Fukishima is working again

[Jaskalas]

At this point I can't tell if you're sarcastic or not. You do realize it takes years to decades for any damage to DNA via ionizing radiation to actually manifest itself, right?

You realize this crap isn't going anywhere, right? It'll have plenty of decades to do its damage.

For the rest of our lives Japan has a rather large exclusion zone.

 

[Steeplerot]

Since you're the only one in here concerned about it, and the rest of the world is still building nuclear power plants, I'm going to venture a guess: yes.

Quite a few countries have quit with nukes since Fuku. But yeah, here? The government is owned by GE and friends, they are gonna try to build more plants, and keep half-assing regulation here. Unless they are stopped like in other first world countries.

Wait, does USA count as first world anymore? *I kid*

Sure, not many understand Nuke Physics and how plants work, the subject has always fascinated me, Fuku going up is kinda a big deal for peoples health. But yeah we are owned, when one of ours go up (and they are so old they will sooner or later) the government will treat us just like Japan, which is tell people to stfu and not spread rumor as people intake hot particles into their bodies. The powers that be hoping the sickness comes enough years after they can blame something else on the illness and not suffer lawsuits. Or so they hope.

I mean, who is to say that that lung cancer/leukemia you get 10-20 years down the road was from that plutonium nano particle in your lung you got from Fuku? It could have been when you smoked when you were in your 20s. Too bad!

This is the reality of the situation for TEPCO/Japanese government now. And the people/children are still not being moved back from the extent of the worst of the plumes outreach from the plant site.

 

[Steeplerot]

At this point I can't tell if you're sarcastic or not. You do realize it takes years to decades for any damage to DNA via ionizing radiation to actually manifest itself, right?

Yes, it will take 10-20 years. The consequences of this stuff sitting around that long are not so good. Take a look at long term strontium 90 damage to bone cells. (leukemia and the genetic neuro diseases (spinabifda for example that can be dormant for generations) Cesium is the big killer though, it accumulates in heart muscles and kills it with ionization over time, the thing is a adult can only replace 1% of heart tissue a year, it is a losing game. The cleanup crews of Chernobyl died mostly falling over from random heart attacks/strokes years after.

Radtiation is a bitch in the situation of Fuku

A: It is easy to ignore as it is invisible and the consequences take time
B: Japanese people have a cultural aversion to people who have been exposed to radiation, thus no one wants to talk about it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hibakusha#Discrimination
C: The people with the $ sure as hell want this to blow over, the nuke industry does not want any bad PR.

A recipe for disaster

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2SgonaD4U0

 

[zsdersw]

I'd really like to see anti-nuclear folks come up with another way to provide all the power we need once fossil fuels become too rare (and therefore too expensive) to use en masse anymore.

Solar? Wind? Laughable. I love those technologies as much as anyone, but if solar technology doesn't get more efficient (by a lot!) before fossil fuels become economically unfeasible, what other technology do we have?

 

[Nebor]

Aren't the countries with the most nuclear plants (France, UK & Germany) still making new ones?

 

[Vic Vega]

You heard it here first people. GE owns the government. That's why the government is trying to ban one of GE's best selling products - incandescent light bulbs.

 

[rcpratt]

Aren't the countries with the most nuclear plants (France, UK & Germany) still making new ones?

The current administration in Germany has said that they are going to phase out their nukes, but that's not going to happen. The industry is still continuing with plans to build more plants. Same with a few other Euro countries.

I thank Steeplerot for bringing me some entertainment. I've missed you.

 

[DisgruntledVirus]

The current administration in Germany has said that they are going to phase out their nukes, but that's not going to happen. The industry is still continuing with plans to build more plants. Same with a few other Euro countries.

I thank Steeplerot for bringing me some entertainment. I've missed you.

I'm loving this guy myself.

I would be curious to hear is insightful thoughts about Throium based reactors. Or how France can power most of their country off nuclear and they aren't all dead/dying/etc.

 

[Steeplerot]

I'd really like to see anti-nuclear folks come up with another way to provide all the power we need once fossil fuels become too rare (and therefore too expensive) to use en masse anymore.

Solar? Wind? Laughable. I love those technologies as much as anyone, but if solar technology doesn't get more efficient (by a lot!) before fossil fuels become economically unfeasible, what other technology do we have?

Nuke power only provides about 30% of the US's energy, with new power grids we could shut off all nuke plants and still have extra energy.

Nuke power/industry is nothing less then a military/energy industry subsidy on the government teat, the plants never delivered on their promises and provide multi-generational problems cleaning them up when decommmisioned. (or fail as they have been doing more and more often with age)

Nuke power is optional, wind, solar, hydro will take up slack easily. But then we have people like Pratt here on the government nuke dole with other ideas.

