Yes, this can be laid at Bush's feet, since instead of going after al Quada, he wasted our reseources in Iraq for no reason.
Heh, I only wish that were true. I'm a public school teacher and I see very well how it could happen.
You are certain about the Semitic Muslim, are you as sure that the WASP would be more likely to be targetted, because i am not. I would say that a Semitic Muslim would be more likely to be targetted in that case too but i could strech it out to agreeing that they go on previous evidence against the person in that case.
And if some people are not being treated equally, would you not call that discrimination against them?
Originally posted by: OrByte
you are absolutely right, I am sure that at the moment, Russia only cares for the 100-200 boys and girls that are lying dead in the middle of a school yard. Which is rightly so...
as for the rest of western civilization, I can only voice my concerns that this kind of stuff is going to find its way into our borders... unless someone gets a handle on these groups.
Seems only reasonable that the Muslim community steps up to the plate and start cutting these characters off...in every way imaginable.
again, whether or not muslims LEADERSHIP accepts responsibility is entirely up to them, but Muslim LEADERSHIP should be aware of the costs of not doing anything as a result of the chaos these groups are making.
And if you are muslim thats great, Allah be with you....but the leaders of Muslim nations need to think long and hard as to who and what they are trying to protect. The rest of the world is watching.
edit* kinda sucks when those facts don't work out for ya eh?apology accepted dude :beer:
Actually i am Jewish by heritage, not by religion, i have my own faith, but it scares me that people of different faiths and belief systems are turning on eachother, we do NOT need a religious war.
Thank you, :beer: for you too.
Dateline just now broadcast a related story discussing school readiness. Included in the segment was a link to a study on school preparedness.
In this case, considering the old Bear's previous methodology for addressing such cases, one might conclude that the Russian authorities would certainly consider a proper course of action.
I'm not sure if these people would be targetted equally. As I previously said, I would be OK for this in an ideal world, but it may not be possible in a flawed world. No, I really doubt that a Semitic Muslim would be more highly targetted in a serial murder case, unless the statistics bear it out. All I ever hear is about how the profile for a serial killer is commonly white.
I don't think that it would be very discriminatory towards anyone since nobody will have different rights or have their inherent rights infringed upon. However, I guess you could say that it is discriminatory in a single focus area, but not in the whole area since everyone would be targetted in a sense in some area...but then lots of actions would be that many governments support. It shouldn't be too bad as long as it is not too severe and no malicious intent is involved.
In a perfect world there wouldn't be a need for it, because crimes, fundamentalism and violence would not exist.
You know i am a Semite, i can tell you that *I* feel discriminated against in certain situations, i am not comfortable discussing the situations here but if you want to know we can take it to pm, not really important though.
I really have no problem with this and I've been routinely 'profiled' against, especially in the case that you are talking about. Being treated with respect is the main thing, IMO. I just don't think that this situation with airport/airplane security is a very big leap.
Sorry if you felt discriminated against in other situations.
Mosly happen around my workplace, for a reason i guess.
Thank you. It's not that important though, annoying but unimportant in the end.
AnitaPeterson
Diamond Member
- Apr 24, 2001
- 6,021
- 547
- 126
As I'm browsing through this post, CBC's The Passionate Eye shows a documentary on the theatre hostage situation in Moscow, two years ago... All the Chechens (plus one Gulf Arab, who was there as well) talk to the camera about how great Allah is, and that they want to die, and are ready to embrace death, and that they are going to Paradise. It seems to me they - themselves - were not taking seriously their "official' requests for all Russians to leave Chechenya. They are very clear about their wilingness to die - the footage is from their own cameraman (they had their valiant act taped)... Their leader says "we're not terrorists, terrorists would've asked for a plane and some millions of dollars" - which goes to show his "intelligence".
Clearly, it was a religious attack. One of the survivors recalls one of the women terrorists giving him a piece of paper with "Allah is the only God" written on it, telling him to recite these words when he was to die, because thus he'd be accepted in Paradise as a Muslim. There was no doubt for them everyone will die.
