Friend just got screwed by PP and scammer

[archcommus]

So a friend of mine sold two Diablo accounts a month or so ago, the guy got them and was happy, and left positive eBay feedback. Now, all this time later, the guy files a dispute with PP saying he never received his product. $50 for each account. PayPal then asked my friend to provide any evidence he had to support his claim that he did infact deliver the product. He sent them links to the positive eBay feedback. PayPal said there wasn't sufficient evidence and granted the guy his chargeback, PLUS my friend got charged a $10 filing fee PER DISPUTE the OTHER guy filed. So now his PayPal account went from $0 to -$120.

So how is positive eBay feedback not enough proof the guy was happy? And how did this guy prove that he infact WASN'T satisifed as a customer? I don't understand what evidence could override DIRECT LINKS to eBay feedback.

 

[Eli]

They want a tracking number.

/thread

 

[CrackRabbit]

This is why PP sucks.

 

[KLin]

LMAO you, err your friend got owned. :laugh:

 

[archcommus]

Originally posted by: KLin
LMAO you, err your friend got owned. :laugh:

Believe what you want, the guy just messaged me this story, it is in fact a friend and not me.

A tracking number of what?

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: archcommus

Originally posted by: KLin
LMAO you, err your friend got owned. :laugh:

Believe what you want, the guy just messaged me this story, it is in fact a friend and not me.

A tracking number of what?

A tracking/delivery confirmation number for the package that you sent.

Since there was no package, you are SOL. Your friend should have MAILED him the account info on a piece of paper so there was evidence of delivery.

 

[RedCOMET]

Originally posted by: archcommus

Originally posted by: KLin
LMAO you, err your friend got owned. :laugh:

Believe what you want, the guy just messaged me this story, it is in fact a friend and not me.

A tracking number of what?

of a package.. like reciept of delivery, that kind of thing.

Also, are you allowed to sell the Diablo Accounts? Is that allowed under the TOS of the game?

 

[archcommus]

Originally posted by: RedCOMET

Originally posted by: archcommus

Originally posted by: KLin
LMAO you, err your friend got owned. :laugh:

Believe what you want, the guy just messaged me this story, it is in fact a friend and not me.

A tracking number of what?

of a package.. like reciept of delivery, that kind of thing.

Also, are you allowed to sell the Diablo Accounts? Is that allowed under the TOS of the game?

Probably not, I wouldn't know.

So here's my question: If one guy says he never got his product and has no proof, and the other guy said he did and has proof of the other guy's satisfaction, how is the first guy deemed more believable?

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: archcommus

Originally posted by: RedCOMET

Originally posted by: archcommus

Originally posted by: KLin
LMAO you, err your friend got owned. :laugh:

Believe what you want, the guy just messaged me this story, it is in fact a friend and not me.

A tracking number of what?

of a package.. like reciept of delivery, that kind of thing.

Also, are you allowed to sell the Diablo Accounts? Is that allowed under the TOS of the game?

Probably not, I wouldn't know.

So here's my question: If one guy says he never got his product and has no proof, and the other guy said he did and has proof of the other guy's satisfaction, how is the first guy deemed more believable?

I don't think you're quite getting it.

eBay feedback isn't "proof" of anything as far as PayPal is concerned. They want a delivery confirmation number.

This is why PayPal sucks. However, ignorance is never an excuse.

You know when you click on "I Accept"? Yeah, when they want you to read pages and pages of lawyer speak, but you never do?

That really does mean that you accept their terms. It doesen't matter whether you've actually read it or not.

Would you sign a contract without reading it first? That's esentially what you're doing.

 

[archcommus]

Of course I understand it follows their TOS, and I understand they want a tracking number as proof. What I don't get is, whoever the physical person was that made this decision, how did they warrant this in their own head.

And really, the feedback should be proof enough. The guy wouldn't leave positive feedback if he didn't really get the product.

 

[RedCOMET]

Originally posted by: Eli
I don't think you're quite getting it.

eBay feedback isn't "proof" of anything as far as PayPal is concerned. They want a delivery confirmation number.

This is why PayPal sucks. However, ignorance is never an excuse.

You know when you click on "I Accept"? Yeah, when they want you to read pages and pages of lawyer speak, but you never do?

That really does mean that you accept their terms. It doesen't matter whether you've actually read it or not.

Would you sign a contract without reading it first?

That's like reading through endless pages of a EULA, that's why we have so many microsoft licencing issue threads in the OS forum. people don't do it.

I know i never read the TOS for PP, but now witht the recent rash of PP scam threads, i should brush up on them,

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: archcommus
Of course I understand it follows their TOS, and I understand they want a tracking number as proof. What I don't get is, whoever the physical person was that made this decision, how did they warrant this in their own head.

And really, the feedback should be proof enough. The guy wouldn't leave positive feedback if he didn't really get the product.

