Former Gov. Ted Strickland tried to live on Min. Wage and said he didn't make it

[nehalem256]

So when you go to mcdonalds at least in this area, when I was a teenager, it was mostly teenagers working the counter. But today.. noooo completely different. Most of them are my age... 20-30. They are displacing the teenagers, whose unemployment is skyhigh. Adults outnumber teenagers at most minimum wage jobs I am seeing right now. I getoff late from work and go to the 24 hour walmart since its the only place open at that time if I need something and lo and behold you have 20-40 yr/olds stocking the shelves. Like 50 of them. I did that as a teen, and there sure as hell weren't any 20-40 yr/olds at my side since we were all basically a bunch of screwballs at that age.

Nobody except truly the bottom of the barrel people were trying to live off minimum wage 10 years ago but today they seem not too bad in the smarts department. Sometimes I joke "Whats your degree in" when I see someone my age and they seem pretty smart. I've gotten back like "electrical engineer but my gpa was 2.5" or "english..."and shit like that. Oh well! Guess I'm just a technology luddite and don't have a link of proof from Huffpo about an article that the author barely skimmed nor understood to prove it to you. Its not like I see it everyday in action or anything.

Fun fact:

http://livingwage.mit.edu/places/3904918000

Fun fact 2: Typical hourly wage for Food Preparation and Serving Related in Columbus $8.67

Seems like in Columbus Ohio McDonalds is already paying above minimum wage.

 

[dphantom]

The minimum wage was enacted by congress and pushed by F.D.R. to be most definitely a living wage, in fact I quote FDR here where he said:

"No business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country.

By living wages, I mean more than a bare subsistence level — I mean the wages of a decent living.

All but the hopelessly reactionary will agree that to conserve our primary resources of man power, government must have some control over maximum hours, minimum wages, the evil of child labor and the exploitation of unorganized labor." end quote

Many of you need to re-read history again. That is exactly why the minimum wage was created. It was created to be a livable wage for people.

You need to re-read history. I added the proper citation to each of the quotes so you will stay honest and not distort the discussion. By the way, historians are in general agreement the NIRA was a failure. FLSA though has been a success overall.

No business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country.” (1933, Statement on National Industrial Recovery Act)

“By living wages, I mean more than a bare subsistence level — I mean the wages of a decent living.” (1933, Statement on National Industrial Recovery Act)

This is what FDR said about the FLSA:

“Do not let any calamity-howling executive with an income of $1,000 a day, who has been turning his employees over to the Government relief rolls in order to preserve his company’s undistributed reserves, tell you – using his stockholders’ money to pay the postage for his personal opinions — tell you that a wage of $11.00 a week is going to have a disastrous effect on all American industry.” (1938, Fireside Chat, the night before signing the Fair Labor Standards Act that instituted the federal minimum wage)

“All but the hopelessly reactionary will agree that to conserve our primary resources of man power, government must have some control over maximum hours, minimum wages, the evil of child labor and the exploitation of unorganized labor.” (1937, Message to Congress upon introduction of the Fair Labor Standards Act)

 

[dawheat]

First, I applaud any attempt by any public figure to experience life like those who are too often marginalized in our society. It may not be a true apples to apples comparison, but it's still far more than most elected officials do to understand this particular demographic. At the least, it will provide the compassion that is so often missing in people when it's purely an academic exercise and not an experienced reality.

Secondly, I'm frankly a little disturbed by those who basically are OK that minimum wage in the greatest country in world merely be enough to avoid starvation (e.g. buy a bag of beans and rice and eat it for the month). As a country and society - is that really all that we're capable of doing?

Hey - I don't like governmental waste nor do I like healthy folk staying on government assistance their entire life, but part of being American is the social contract we have with each other. So I have less and less sympathy for being against reasonable increases in the minimum wage in a time of record corporate profits and skyrocketing wealth in the upper 1%.

There is a more healthy balance between the full entitlement society pushed by the extreme left and the complete cut off and die society pushed by the extreme right.

 

[SagaLore]

Well, he's obviously a failure. There are millions living on minimum wage.

Define "living". I think you meant surviving.

