Former Malaysia PM Mahathir: US Dollar Collapse Inevitable

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
22,994
779
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Malaysia's Mahathir Predicts Dollar's Fall
03.29.2005, 09:32 PM

Former Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad, whose economic management during the 1997-98 financial crisis won worldwide accolades, says the U.S. dollar is heading for a collapse, and urged international businesses to trade in euro, news reports said Wednesday.

In a dialogue session with international CEOs on Tuesday, Mahathir said only the fear of a global economic catastrophe in the event of a dollar collapse is helping the greenback retain its value, the Star and the New Straits Times newspapers reported.

But the dollar has scant real backing, and is in fact being weighed down by the massive U.S. debts and deficit.

"The catastrophe will come one day because even the most powerful country in the world cannot repay loans amounting to US$ 7 trillion (euro5.3 trillion)," he was quoted as saying during the dialogue, held in Sabah state on Borneo island.

"The uncertainty is with the timing, not whether it will collapse," said Mahathir, whose dislike for U.S. economic and foreign policies are well known.

However, it was the pragmatic Mahathir - prime minister until 2003 - who had insisted on pegging Malaysia's ringgit currency to the U.S. dollar in 1998 to combat the financial crisis when the freely convertible currencies around the region fell dramatically.

Most governments took massive loans from the International Monetary Fund to prop up their currencies, but Mahathir refused the dole, earning widespread scorn at the time, and fixed the currency rate.

However, his policy was later acknowledged as sound and Malaysia came out of the crisis in a relative good shape. The ringgit remains pegged at 3.8 to a dollar but Mahathir has said in recent months it is time to re-float the currency because it is being hurt by the dollar's almost daily fall against all major currencies.

The weak dollar - and hence the weak ringgit - has made imports into Malaysia more expensive.

Also, when companies are paid in U.S. dollar, they are being paid less "because the currency has devalued by 50 percent," he was quoted as saying.

If businesses don't want to be shortchanged they should ask to be paid in other stronger currencies such as the euro, or in euro equivalent, he said.

"The time will come when you have to move away from the U.S. dollar" as the international currency of trade, he said, adding that he has suggested the use of gold as an alternative, stable currency.

He blamed Washington's massive deficit on President George W. Bush's economic policies.

"Unless they (Americans) change their president and have a more responsible president who will try to reduce the deficit, they will have serious trouble with the U.S. currency," Mahathir was quoted as saying.

http://www.forbes.com/work/feeds/ap/2005/03/29/ap1912547.html

I've been saying this for a while now. Unlike what dick cheney says, defecits DO matter. If it didn't, even democrats would be jumping on the 'borrow and spend' policy bandwagon as it'd be a great way to get elected.

Unfortantely, there's no such thing as a free lunch. If the economy collapses because of Bush, i'm getting the hell out of dodge. Maybe i should convert all my dollars into Euros before the inevitable collapse or something.
 

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
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It's definitely making repaying my Canadian loans harder. I don't think it's been this bad against the CAN dollar in many, many years. In 2001 one US buck got about $1.50 CAN and now it's closer to $1.20
 

Stunt

Diamond Member
Jul 17, 2002
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Urging people to convert to the euro is going to HELP accelerate the decline in the US dollar.
Also the conversion to the euro is just killing the European and to a much lesser extent the Canadian economies.
If Canada didnt have oil and gas, we'd be in trouble.
The world leaders have been urging the US to stabilize their currency...this is not going to happen if the first world invests heavily in the euro instead of the US dollar. I can't see the global economic powers taking this guy's advice as it is going against exactly what they are advocating.
 

maddogchen

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2004
8,903
2
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China is thinking of taking itself off the dollar and peg its currency to another sometime this year, because of the drop in the dollar.

So...all our made in China cheap stuff (clothing, toys..etc) might go up in the future.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,670
6,246
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Originally posted by: Stunt
Urging people to convert to the euro is going to HELP accelerate the decline in the US dollar.
Also the conversion to the euro is just killing the European and to a much lesser extent the Canadian economies.
If Canada didnt have oil and gas, we'd be in trouble.
The world leaders have been urging the US to stabilize their currency...this is not going to happen if the first world invests heavily in the euro instead of the US dollar. I can't see the global economic powers taking this guy's advice as it is going against exactly what they are advocating.