It wasn't a person that "made the decision". It was a worker drone following PayPal's internal rules and regulations.

I'm in no way trying to defend PayPal here, their practices are clearly seedy. However, at this point..

PayPal doesen't force you to do business with them, so if you don't like their policies... don't give them your business.

 

[HonkeyDonk]

PP sucks ass.

BTW, wasn't there another thread just a few days ago with the same thing?

 

[kranky]

Originally posted by: HonkeyDonk
PP sucks ass.

BTW, wasn't there another thread just a few days ago with the same thing?

Yep, there was.

The sad thing is the scammers know exactly where the Paypal loophole is - the proof of delivery! Scammers know they can buy things like game characters and 99.9% of the time the whole deal is done via email or IM. They file a claim with Paypal and get their money back every time.

It used to be that there were a number of dishonest people yet most people were honorable, but any more you see people being dishonest just because they know they can get away with it. The vast majority of these Ebay/Paypal scammers would never scam people where they live. Cowardly thieves.

 

[vegetation]

FYI, paypal only doing what every other merchant account would do. You need to ship to confirmed billing address and have proof of delivery or take the risk. Heck, proof of delivery for FOB destination is a standard business practice that goes way beyond paypal's time. If you're going to try profiting off something, then take the time to learn some basic business practices, or at least ask someone about it.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: CrackRabbit
This is why PP sucks.

 

[SaturnX]

Yeah, not much you can do now, espeically with virtual goods, consider it a $120 lesson, better than $500+, tell you friend to suck it up, and chalk it up to another life lesson.

--Mark

 

[Feneant2]

Hell, have him go to Blizzard and tell them he sold the account to have them closed... or tell them it was stolen to get them back, he should be able to screw the other guy like he got screwed

 

[archcommus]

Blizzard wouldn't give a sh!t.

 

[FoBoT]

don't sell intangible stuff or do it at risk of getting screwed

he is SOL , move on

 

[bignateyk]

I got screwed by paypal in much the same way...

I sold a few sticks of RAM for around $300, and all was well, positive feedbacks given.

Month or so later paypal claims I never sent the product... I email them links to the auction/feedback & even scan in a shipping receipt.

Paypal denies it and im out $300.

My balance is still at $-300 and I dont plan on paying them. If they wanna take me to court after sending a collection agency after me they are more than welcome.

I will NEVER use paypal again, and I would advise anyone else to do the same.

 

[kranky]

Originally posted by: bignateyk
I got screwed by paypal in much the same way...

I sold a few sticks of RAM for around $300, and all was well, positive feedbacks given.

Month or so later paypal claims I never sent the product... I email them links to the auction/feedback & even scan in a shipping receipt.

Paypal denies it and im out $300.

My balance is still at $-300 and I dont plan on paying them. If they wanna take me to court after sending a collection agency after me they are more than welcome.

I will NEVER use paypal again, and I would advise anyone else to do the same.

Don't you mean the buyer claimed he never received the product?

 

[HonkeyDonk]

Originally posted by: bignateyk
I got screwed by paypal in much the same way...

I sold a few sticks of RAM for around $300, and all was well, positive feedbacks given.

Month or so later paypal claims I never sent the product... I email them links to the auction/feedback & even scan in a shipping receipt.

Paypal denies it and im out $300.

My balance is still at $-300 and I dont plan on paying them. If they wanna take me to court after sending a collection agency after me they are more than welcome.

I will NEVER use paypal again, and I would advise anyone else to do the same.

Jeez, that sucks.

Just reading these horror stories makes me want to march right up to the paypal headquarters and beat the crap out of all their employees. Or at least the division in charge of disputes and crap.

I think from now on I will only accept money orders for anything above $30.

 

[RMSistight]

Originally posted by: kranky

Originally posted by: bignateyk
I got screwed by paypal in much the same way...

I sold a few sticks of RAM for around $300, and all was well, positive feedbacks given.

Month or so later paypal claims I never sent the product... I email them links to the auction/feedback & even scan in a shipping receipt.

Paypal denies it and im out $300.

My balance is still at $-300 and I dont plan on paying them. If they wanna take me to court after sending a collection agency after me they are more than welcome.

I will NEVER use paypal again, and I would advise anyone else to do the same.

Don't you mean the buyer claimed he never received the product?

You see. This is why you always use USPS's return receipt, signature confirmation, or delivery confirmation. As for UPS and Fedex, they have their own tracking systems. NEVER send a product without SOME TYPE OF TRACKING. You guys always need to know how to play the game. I hate it when people blame a company like Paypal because of their own ignorance. When you are about to send the product, the FIRST thing that comes to my mind is HOW am I going to prove that he received it and not get scammed. People always need to think ahead about things like this. That's why I don't get scammed because I'm always thinking about how to PREVENT myself from getting scammed.

 

[DocBartend]

Paypal says in their agreement they dont support ONLINE accounts and such. YOu get screwed, you get screwed.