No, this is religion at its best. Or worst.
The West - and the Russians have this unfortunate chance first - must stick it to these scumbags who attack schools and civilian gatherings, by shaking their belief in their chance to go to Paradise.
So I say: bury them with a piece of bacon in their mouth. This, according to Islamic faith, would completely forfeit your chances to go to Paradise.
Cruel and unusual? maybe. But they're dead anyway. And after they've done, I've no regret for them.
Also of note: some of you here are wondering why the Muslim leaders are not actively and very visibly condemning the attacks. You are victims of a Western, Judeo-Christian P.O.V.! You`re like the Westerners who kept wondering throughout the `70s and `80 why the peoples of Eastern Europe don`t rise against their Communist governments. Here's the explanation: In Islam, you cannot simply criticize your fellow Muslims. Ever wondered why the so-called "critical thinking" or political sciences never took off in the Islamic parts of the world? Because the moment you go againt Islam (ask Rushdie) you get a fatwah proclaimed against you, and it's only a question of time until a fanatic with paradise twinkling in his eyes will shoot you and die in a "blaze of glory".
I am as Liberal as they come, and some here have called me a Commie occassionally, but mark my words: the West is doomed in the fight against Islamic fundamentalism, because we can't get our adversaries to apply the same standards as we do.
Look at what's happening in Sudan: a Muslim minority took over the government in 1989, imposed Sharia law over everyone - including the Christians - and now they're doing the worst atrocities you can imagine. Look at Saudi Arabia, a country where you can`t proselytise as a Christian. If any Western country - even the poorest ones, like Bulgaria, or Greece - did that to other religions, there`d be public outcry and scandal to high heaven all over at the U.N., Capitol Hill etc. When the people who have the oil do it, the West keeps it smouth shut, and what`s worse, the Left - in Notrth America especially - is still defending people who don`t deserve any defence, and wouldn`t give it to you or me, should roles be reversed.
Alas, I fear for the West. And I fear for the human race overall... If this dangerous form of religion is not wiped off the face of the Earth as soon as possible, our grand-grand-children will live in huts and our grand-grand-daughters will wear a veil for their entire lives. There will be no science, no technology, and no free thinking. Orwell and Huxley`s worst nightmares are nothing compared to what the Islamo-fascists would do to humanity, if they had it their way.
Clearly, it was a religious attack. One of the survivors recalls one of the women terrorists giving him a piece of paper with "Allah is the only God" written on it, telling him to recite these words when he was to die, because thus he'd be accepted in Paradise as a Muslim. There was no doubt for them everyone will die.
No, this is religion at its best. Or worst.
The West - and the Russians have this unfortunate chance first - must stick it to these scumbags who attack schools and civilian gatherings, by shaking their belief in their chance to go to Paradise.
So I say: bury them with a piece of bacon in their mouth. This, according to Islamic faith, would completely forfeit your chances to go to Paradise.
Cruel and unusual? maybe. But they're dead anyway. And after they've done, I've no regret for them.
Also of note: some of you here are wondering why the Muslim leaders are not actively and very visibly condemning the attacks. You are victims of a Western, Judeo-Christian P.O.V.! You`re like the Westerners who kept wondering throughout the `70s and `80 why the peoples of Eastern Europe don`t rise against their Communist governments. Here's the explanation: In Islam, you cannot simply criticize your fellow Muslims. Ever wondered why the so-called "critical thinking" or political sciences never took off in the Islamic parts of the world? Because the moment you go againt Islam (ask Rushdie) you get a fatwah proclaimed against you, and it's only a question of time until a fanatic with paradise twinkling in his eyes will shoot you and die in a "blaze of glory".
I am as Liberal as they come, and some here have called me a Commie occassionally, but mark my words: the West is doomed in the fight against Islamic fundamentalism, because we can't get our adversaries to apply the same standards as we do.