Very true. However, from what I got from his reasoning was that it was going to happen either way, so it was better to make it happen now and get it over with. I think he has a point, as time goes by the risk to the $US only increases and as such the inevitable result only becomes worse. Not only that, but as he pointed out, the current weakness of the $US is hurting the Global Economies Trade in $US(just about everyone).
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
22,994
779
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Originally posted by: maddogchen
China is thinking of taking itself off the dollar and peg its currency to another sometime this year, because of the drop in the dollar.

So...all our made in China cheap stuff (clothing, toys..etc) might go up in the future.

I think that'll be the day the dollar crashes... :eek:

Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Stunt
Urging people to convert to the euro is going to HELP accelerate the decline in the US dollar.
Also the conversion to the euro is just killing the European and to a much lesser extent the Canadian economies.
If Canada didnt have oil and gas, we'd be in trouble.
The world leaders have been urging the US to stabilize their currency...this is not going to happen if the first world invests heavily in the euro instead of the US dollar. I can't see the global economic powers taking this guy's advice as it is going against exactly what they are advocating.

Very true. However, from what I got from his reasoning was that it was going to happen either way, so it was better to make it happen now and get it over with. I think he has a point, as time goes by the risk to the $US only increases and as such the inevitable result only becomes worse. Not only that, but as he pointed out, the current weakness of the $US is hurting the Global Economies Trade in $US(just about everyone).

Yup, it's going to happen anyway, so i'll convert it all to euros while the rest of you suckers wallow in your worthless USD :p
 

Stunt

Diamond Member
Jul 17, 2002
9,717
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The US dollar is only destined to crash if people think this.
International powers have far more sway to tell the US to get its sh!t together with regards to fiscal management than just pulling massive amounts of capital out of US funds. Threats can be just as effective as doing.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
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www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Phokus

He blamed Washington's massive deficit on President George W. Bush's economic policies.

"Unless they (Americans) change their president and have a more responsible president who will try to reduce the deficit, they will have serious trouble with the U.S. currency," Mahathir was quoted as saying.

Talk about a day late and a dollar short.
 

fornax

Diamond Member
Jul 21, 2000
6,866
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So many people have shorted the dollar that it may in fact stay at current levels for a long time :)
 

Stunt

Diamond Member
Jul 17, 2002
9,717
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Although the US economy is doing the euro economy in the a$$.
Germany has a negative gdp, the rest are barely at 1-2% growth.
US and Canada are 3-4%+
 

glenn1

Lifer
Sep 6, 2000
25,383
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While his prediction may indeed come true, the reasons he uses as his premise are completely wrong. Yes, the United States has a high debt to GDP, but it's bigger in the EU zone with less growth potential to shrink the ratio. The current account deficit is the flip side of a capital investment surplus for the United States so it's a wash (and never will be an issue unless and until foreigners decide not to invest capital in the United States, likely not going to happen). What currency a country gets paid in makes no difference whatsoever, the payment will be specified in the subsidiary company's national currency. Why would a company ask to be paid in a currency it can't spend in the country in which it operates? That's like going to work in Malaysia and asking to be paid in Swedish Kronor because that's what country you grew up in. Currency conversion will occur when/if the parent company is able to repatriate it. As far as central banks keeping some Euros in addition to dollars for diversification purposes, that's a valid point but they're not doing so because they hate the dollar. Over the long term the Euro has no structural advantages over the dollar to keep as a reserve currency.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,670
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Originally posted by: glenn1
While his prediction may indeed come true, the reasons he uses as his premise are completely wrong. Yes, the United States has a high debt to GDP, but it's bigger in the EU zone with less growth potential to shrink the ratio. The current account deficit is the flip side of a capital investment surplus for the United States so it's a wash (and never will be an issue unless and until foreigners decide not to invest capital in the United States, likely not going to happen). What currency a country gets paid in makes no difference whatsoever, the payment will be specified in the subsidiary company's national currency. Why would a company ask to be paid in a currency it can't spend in the country in which it operates? That's like going to work in Malaysia and asking to be paid in Swedish Kronor because that's what country you grew up in. Currency conversion will occur when/if the parent company is able to repatriate it. As far as central banks keeping some Euros in addition to dollars for diversification purposes, that's a valid point but they're not doing so because they hate the dollar. Over the long term the Euro has no structural advantages over the dollar to keep as a reserve currency.