 

[Newell Steamer]

The Governor CLEARLY spent all his money the following:
- abortions
- TVs
- iPhone
- illegal drugs
- cable
- sneakers
- more illegal drugs

Disgusting.

 

[nehalem256]

The Governor CLEARLY spent all his money the following:
- abortions
- TVs
- iPhone
- illegal drugs
- cable
- sneakers
- more illegal drugs

Disgusting.

That would explain why he was unable to figure out how long it would take to walk 1 mile.

 

[Oldgamer]

You need to re-read history. I added the proper citation to each of the quotes so you will stay honest and not distort the discussion. By the way, historians are in general agreement the NIRA was a failure. FLSA though has been a success overall.

No business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country.” (1933, Statement on National Industrial Recovery Act)

“By living wages, I mean more than a bare subsistence level — I mean the wages of a decent living.” (1933, Statement on National Industrial Recovery Act)

This is what FDR said about the FLSA:

“Do not let any calamity-howling executive with an income of $1,000 a day, who has been turning his employees over to the Government relief rolls in order to preserve his company’s undistributed reserves, tell you – using his stockholders’ money to pay the postage for his personal opinions — tell you that a wage of $11.00 a week is going to have a disastrous effect on all American industry.” (1938, Fireside Chat, the night before signing the Fair Labor Standards Act that instituted the federal minimum wage)

“All but the hopelessly reactionary will agree that to conserve our primary resources of man power, government must have some control over maximum hours, minimum wages, the evil of child labor and the exploitation of unorganized labor.” (1937, Message to Congress upon introduction of the Fair Labor Standards Act)

I am not being dishonest about anything, the points made still stand and the meaning is the same with or without your citations FDR said these things with regard to min. wage and employment. My point is still the same and still just as valid. No twisting here was done. What exactly did you think I was trying to twist, now I am curious?

As you show above he said those things, he said those things concerning employment with regard to people at the lower rung, and with regard to min. wage.. and so? Your point?

 

[Oldgamer]

First, I applaud any attempt by any public figure to experience life like those who are too often marginalized in our society. It may not be a true apples to apples comparison, but it's still far more than most elected officials do to understand this particular demographic. At the least, it will provide the compassion that is so often missing in people when it's purely an academic exercise and not an experienced reality.

Secondly, I'm frankly a little disturbed by those who basically are OK that minimum wage in the greatest country in world merely be enough to avoid starvation (e.g. buy a bag of beans and rice and eat it for the month). As a country and society - is that really all that we're capable of doing?

Hey - I don't like governmental waste nor do I like healthy folk staying on government assistance their entire life, but part of being American is the social contract we have with each other. So I have less and less sympathy for being against reasonable increases in the minimum wage in a time of record corporate profits and skyrocketing wealth in the upper 1%.

There is a more healthy balance between the full entitlement society pushed by the extreme left and the complete cut off and die society pushed by the extreme right.

Agreed...

 

[werepossum]

:whiste:

That was an awesome bit of info. So now we have a few related issues.

How many people are earning less than $8.15?

How many people get less than 40 hours, thus not meeting the total required income considered livable?

How are Obamacare and similar laws making this worse? This isn't an easy question as lack of health insurance is itself a major problem, especially if one is already earning the bare minimum to get by. If you're Rush Limbaugh, not having health insurance costs you money. If you're an $8.67/hour burger flipper, not having health insurance costs you money you don't have.

 

[Atreus21]

For all of last week, I worked hard to live on the budget of a minimum wage worker. That meant I had $77 to spend on food, transportation, activities and other personal expenses for the week. I didn't make it.

Most mornings started with eggs and toast, bought last Sunday during a grocery trip costing more than $15. Lunches were normally leftovers, macaroni and cheese or McDonald’s. There were no big dinners or coffee stops on a whim. But the challenges were beyond food.

Wednesday morning, I had a meeting about a mile from my apartment, but in the opposite direction of my office. I would normally take a cab, but this time, I took off my jacket and walked the mile in 90-degree heat, then walked back almost 2 miles to my office. Walking made me late to my meeting, but a minimum wage budget doesn’t allow for extra transportation costs, making it my only option.

