France to recognize Palestinian state at UN

[Whiskey16]

You provided some opinions upon potential obstacles to as court case against Isreal. Though, unlike your previous assertion, none provide immunity against Israel for actions within the territory of a member state to the Rome Statute.

So again, you are categorically incorrect on your first absolutist point that the ICC may not indict Israel and Israelis due to Israel not being party the Rome Statute.

Israel is very much afraid of losing whatever moral influence it may have left among its allies if it is indicted for aggression off extraterritorial conquest and the displacement of Palestinians.

Secondly you remain incorrect that upon recognition of Palestine as party state to the may equally fine itself or citizens indicted for crimes within Israel. There is no automatic two way accountability as the ICC retains its lack of jurisdiction within the state of Israel without the resoltuion passing consent of the UN Security Council.

TasteLikesChicken, you remain incorrect, have failed in proving myself incorrect, and have only succeeded in moving your argumentative goal post from Israel being immune from ICC prosecution to that of its allies in a moral costly move, potentially impeding court proceedings.

typed on my phone...Sorry for the word mixups

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

You provided some opinions upon potential obstacles to as court case against Isreal. Though, unlike your previous assertion, none provide immunity against Israel for actions within the territory of a member state to the Rome Statute.

So again, you are categorically incorrect on your first absolutist point that the ICC may not indict Israel and Israelis due to Israel not being party the Rome Statute.

Indictment is not the point. Since Israel is not a party to the treaty they cannot be compelled to participate in the process or comply with any findings. iow, any indictment would be little more than a PR dog-n-pony show, which is pretty much par for the course for the Palestinians at the UN. Seems they want all the power of a UN State but none of the actual responsibility.

There is also this from the Statute itself:

"2. If a State becomes a Party to this Statute after its entry into force, the Court may exercise its jurisdiction only with respect to crimes committed after the entry into force of this Statute for that State, unless that State has made a declaration under article 12, paragraph 3."

iow, the Palestinians can't make this statute retroactive and indict Israel for anything that happened before Palestine becomes a non-member state and also a signatory to the Statute itself.

Israel is very much afraid of losing whatever moral influence it may have left among its allies if it is indicted for aggression off extraterritorial conquest and the displacement of Palestinians.

Sounds like you are channeling Lemon law's drivel, the same pronouncement he's been exclaiming for years now. Nothing has changed in all that time and it's not going to change after this.

Secondly you remain incorrect that upon recognition of Palestine as party state to the may equally fine itself or citizens indicted for crimes within Israel. There is no automatic two way accountability as the ICC retains its lack of jurisdiction within the state of Israel without the resoltuion passing consent of the UN Security Council.

Israel doesn't have to bring the charges, though they can because nothing in the Statute says that a State referring the charges to a prosecutor must be a party to the treaty. Also, Palestinians could be indicted for crimes committed on their own soil. Palestinians don't fire rockets at civilian population centers from Israel.

TasteLikesChicken, you remain incorrect, have failed in proving myself incorrect, and have only succeeded in moving your argumentative goal post from Israel being immune from ICC prosecution to that of its allies in a moral costly move, potentially impeding court proceedings.

typed on my phone...Sorry for the word mixups

You sound like our recent resident truther. Simply proclaim that other guy incorrect and that somehow makes you right. It doesn't work that way. You're making a bunch of proclamations that don't withstand scrutiny. And the one thing you are right about is meaningless. Ultimately, the Rome Statute will have no affect on Israel. If the Pals want to create a charade parade by trying to take things to the ICC, more power to them. They better hope it doesn't bite them in the ass along the way.

 

[Atreus21]

If the Palestinians got UN recognition that would be a big deal, because it would mean Israel was occupying the sovereign territory of another UN member state instead of just enacting apartheid in its own lands. It's a diplomatic issue, but a serious one.

Palestine is not being recognized as a member state.

 

[StrangerGuy]

One thing I know for sure is a Palestinian rush for Israeli citizenship if they got their own state. That will be so funny in an ironic way.

Besides, Palestinians better be careful what they wish for. Firing rockets into Israel is mere terrorism now, but it will be an outright declaration of war as an independent state even if it wasn't offically sanctioned because it is every country's responsibility to prevent armed attacks to their neighbours. If they want to be in the kitchen, they better be prepared to stand the heat.

 

[tommo123]

i don't think that's actually true. if the gov were responsible for all the actions of it's citizens then the us would be a terrorist state for supporting the IRA and it's murder of innocents in england

 

[EagleKeeper]

i don't think that's actually true. if the gov were responsible for all the actions of it's citizens then the us would be a terrorist state for supporting the IRA and it's murder of innocents in england

Situation here is that the government itself controls the access and encourages such actions.

Hamas w/ respect to Gaza is equivalent to a communist country.
Political, economic and military controlled. Nothing comes into the area without Hamas approval and blessing. Smugglers have to pay taxes on what is brought into the area. Supplies let in by Israel are searched by Hamas for contraband before going to the proper locations

 

[tommo123]

fair enough then. i do wonder if this will still be going on in a 100 years or if something catastrophic is going to happen in that part of the world