The tech is cool stuff for sure, but a total con job on the public (and probably the only hope of humanity destroying itself without need for actual bombs -cold war style)

As far as thorium it's a super expensive boondoggle to suck up even more taxpayer money for an inefficient wasteful toy.

 

[zsdersw]

Nuke power only provides about 30% of the US's energy, with new power grids we could shut off all nuke plants and still have extra energy.

Nuke power/industry is nothing less then a military/energy industry subsidy on the government teat, the plants never delivered on their promises and provide multi-generational problems cleaning them up when decommmisioned. (or fail as they have been doing more and more often with age)

Nuke power is optional, wind, solar, hydro will take up slack easily. But then we have people like Pratt here on the government nuke dole with other ideas.

The tech is cool stuff for sure, but a total con job on the public (and probably the only hope of humanity destroying itself without need for actual bombs -cold war style)

No, wind, solar, and hydro will not be able to take up the slack when fossil fuels become economically scarce, which was the premise I outlined earlier.

 

[rcpratt]

I told you I was glad that the entertainment you provide had returned, you don't have to try and insult me :'(

 

[a777pilot]

Almost 20,000 dead or missing from the tsunami. But at least it wasn't radiation.

This^

I would laugh but it isn't funny.

 

[Steeplerot]

I told you I was glad that the entertainment you provide had returned, you don't have to try and insult me :'(

It is not an insult, the fact is you have admitted your conflict of interest as you work for the industry.

I didn't call you a outright shill who lies, but this is how you are acting.

 

[Steeplerot]

I'd really like to see anti-nuclear folks come up with another way to provide all the power we need once fossil fuels become too rare (and therefore too expensive) to use en masse anymore.

Solar? Wind? Laughable. I love those technologies as much as anyone, but if solar technology doesn't get more efficient (by a lot!) before fossil fuels become economically unfeasible, what other technology do we have?

There will be no power plant at all running if the area is a evacuated no-mans land for a 100 years or so no one wants to live in will there? What is the point?

Nuke power is the dirtiest of all power, unprofitable, very expensive to build, MUCH more expensive to decommission (there is no real way to even clean up the mess made for 40 years or so of power that is not literally kicking the can down the road for the next generations)

Nuke power is good for subs, the core can be ejected safely. I have no real problem with this, but to scale it up where it is uncontrollable is rolling the dice waiting for the inevitable shitting in our own DNA pool.

With every year our reactors get even more brittle and aged, regulators are bought out like the rest of government. And you guys want more of these plants? Shame we cant just darwin award all you nuke apologists and save the world a lot of harm in the future.

 

[halik]

There will be no power plant at all running if the area is a evacuated no-mans land for a 100 years or so no one wants to live in will there? What is the point?

Nuke power is the dirtiest of all power, unprofitable, very expensive to build, MUCH more expensive to decommission (there is no real way to even clean up the mess made for 40 years or so of power that is not literally kicking the can down the road for the next generations)

Nuke power is good for subs, the core can be ejected safely. I have no real problem with this, but to scale it up where it is uncontrollable is shitting in our own DNA pool.

Whoosh. The point was that you do not have any alternatives to replacing the power output, only that "nuke is bad, mmkkay".

What do you propose instead of nuclear power?

 

[Genx87]

There will be no power plant at all running if the area is a evacuated no-mans land for a 100 years or so no one wants to live in will there? What is the point?

Nuke power is the dirtiest of all power, unprofitable, very expensive to build, MUCH more expensive to decommission (there is no real way to even clean up the mess made for 40 years or so of power that is not literally kicking the can down the road for the next generations)

Nuke power is good for subs, the core can be ejected safely. I have no real problem with this, but to scale it up where it is uncontrollable is rolling the dice waiting for the inevitable shitting in our own DNA pool.

With every year our reactors get even more brittle and aged, regulators are bought out like the rest of government. And you guys want more of these plants? Shame we cant just darwin award all you nuke apologists and save the world a lot of harm in the future.

Heh you complain about some radiation leaking into the sea from this disaster. But are fine with an entire core ejected into the ocean?

It is controllable as much as we have control over anything not a natural diaster.

 

[Steeplerot]

Whoosh. The point was that you do not have any alternatives to replacing the power output, only that "nuke is bad, mmkkay".

What do you propose instead of nuclear power?

Nuke power is not irreplaceable. It does not even supply a third of the US's power.

With upgrades to our transmission system we could make up for the deficit.

Coal and gas can be replaced also. There is no political will to do so since the industries own the popsicle stand in DC supposedly looking out for us.

The reality is our plants are old, they need to go before we have our own Fuku. The Japanese were known as the LEADER in Nuke Power, like what happened there will not happen here soon? Get real. Our plants are even older then theirs in a lot of cases, I am sure the regulators are just as corrupted if not more here also. The foxes are watching the henhouse.