And early in the week when I actually caught a cold, I felt lucky to already have medicine at home that would help with the symptoms. Medicine, along with any other unexpected or additional expenses, often prevents the budget from stretching as far as it needs to stretch. That was a lesson I learned when my budget ran out on Thursday evening.

These are just some of the small realities I have learned about life on the minimum wage.

Washington is in a bubble that keeps our representatives away from the experiences of those they actually represent.

We need to understand the challenges faced by Americans who are being left behind in our economy. That’s why I joined members of Congress and dozens of organizations in taking the Live the Wage challenge (www.LivetheWage.com), and asking those in Congress to actually try living on the minimum wage for a week before opposing an increase that would help millions of Americans who currently live in poverty.

For the week, I walked as much as I possibly could to avoid paying for transportation, skipped meals to save money — and I ate much smaller and less healthful meals when I did eat. Because fresh fruits and vegetables are hard to find at a price within a minimum wage budget, I turned to bread, peanut butter, bananas and bologna more than anything else. That was what I could find when I took this budget to the grocery story last Sunday. And that’s why I ate lunch from the McDonald’s dollar menu.

Thankfully, I did this by myself. For millions of Americans, a minimum wage salary has to cover an entire family. Right now, in America, a minimum wage worker is spending her workday worrying about a decision she is going to have to make when she finally makes it home. Will it be electricity or diapers this week? Medicine or gas?

It has been five years since the federal minimum wage was raised to $7.25. While some cities and states have acted to raise their own minimum wages, many have stood still, content to let their workers effectively make less and less each year. When the federal minimum wage was increased in July 2009, gas averaged $2.45 per gallon. Today, it is $3.55, meaning filling a car with a 12-gallon tank would cost an extra $13.20. That might not sound like much, but it is close to two hours of work on a minimum wage salary. The same can be said for even more basic needs, like a gallon of milk, which is nearly 75 cents more per gallon than it was in July 2009.

Raising the minimum wage to $10.10 will increase the average annual salary of a minimum wage worker to $19,777, hardly a living wage, but a major step forward for the 30 million hardworking Americans who live in poverty while earning the minimum wage.

I have an apartment here in Washington and a good job. I know I’ll never be able to truly walk in the shoes of a minimum wage worker, but experiencing just some of the decisions this income requires on a daily basis is enough to understand that we need to do better for these hardworking families. It’s un-American that you can work and work and work and not get out of poverty. The promise of America is that working hard and playing by the rules will help you get ahead, but right now, we’re breaking that promise. It’s time to give America a raise.

Link to source

I think it should be a requirement, all those opposed to a minimum wage hike have to try this for at least one week like this guy did.

Sorry. Wages are prices, and prices have meaning. They're not just arbitrary factors you can manipulate. They reflect market realities. Not all labor is priced the same. If you can do a job that literally every other able-bodied human on earth can do with no education and little training, your labor is not worth very much.

Let's suppose I employed someone, for no good reason, to do absolutely nothing. To sit at a desk 40 hours a week and screw around on the internet. Are they entitled to a "living wage" simply because they technically have a job? Or is their wage rightly tied to their skills and productivity?

 

[Victorian Gray]

Sorry. Wages are prices, and prices have meaning. They're not just arbitrary factors you can manipulate. They reflect market realities. Not all labor is priced the same. If you can do a job that literally every other able-bodied human on earth can do with no education and little training, your labor is not worth very much.

Let's suppose I employed someone, for no good reason, to do absolutely nothing. To sit at a desk 40 hours a week and screw around on the internet. Are they entitled to a "living wage" simply because they technically have a job? Or is their wage rightly tied to their skills and productivity?

You hired them to do nothing so, if they are doing a good job at doing nothing, why wouldn't you pay them top dollar to be good at what they are (not) doing?

 

[werepossum]

Sorry. Wages are prices, and prices have meaning. They're not just arbitrary factors you can manipulate. They reflect market realities. Not all labor is priced the same. If you can do a job that literally every other able-bodied human on earth can do with no education and little training, your labor is not worth very much.

Let's suppose I employed someone, for no good reason, to do absolutely nothing. To sit at a desk 40 hours a week and screw around on the internet. Are they entitled to a "living wage" simply because they technically have a job? Or is their wage rightly tied to their skills and productivity?