Look at what's happening in Sudan: a Muslim minority took over the government in 1989, imposed Sharia law over everyone - including the Christians - and now they're doing the worst atrocities you can imagine. Look at Saudi Arabia, a country where you can`t proselytise as a Christian. If any Western country - even the poorest ones, like Bulgaria, or Greece - did that to other religions, there`d be public outcry and scandal to high heaven all over at the U.N., Capitol Hill etc. When the people who have the oil do it, the West keeps it smouth shut, and what`s worse, the Left - in Notrth America especially - is still defending people who don`t deserve any defence, and wouldn`t give it to you or me, should roles be reversed.
Alas, I fear for the West. And I fear for the human race overall... If this dangerous form of religion is not wiped off the face of the Earth as soon as possible, our grand-grand-children will live in huts and our grand-grand-daughters will wear a veil for their entire lives. There will be no science, no technology, and no free thinking. Orwell and Huxley`s worst nightmares are nothing compared to what the Islamo-fascists would do to humanity, if they had it their way.
IF the solution is becoming like them, they have won. If their solution is to kill us and our solution is to kill them, we ARE the same. wrong vs wrong, does it matter who wins then?
AnitaPeterson
Diamond Member
- Apr 24, 2001
- 6,021
- 547
- 126
Don't be blind. I'm not saying we should kill them, I'm saying we should eliminate this religion. Not the same thing. Stop being simplistic, because you'll fall into circular thinking, and you'll only run around your tail until you've made a nice little hole.
Stop and ask yourself this, and try to answer truthfully: Would you really like to live in an Islamic Scandinavia?
Stop and ask yourself this, and try to answer truthfully: Would you really like to live in an Islamic Scandinavia?
I am not blind, but i think you are, you offer no solution but still want to do something, exactly WHAT is it you want to do?
You have no idea who i am, i am NOT a Scandinavian citizen.
I would like to live in an Islamic scandinavia as much as any other religions scandinavia, as long as the MOTHERFVCKING CHRISTIAN NUTJOBS STOP KNOCKING ON MY DOOR AT 08 AM.
Is that clear enough for ya?
You offer nothing, absolutely no solution and expect me to do what? Agree? about WHAT?
Lotsa words no substance, like women in general.
[edit:] i am just kidding about that last sentence, but i really have no idea what you are proposing [/edit]
Have you ever thought about why those people are so fanatic about the religion? Could it be that they have nothing to live for in the current world, and their only hope is in the after life?
I read about an article the other day on the role of women Chechnian rebels, which is highly unusual in the Muslim world where women's role is at home. The reason that there are many women terrorist during the Moscow theater hostage crisis 2 years ago, and it was women terrorist who blew up the two planes recently was that there aren't many Chechnian men left. Most of the men died fight against Russian. Those women lost their husband, children, really have nothing much to live for. It is easy for the Chechnian politician/terrorist to use religion and lure them into this struggle.
Think about it, if you have a happy life with family around you, why would you wanna die so that maybe you can get into heaven in the after life. The places where you see religious fanatics are those places where hope is lost and people don't have much to live for. Maybe that's a clue for you?
If you can't think with reason and try to dismiss an entire religion without understanding the political and social condition in those troubled places, the only thing you will achieve is self destruction of human race.
AnitaPeterson
Diamond Member
- Apr 24, 2001
- 6,021
- 547
- 126
Klixxer, I did offer a deterrent - burying them once they're dead with bacon in their mouth. If they're really religious, that should scare the hell out of them, literally. If they don't care, they're hypocrites.
rchiu: "Have you ever thought about why those people are so fanatic about the religion? Could it be that they have nothing to live for in the current world, and their only hope is in the after life? "
Well, a UN study from a few years ago (sorry, no link, just memories of articles) was saying that the Islamic countries have some of the lowest rates of literacy in the world, no women's rights and poor standards of living.
