For once, I agree with this Al Sharpton.

[tvarad]

Why isn't the guy incarcerated with run-of-the-mill muggers, convenience store hold-up artists et. al. in a garden variety jail? I for one am indignant when I see pictures or videos catching them in the act. Madoff's crimes are just as egregious if not worse. This guy has already caused a couple of suicides. But he can wear down the legal system with just a fraction of his ill-gotten gains with a real possibility of going scot free on a technicality.


Sharpton calls for justice outside Madoff's home

NEW YORK (Reuters) ? Saying Bernard Madoff enjoys a "gilded penthouse incarceration," civil rights activist Al Sharpton led a rally outside the accused swindler's Manhattan home on Saturday urging equal justice for the rich and poor.

Sharpton and about 30 other demonstrators protested that Madoff was being allowed to remain free pending trial while poor people with no access to top legal representation languished in prison for relatively minor infractions.

"There must be one standard for all, and not one based on income," Sharpton said at the protest on Manhattan's affluent Upper East Side.

He added that Madoff was experiencing "a kind of gilded penthouse incarceration."

Madoff, 70, was arrested on December 11 in connection with what authorities have described as the biggest Ponzi scheme in history. In a Ponzi scheme, early investors are paid with money from new investors.

According to prosecutors, Madoff has confessed that his money management business was "one big lie" and had racked up losses of as much as $50 billion.

Madoff is under house arrest and 24-hour surveillance in his penthouse apartment as a condition of his $10 million bail agreement.

It was not known if he was home during the rally.

 

[ProfJohn]

I agree, even if he is placed in some white collar prison. He should NOT be in his nice big penthouse.

 

[Schadenfroh]

I agree with the reverend on this. Additionally, his assets should be liquidated and returned to his investors.

The government forced someone I knew to finish working on the Alaskan pipeline (was an engineer) before serving time in a "country club" min security jail. But, at least he was working and not sitting in a penthouse. He misused far far less with his savings and loan company than Madoff's Ponzi scheme.

 

[StageLeft]

He's not been convicted and perhaps is not a flight risk, but if I was deemed no flight risk and was awaiting trial for stealing a corvette, would I be allowed house arrest? Of course not. He is getting preferential treatment. His lawyer must be awesome.

 

[Moonbeam]

He should be in irons on Wall Street where passers by can spit on him.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

About half the things Sharpton says are right on the money. It's the other half that give him his bad rep.

 

[kage69]

I don't see how we're ever going to instill that all necessary trust in the public if we continue to let those who abuse it get a kinder, gentler form of justice than the rest of us live under. I hate to say I'm with Al on this as well. I see both financial trust and impartial rule of law being completely violated. We need to make examples of these corporate fat cat fvckers when they break the law, not put them in time out.

Heart attack in ...4...3...2....

 

[rchiu]

Originally posted by: kage69
I don't see how we're ever going to instill that all necessary trust in the public if we continue to let those who abuse it get a kinder, gentler form of justice than the rest of us live under. I hate to say I'm with Al on this as well. I see both financial trust and impartial rule of law being completely violated. We need to make examples of these corporate fat cat fvckers when they break the law, not put them in time out.

Heart attack in ...4...3...2....

I don't see how Madoff abused the system. The law is there for people who don't have flight risk and is not a danger to the public to post bail and stay home to wait for the trial. Madoff just happens to have the money to hire lawyers to prove those point, post bail and a nice home to stay until the trial happens.

The problem is that there are lots of poor people who don't have the lawyer to argue for them, and don't have the money to post bail, and don't have a nice place to stay. But hey, we know that's a problem in our society today, and Al Sharpton is just stating the obvious. Unless we become a communist country, this inequality is always gonna be there.

 

[MovingTarget]

Well, thats how things go today. You get the justice you can "afford". To me, there is no difference between Madoff and the Bonnie and Clyde types. A thug can only rob you of what you have with you that particular day. The wall street types can rob you of your future. There should be a stricter level of accountability for those that hold others' futures in the palm of their hand....or in this case lining their pockets....

 

[DesiPower]

Why he in Jail??? GWB is living freely in TX

 

[Jiggz]

I agree and it'll probably even better if Al can include C. Rangel in jail too! It seems Al still hasn't gone over his "race" card games despite the fact the POTUS is now non-white!

 

[tvarad]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget
Well, thats how things go today. You get the justice you can "afford". To me, there is no difference between Madoff and the Bonnie and Clyde types. A thug can only rob you of what you have with you that particular day. The wall street types can rob you of your future. There should be a stricter level of accountability for those that hold others' futures in the palm of their hand....or in this case lining their pockets....

Hear, hear.

This type of rape of public trust has happened once before in the '80s Savings and Loan scandal which was the consequence of the dismantling of regulatory mechanisms based on free-market ideologies. It is shocking to see how that mistake has been repeated on a scale of this magnitude. And, as I see it, not one head has rolled so far.