That is an excellent point, and philosophically I agree. However, there are always practical exceptions to pure philosophy. Many people will be unable (or, admittedly, unwilling) to provide enough value to survive. These people must either beg, or be supported by the government, or turn to crime, or revolt. Is it acceptable in America for people to work and yet be unable to survive? I'm betting most Americans would say no, that is not acceptable. Thus we need to decide to what level we will make them whole, and how we will implement that. Thus, the minimum wage, in conjunction with food stamps, subsidized housing, educational assistance, and a myriad of other handout systems. As handouts go, this is one of my favorites because it rewards people for working, which to me trumps my dislike of redistributing wealth given that I don't think it's acceptable for these people to starve.

 

[OverVolt]

.. Post went into the wrong thread... it was like postception

 

[Zaap]

That would explain why he was unable to figure out how long it would take to walk 1 mile.

I'm curious how long it took him to walk a mile. For even the most out of shape, lazy politician, I would guestimate 15 to 20 minutes, tops. 20 at an absolute snail's pace.

Basically since this whole article was written for McOwned types, you're supposed to emote and feel that this idiot proved something. You're NOT supposed to notice (as a good little govt. suckup) that he really just proved that he's such a lazy jackass, he NEVER walks even one freakin' mile anywhere, and so would know how much time to alot for it.

So basically, if he even has to go a mile, he'll "take a cab". A freakin' cab, to go a mile.

I'd bet good money this same turd goes on rants about global warming and how everyone else should have to give up their cars.

Oh look, no sooner than I wrote it:
http://www.dispatch.com/content/sto...ickland-panel-urge-climate-change-action.html

A true Dim's Dim.

 

[sportage]

Yeah, the damn hookers will break your budget every time.

 

[Olikan]

I'm curious how long it took him to walk a mile. For even the most out of shape, lazy politician, I would guestimate 15 to 20 minutes, tops. 20 at an absolute snail's pace.

Basically since this whole article was written for McOwned types, you're supposed to emote and feel that this idiot proved something. You're NOT supposed to notice (as a good little govt. suckup) that he really just proved that he's such a lazy jackass, he NEVER walks even one freakin' mile anywhere, and so would know how much time to alot for it.

So.... the guy is a bag full of failure, don`t even deserve minimum vage...
Yet managed to get elected, and have a decent job

The only way is a golden parachute...but hurr durr... McOwned

 

[dphantom]

I am not being dishonest about anything, the points made still stand and the meaning is the same with or without your citations FDR said these things with regard to min. wage and employment. My point is still the same and still just as valid. No twisting here was done. What exactly did you think I was trying to twist, now I am curious?

As you show above he said those things, he said those things concerning employment with regard to people at the lower rung, and with regard to min. wage.. and so? Your point?

FLSA was the ruling minimum wage law. The quotes attributed to NIRA were not. A partial text of the NIRA is below:



Transcript of National Industrial Recovery Act (1933)




print-friendly version
AN ACT
To encourage national industrial recovery, to foster fair competition, and to provide for the construction of certain useful public works, and for other purposes.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,

TITLE I—INDUSTRIAL RECOVERY

DECLARATION OF POLICY

SECTION 1. A national emergency productive of widespread unemployment and disorganization of industry, which burdens interstate and foreign commerce, affects the public welfare, and undermines the standards of living of the American people, is hereby declared to exist. It is hereby declared to be the policy of Congress to remove obstructions to the free flow of interstate and foreign commerce which tend to diminish the amount thereof; and to provide for the general welfare by promoting the organization of industry for the purpose of cooperative action among trade groups, to induce and maintain united action of labor and management under adequate governmental sanctions and supervision, to eliminate unfair competitive practices, to promote the fullest possible utilization of the present productive capacity of industries, to avoid undue restriction of production (except as may be temporarily required), to increase the consumption of Industrial and agricultural products by increasing purchasing power, to reduce and relieve unemployment, to improve standards of labor, and otherwise to rehabilitate industry and to conserve natural resources.

*********************************

Note the acts purpose (one of them) was to increase purchasing power, not establish per se a minimum wage though the "codes" described do so in some respect. That may be splitting hairs but to me, precision in my work is everything (lives may depend on my actions) and I tend to carry that over into discussions as well.