 

[rcpratt]

It is not an insult, the fact is you have admitted your conflict of interest as you work for the industry.

I didn't call you a outright shill who lies, but this is how you are acting.

I haven't even said anything. And I guess I don't really see that as a conflict of interest. All I've ever done is give my opinion, and that would be my opinion regardless of where I worked.

 

[Genx87]

Nuke power is not irreplaceable. It does not even supply a third of the US's power.

With upgrades to our transmission system we could make up for the deficit.

Coal and gas can be replaced also. There is no political will to do so since the industries own the popsicle stand in DC supposedly looking out for us.

You are smoking something fierce.

 

[Steeplerot]

Heh you complain about some radiation leaking into the sea from this disaster. But are fine with an entire core ejected into the ocean?

It is controllable as much as we have control over anything not a natural diaster.

A sub core can be retrieved and disposed of, it is not physically big enough to break it's PCV during a full fuel rod melt.

A power plant during a melt will release it's fuel to the environment as seen on all three reactors in Fuku due to the amount of fuel used/size of the containment vessel.

If they wanted to build out the containment vessels to scale like a sub's nuke reactor I would be not so concerned.

But then no one would build nuke plants as it realistically would be too expensive to create actually safe reactors at the scale needed for profitable power generation.

The nuke industry is another very dangerous form of corporate welfare. Socialism for the rich -who deal in death and poison.

And once again the same folks defend corruption.

 

[piasabird]

So this reactor is what 30 years old technology? The reactors should have been scrapped to begin with.

Oh Yeah at Chernobyl the steam built up and blew part of the reactor through the ceiling of the containment chamber and it landed nearby in the middle of a forest. It did not help that the insulation (Graphite) also caught on fire.

 

[Genx87]

A sub core can be retrieved and disposed of, it is not physically big enough to break it's PCV during a full fuel rod melt.

A power plant during a melt will release it's fuel to the environment as seen on all three reactors in Fuku due to the amount of fuel used/size of the containment vessel.

If they wanted to build out the containment vessels to scale like a sub's nuke reactor I would be not so concerned.

But then no one would build nuke plants as it realistically would be too expensive to create actually safe reactors at the scale needed for profitable power generation.

The nuke industry is another very dangerous form of corporate welfare. Socialism for the rich -who deal in death and poison.

And once again the same folks defend corruption.

Uh huh, like I said, smoking something fierce.

 

[Steeplerot]

So this reactor is what 30 years old technology? The reactors should have been scrapped to begin with.

Oh Yeah at Chernobyl the steam built up and blew part of the reactor through the ceiling of the containment chamber and it landed nearby in the middle of a forest. It did not help that the insulation (Graphite) also caught on fire.

The bio lid blew upward and came back down at a 60 degree angle on the reactor (and to this day hangs rather precociously). There is a video on youtube of some crazy Russian scientists climbing on top of it.

The graphite fires were bad though, they almost lost the running reactor next to Chernobyl #2. Very brave fireman climbed up on the turbine hall roof and put it out before it overtook more buildings. The firefighters died a horrible death in days but probably saved Europe.

Anyhow, comparing Fuku with Cherynobyl is not accurate, Cherynobyl literally had a little concrete/graphite walls protecting the environment from the fuel, this setup failed miserably spreading crap all over the place.

Fuku reactors had good old USA GE reactor containment vessels to protect them, that of course dumped crap all over the environment also, but hey! It had no graphite fire. So big difference! 😉

If anything Fuku has far far more higher enriched fuel at risk then Chernobyl. And the Soviets only lost one of the reactors, Japan has 3 reactors out of control and no one really knows the status of the melted fuel even.

 

[rcpratt]

So this reactor is what 30 years old technology? The reactors should have been scrapped to begin with.

Oh Yeah at Chernobyl the steam built up and blew part of the reactor through the ceiling of the containment chamber and it landed nearby in the middle of a forest. It did not help that the insulation (Graphite) also caught on fire.

It does not help that the Chernobyl situation is not even remotely applicable to how modern reactors are operated today.

 

[halik]

Nuke power is not irreplaceable. It does not even supply a third of the US's power.

With upgrades to our transmission system we could make up for the deficit.

Coal and gas can be replaced also. There is no political will to do so since the industries own the popsicle stand in DC supposedly looking out for us.

The reality is our plants are old, they need to go before we have our own Fuku. The Japanese were known as the LEADER in Nuke Power, like what happened there will not happen here soon? Get real. Our plants are even older then theirs in a lot of cases, I am sure the regulators are just as corrupted if not more here also. The foxes are watching the henhouse.

Replaced with? Also got anything backing up being able to gain 20%+ efficiency from new transmission systems?