 

[her209]

Two Americas

 

[HardcoreRobot]

because jail is full of nonviolent drug offenders

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Y'know... There was a thread like this a few months back and I'll give the same answer now that I gave back then...

For starters, I hate the guy and I hope he gets what's coming to him...

BUT...

If you were a mugger or stick up artist and you could afford to pay 10% of your bail to a bondsman you'd be out of jail too. You wouldn't be off the hook (much like Madoff is NOT off the hook) but you'd likely NOT be on some kind of monitored house arrest. You'd be free to go and do whatever you want.

In addition to a $10 million bond (cash only - he had to fork it all out, not just 10%) he's under house arrest. That means he can't do whatver he wants. He has to stay home. He's a rich guy so his house is better than that of the average mugger. It sucks but that's how it works. I don't think the judge can order him to be under monitored house arrest in a crappy tenament that isn't his house.

We have bail in this country because you are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Denial of bail is only granted under the most extreme circumstances, usually involving flight risk or serious risk of further bad bahavior. House arrest takes care of the flight risk and there doesn't seem to be anyone who will trust their money to him ever again.

To say that he's being treated special... that he's getting treatment that you or I would be denied is completely false. In fact it's the opposite. He's being treateed more harshly than the average petty criminal awaiting trial would be treated.

Sharpton is playing the same, tired demigogue card that has made him rich. And he preys on weak minded individuals like the OP who are quick to eat up the whole 'it's so unfair' card that he (Sharpton) likes to play without looking at the situation with critical eyes.

 

[Siddhartha]

I rather not have my taxes go towards having this guy in jail.

 

[her209]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
If you were a mugger or stick up artist

This guy stole billions.

He's being treateed more harshly than the average petty criminal awaiting trial would be treated.

Stealing billions is not a petty crime.

 

[MovingTarget]

Originally posted by: Siddhartha
I rather not have my taxes go towards having this guy in jail.

I would rather they did as people deserve equal treatment, not just the treatment they can afford. Besides, having him loose is a risk to the public as he can still do PLENTY of more damage to people's finances and the greater economy.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: Siddhartha
I rather not have my taxes go towards having this guy in jail.

I would rather they did as people deserve equal treatment, not just the treatment they can afford.

He has the same rights under the constitution as everyone else:

"Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted."

Holding him without bail would be excessive for a non-violent crime.

Where are you people getting the idea that people who have been accused of crimes HAVE to stay in jail while they wait for trial? It's pretty rare to be held without bail.

Besides, having him loose is a risk to the public as he can still do PLENTY of more damage to people's finances and the greater economy.

Yeah, he's going to set up another ponzi scheme while he's under house arrest and his communications are being monitored. :roll: If he could do that from his apartment, he could do it from jail.

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: Siddhartha
I rather not have my taxes go towards having this guy in jail.

I would rather they did as people deserve equal treatment, not just the treatment they can afford. Besides, having him loose is a risk to the public as he can still do PLENTY of more damage to people's finances and the greater economy.

He is getting equal treatment. He isn't a flight risk and he has posted bail. Are you saying that we should suspend due process and legal protection under the law for one person? Are you a fascist?

What damage is he going to do?

 

[nutxo]

The bail should have been set equal to what he stole.

 

[LegendKiller]

Originally posted by: nutxo
The bail should have been set equal to what he stole.

Because that is Constitutional also.


How quickly we toss away the Constitution for vengeance or security.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: her209

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
If you were a mugger or stick up artist

This guy stole billions.

He's being treateed more harshly than the average petty criminal awaiting trial would be treated.

Stealing billions is not a petty crime.

Neither is rape or murder but most of the time those people are eligible for bail as well. The comparison that Sharpton is trying to make is that if you or I (normal Joe Sixpak types) did what Maddoff did we'd be sitting in a cell. "Ohhh... look at the rich guy and his special treatment." There is nothing special about the way he's being treated. He lives in a penthouse. If he lived in a double-wide he'd be there instead. Whose house should he be in for his house arrest?

Originally posted by: MovingTarget

Originally posted by: Siddhartha
I rather not have my taxes go towards having this guy in jail.

I would rather they did as people deserve equal treatment, not just the treatment they can afford. Besides, having him loose is a risk to the public as he can still do PLENTY of more damage to people's finances and the greater economy.

He's not loose. He's under house arrest. Get a grip. He can't do anything more.

Bail is a constitutional right, people. It applies to everyone. He hasn't been to trial yet, he hasn't been convicted of anything. I'm not defending the guy. I hope he dies in prison with a prolapsed rectum and lots of cold sores.

But seriously, get a grip. Why is it that some of you have such a hard time with this?

 

[Orsorum]

I agree with Whoozyer.

 

[tvarad]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: nutxo
The bail should have been set equal to what he stole.

Because that is Constitutional also.


How quickly we toss away the Constitution for vengeance or security.

Well, the Constitution has been suspended during times of War and what these Wall Street and Banking Criminals have wrought on the U.S. is pretty close to an act of war.