 

[Atreus21]

You hired them to do nothing so, if they are doing a good job at doing nothing, why wouldn't you pay them top dollar to be good at what they are (not) doing?

Exactly. In the case of low skill workers, I hired them to do work that just about anyone else can do. Why should I pay them in excess of the value of their labor?

 

[Atreus21]

That is an excellent point, and philosophically I agree. However, there are always practical exceptions to pure philosophy. Many people will be unable (or, admittedly, unwilling) to provide enough value to survive. These people must either beg, or be supported by the government, or turn to crime, or revolt. Is it acceptable in America for people to work and yet be unable to survive?

We need to define survival. If survival means having enough to eat and drink, then most any job in America is sufficient for survival. If survival means having a roof over your head, then clearly not any job in America is sufficient.

I'm betting most Americans would say no, that is not acceptable. Thus we need to decide to what level we will make them whole, and how we will implement that. Thus, the minimum wage, in conjunction with food stamps, subsidized housing, educational assistance, and a myriad of other handout systems. As handouts go, this is one of my favorites because it rewards people for working, which to me trumps my dislike of redistributing wealth given that I don't think it's acceptable for these people to starve.

I disagree. I think it perpetuates an underclass. A impoverished unskilled 17 year old might apply for a job. If not for the minimum wage, he might be employed for something like $4.00 an hour. Now obviously that wouldn't support him by itself. But is it better than the alternative? Is it better that he remain unemployed and unskilled? Or is it better that he be making some type of income, while learning basic job training and values like getting to work on time and interacting with others in a professional manner?

What minimum wage has done is price such a person out of the labor market. Whereas without it we might have a man working for wages his betters consider exploitative, now we have a chronically unemployed man statistically predisposed to criminal behavior (by being impoverished).

Prices shouldn't be manipulated for any product, including labor.

 

[nehalem256]

I disagree. I think it perpetuates an underclass. A impoverished unskilled 17 year old might apply for a job. If not for the minimum wage, he might be employed for something like $4.00 an hour. Now obviously that wouldn't support him by itself. But is it better than the alternative? Is it better that he remain unemployed and unskilled? Or is it better that he be making some type of income, while learning basic job training and values like getting to work on time and interacting with others in a professional manner?

What minimum wage has done is price such a person out of the labor market. Whereas without it we might have a man working for wages his betters consider exploitative, now we have a chronically unemployed man statistically predisposed to criminal behavior (by being impoverished).

I doubt that minimum wage at its current level does this.

If you aren't worth $7.25/hr its probably because you are incapable of holding a job.

For example see the stats I provided:

Fun fact 2: Typical hourly wage for Food Preparation and Serving Related in Columbus $8.67

If minimum wage was raised to say $15/hr then you would likely be correct.

 

[Atreus21]

I doubt that minimum wage at its current level does this.

If you aren't worth $7.25/hr its probably because you are incapable of holding a job.

For example see the stats I provided:


If minimum wage was raised to say $15/hr then you would likely be correct.

If the average wage is already 8 bucks an hour, what use is the minimum wage when it's below equilibrium prices?

 

[OverVolt]

If the average wage is already 8 bucks an hour, what use is the minimum wage when it's below equilibrium prices?

Meh... Pretty much. I'd say $9 minimum wage would help out people who are struggling (not enough power to negotiate wages) without too many side effects (rampant low skill unemployment or businesses buckling from the added cost.)

The $15 dollar an hour stuff is crazy. There are so many people who put up with like 2x as difficult jobs as a retail job for say, $12.50 and those people would literally take all those mcdonalds jobs overnight and the people who I guess you could say "haven't learned how to learn job skills" would be unemployed SUPER FAST. It would actually lead to a shortage of low-medium paying jobs in the ~35k-40k range. Why work in a coal mine when you can sell TV's at best buy in air conditioning. Why dig up septic tanks when you can flip burgers. Why mow lawns for HOA's in the summer sun when you can read books at the cash register of a convenience store. Why risk your hearing working around jack hammers in construction when you can stock the shelves at walmart. You get the idea.