Once, Islam was a thriving civilization. They had street lamps while most of Europe was still living in hovels. Then it all went downhill... Look at how T.E. Lawrence found them during WWI... What else, if not religion, is at fault here?
The point is: they have nothing to live for because they have a culture of death, and life is not to be embellished.
Anyone here reading science-fiction? Good, now tell me, in all honesty: where are the Islamic scientists? Where are the Islamic writers, actors, poets and musicians? When will we see space exploration or any type of discovery made by an Islamic country? (Please keep in mind, I'm not saying "Arab country" - there are secular Middle-Eastern countries who live very well, and whose scientis we see every day at Western Universities. But can the Taliban create anything? )
so, rchiu, when you say" If you can't think with reason and try to dismiss an entire religion without understanding the political and social condition in those troubled places," I disagree with you... I have probably seen more of the world than you have, and lived in many contries you'll probably only know from your evening news. I'm realistic, nothing more.
And if we're discussing Chechens *only*, I've said before that their lack of love for the Russians is understandable. But stooping as low as killing children is something nobody has the right to do. No feeling of patriotism justifies that.
rchiu: "Have you ever thought about why those people are so fanatic about the religion? Could it be that they have nothing to live for in the current world, and their only hope is in the after life? "
Well, a UN study from a few years ago (sorry, no link, just memories of articles) was saying that the Islamic countries have some of the lowest rates of literacy in the world, no women's rights and poor standards of living.
Once, Islam was a thriving civilization. They had street lamps while most of Europe was still living in hovels. Then it all went downhill... Look at how T.E. Lawrence found them during WWI... What else, if not religion, is at fault here?
The point is: they have nothing to live for because they have a culture of death, and life is not to be embellished.
Anyone here reading science-fiction? Good, now tell me, in all honesty: where are the Islamic scientists? Where are the Islamic writers, actors, poets and musicians? When will we see space exploration or any type of discovery made by an Islamic country? (Please keep in mind, I'm not saying "Arab country" - there are secular Middle-Eastern countries who live very well, and whose scientis we see every day at Western Universities. But can the Taliban create anything? )
so, rchiu, when you say" If you can't think with reason and try to dismiss an entire religion without understanding the political and social condition in those troubled places," I disagree with you... I have probably seen more of the world than you have, and lived in many contries you'll probably only know from your evening news. I'm realistic, nothing more.
And if we're discussing Chechens *only*, I've said before that their lack of love for the Russians is understandable. But stooping as low as killing children is something nobody has the right to do. No feeling of patriotism justifies that.
hey burnedout, thanks for that.
My school district is on there... we scored a 'good'.
<---all about taking care of the kids
My school district is on there... we scored a 'good'.
<---all about taking care of the kids
Anita: You and I have both contentiously disagreed on these boards dating back almost three years now. Count me as one of those who might have previously insinuated that you are a Commie.
Not this time. Good post.
By the way, how's the Ph D coming along?
Not this time. Good post.
By the way, how's the Ph D coming along?
Just kill everyone that has any religious beliefs, then the 8% of the world thats left can live without worrying about you tools and your imaginary friends
Great to hear and glad to help. You live near Altamonte Springs, if I'm not mistaken. One of my brothers owns a glass shop in Altamonte, but lives in Orlando, and has a son in an Orange County school.
If there's any "good" resulting from the tragic events in Russia, then hopefully it would be our ability to react.
Iran has a film industry with some very critically acclaimed directors. Maybe you don't hear much about their musicians since it's different than what you're used to.
Maybe they're not as evident or as strongly represented though.
I am not joking when i say to you that if i could have put my life on the line to help even ONE of those children i would have.
It is not foreign for me to do so either, but you as well as others oversimplify the problem at hand.
You will get support from some for that, who like the simple solutions but refuse to look beyond them, this isn't about religion, this is about opression and i am pretty sure you know that.
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