But the Euro does have an advantage, it's value. The current problem is that the Global Economy has been taking a hit due to the devaluation of the $US. Nations and Corporations have been losing money when exchanging back into their local currencies, as their currencies(to a large extent) gain value against the $US.

As for what currency a company asks to be paid in: That situation already exists for the $US, meaning that conversion is already the norm in International Trade so one day it could be that someone would like to be paid in Swedish Kronors, if Swedish Kronors were the Currency used for International Trade(highly unlikely of course). The reason that the $US is currently the Currency used for Trade is due to its' stability, if that is removed it no longer serves its' purpose.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
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The problem is pretty well defined- Bush policy has effectively prevented the decline of the dollar to some degree, simply by providing an investment vehicle, US govt bonds, for all the surplus dollars overseas, which get there through outsourcing into the global economy. Without the federal deficit to soak up those excess dollars, our currency would be worth even less than it is, and American investors would have little incentive for further outsourcing... higher prices for foreign goods would also promote domestic investment and production of those goods, too...

In the long run, it benefits only the American dollar investor class, who are currently obtaining hard overseas assets in return for soft American dollars- at a bargain rate. As the value of the currency declines, and debt maintenance costs rise, they'll also have even greater leverage over the govt itself. Even if they push it too hard, inducing a precipitous collapse, their position of relative power will only be enhanced- they hold the notes, and those hard offshore assets as well.

Yeh, sure, American consumers are receiving the short term benefits of unbelievably cheap foreign goods, but those goods aren't durable in the same sense as commercial property, for example, or mineral rights or contracts to provide xyz products and services in other currencies... nor are they really as valuable to Joe and Joan Sixpack as stable employment with health insurance, pensions, and other benefits, something rapidly disappearing from the American economy...

And there's this, pretty ominous for the dollar, all things considered-

http://www.arabnews.com/?page=6&section=0&article=61225&d=29&m=3&y=2005

They don't have a name for this new currency, but when they do, it'll pretty much be the doom of the dollar. Might as well call it the Petro, because it will rapidly become the currency of oil, hitting the Dollar where it really hurts....

Growth? Referencing what's happening in the US economy as growth is like thinking that going hog wild with credit cards represents honest prosperity... taxcuts w/o offsetting spending cuts aren't taxcuts at all, and outsourcing can't sustain us unless we create jobs of equal or greater purchasing power to replace those that are leaving... Yeh, there's profit to be made in the meanwhile, but that's a transitional phenomenon, and not one in which everybody shares... longterm negative effects are obviously more widespread...
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
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nor are they really as valuable to Joe and Joan Sixpack as stable employment with health insurance, pensions, and other benefits, something rapidly disappearing from the American economy...

And the best part is the bankers and the republican lackies is about to sell Americans into life-long virtual "debtor prisons" by revocking many bankruptcy conditions, not allowed Chap 7 anymore if you can pay $300 a month for 10 years. Take away the good paying jobs, extend irresposible levels of credit, then trap em' into subserviance. Great plan if it works. You may have a revolution on your hands if things get too bad.
 

Chinadefender

Member
Dec 1, 2004
161
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;)Perhaps Mahathir is too simple.

US may "encourage" some instability in Europe and strike Euro.:Q

If you converted all your Dollar assets to Euro in 2002, you are much smarter than Warren Buffett.

It is said that he earned 1.8 billion US dollars in 2004 via the converting!!! :Q

This man......................magic guy!


 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
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www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Zebo
nor are they really as valuable to Joe and Joan Sixpack as stable employment with health insurance, pensions, and other benefits, something rapidly disappearing from the American economy...

And the best part is the bankers and the republican lackies is about to sell Americans into life-long virtual "debtor prisons" by revocking many bankruptcy conditions, not allowed Chap 7 anymore if you can pay $300 a month for 10 years.

Take away the good paying jobs, extend irresposible levels of credit, then trap em' into subserviance. Great plan if it works.

You may have a revolution on your hands if things get too bad.
==================================================
You may have a revolution on your hands if things get too bad.

Hmmmmm, when I said that P&N experts said that would never happen.
 

Sunbird

Golden Member
Jul 20, 2001
1,024
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Maybe the world needs a global currency, then we just have to worry about inflation and such, and not currency strengths.