isn't that solid either, I had a couple plastic parts snap. Nothing a little krazy glue couldn't fix, but disappointing within 1 month of building it. In the future I will probably go with a Silverstone case and a PC Power & cooling PSU (with one rail instead of the tri-rail I have right now). I like the thought of consolidation, since my three rails cannot help each other out if one is overloaded. With GPUs going up in power and current draw, its only a matter of time before my PSU is outdated.

 

[chiew]

Nice simple program, thanks for the tip.

 

[SerpentRoyal]

INF chipset driver...download from the intel website.

Note that it's very rare for a rig to consume more that 300 watts. My overclocked E4300 @ 3.46GHz is pulling a little over 190 watts with an EVGA 7100GG GPU. Based on your information, I would at least exchange that CPU for another. Look for a build date around 1/07 with SL9Tx after the E4300. This will ensure that you have the latest L2 stepping. The Abit IP35/IP35-E runs cool (no fan required). Board will support upcoming 45 nm chips. If you can get by with the DELL, then sell your current rig and regroup after college.

Not sure about your major in college, but PCP is way over priced. There's a hefty profit margin in the PSU buisiness. I agree that it would be better to go with one large single 12V rail. A 450 to 500 watter should be more than adequate for any single GPU rig. Look for one 120 or 140mm fan.

 

[SerpentRoyal]

You still have four sticks of memory. Use two 8500 (same colored slot). Bump Vcore to 1.45 in BIOS. Core temp is okay @ idle. It will not kill your CPU. You can go up to 65C during load.

 

[chiew]

Yeah, I am aware that I will not probably touch even 400W for awhile, but I am more concerned about the current draw that my next GPU may have. My rails are all rated at 19A, and even though I've seen people using 8800GTS's on my PSU, I am concerned that the nvidia 9 series, which is what I'll upgrade to, will have even greater power draw. I've seen some people touting 20+ amps requirement for running the 8800GTS, but people with my PSU seem to be fine.

As for the INF files, I just downloaded and it asked me to restart. Just curious, what will this do for me? Does the motherboard not tell the OS how to use it? Are the INF files usually included on the motherboard driver CD? Sorry for all the questions and my ignorance. I don't know a lot about computers.

 

[chiew]

Originally posted by: SerpentRoyal
You still have four sticks of memory. Use two 8500 (same colored slot). Bump Vcore to 1.45 in BIOS. Core temp is okay @ idle. It will not kill your CPU. You can go up to 65C during load.

OK, so here we go:
I updated the INF chipset drivers like you said to. Restarted.

Shut down, removed both 6400 DDR2 modules and kept the 8500 in dual channel (both in the yellow slots).

Now going to try 9*350 = 3150 GHz
VCore is at 1.45V
VDimm is at 1.8+0.3=2.1V
MCH is at +0.2V
FSB is at +0.1V
RAM timings are now 5-5-5-15

Idling at 28-30C


If you notice, in the first one, strangely CPUZ reports my voltage is at 1.213V. I set it for 1.45V.

 

[SerpentRoyal]

Yup, traffic cop for the CPU and the OS. The INF is on the CD but you should download the lates from the intel website. Don't forget to flash to the latest BIOS. Reset CMOS. Go into BIOS and load OPTIMIZED DEFAULT. Save and exit. Now go back to BIOS and change those parameters. Remember to use only two sticks of 8500 (same colored slots).

You're still be safe even with a quality 450-500 watts PSU. These people who claimed that you need 700 to 800 watts have never measured the actual full load of a high-end GPU.

 

[chiew]

plesae read the above, as i have edited it.

I am at F12, which is the newest available version of BIOS.

Also, let me tell you what happens when it fails:
I start up Orthos, and when it is running, within 10 minutes it is as if I hit the restart button: screen goes black, and computer starts booting up again. No more blue screens today, but it restarts. Not sure what that means.

 

[SerpentRoyal]

Originally posted by: chiew

Originally posted by: SerpentRoyal
You still have four sticks of memory. Use two 8500 (same colored slot). Bump Vcore to 1.45 in BIOS. Core temp is okay @ idle. It will not kill your CPU. You can go up to 65C during load.

OK, so here we go:
I updated the INF chipset drivers like you said to. Restarted.

Shut down, removed both 6400 DDR2 modules and kept the 8500 in dual channel (both in the yellow slots).

Now going to try 9*350 = 3150 GHz
VCore is at 1.45V
VDimm is at 1.8+0.3=2.1V
MCH is at +0.2V
FSB is at +0.1V
RAM timings are now 5-5-5-15

Idling at 28-30C

screenshots:
http://stanford.edu/~yanong/CPUZ3.jpg
http://stanford.edu/~yanong/CPUZ4.jpg

If you notice, in the first one, strangely CPUZ reports my voltage is at 1.213V. I set it for 1.45V.

Absolutely normal with CPUz. Speedfan shows the correct voltage...approximately 1.46. Not too bad for a noob.

Bring Vcore up to 1.46 and keep an eye on core 0 and 1 in Speedfan. You want to stay below 70C for now when you run Orthos Large mode. You're within 100MHz of stability. Little tweak here and there will get the job done.

If you can run Othos for 10 minutes under this condition, then run Memtest (#5 for 40 loops). If Memtest is okay, then go back and run Orthos for one hour. If you fail Orthos, then drop FSB by two and repeat test.