Florida police chief instructed officers to pin crimes on innocent black people

[HomerJS]

Place this next to the racism that has already come out against Gillam, it's gonna get really ugly in Florida.


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...o-raul-fernandez-charlie-dayoub-a8445021.html

 

[Commodus]

Place this next to the racism that has already come out against Gillam, it's gonna get really ugly in Florida.


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...o-raul-fernandez-charlie-dayoub-a8445021.html

And yet police apologists wonder why Black Lives Matter exists. Some cops are purposefully setting out to frame innocent black people, yet the anti-BLM types doubt that police would let skin color dictate their use of force.

 

[UglyCasanova]

“If they have burglaries that are open cases that are not solved yet, if you see anybody black walking through our streets and they have somewhat of a record, arrest them so we can pin them for all the burglaries,” Anthony De La Torre, who worked in the department under Mr Atesanio, told outside investigators conducting the probe​

Welp he’s not going to be seeing the outside world for a good long time. Lock the POS up and throw away the key.

 

[UglyCasanova]

And yet police apologists wonder why Black Lives Matter exists. Some cops are purposefully setting out to frame innocent black people, yet the anti-BLM types doubt that police would let skin color dictate their use of force.

Police definitely use skin color and it shouldn’t happen. That’s why Ferguson erupted, the heavy handed tactics being used against them came to boil. Michael Brown was a POS and not exactly the kind of person that I’d rally around but so be it, the disparities in policing needs to be addressed. I think that gets lost in the whole police shootings thing which is a small part of a much bigger problem.

The solution is multi fold though. Police departments have to be scrutinized for policing heavier based on racial grounds (not just shootings, if there’s a disparity in traffic stops that’s just as bad). Sentencing by the justice department has to be scrutinized because there absolutely is a racial disparity and there should be no tolerance of it. The drug war has to be scrutinized for the same. The black community has to work with police though because like it or not there is more crime going on within their community vs the rest of the population. There’s more shootings going on etc. I’m afraid the BLM movement does a disservice by ignoring that. The conversation has to be multifaceted in order for any progress to be done.

 

[Commodus]

Police definitely use skin color and it shouldn’t happen. That’s why Ferguson erupted, the heavy handed tactics being used against them came to boil. Michael Brown was a POS and not exactly the kind of person that I’d rally around but so be it, the disparities in policing needs to be addressed. I think that gets lost in the whole police shootings thing which is a small part of a much bigger problem.

The solution is multi fold though. Police departments have to be scrutinized for policing heavier based on racial grounds (not just shootings, if there’s a disparity in traffic stops that’s just as bad). Sentencing by the justice department has to be scrutinized because there absolutely is a racial disparity and there should be no tolerance of it. The drug war has to be scrutinized for the same. The black community has to work with police though because like it or not there is more crime going on within their community vs the rest of the population. There’s more shootings going on etc. I’m afraid the BLM movement does a disservice by ignoring that. The conversation has to be multifaceted in order for any progress to be done.

I just see BLM as one part of the conversation rather than the whole of it... and of course, the important part is that the police have to reciprocate. Some forces do; others take that classic LAPD-style approach where they're more interested in protecting their own than pursuing justice.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

At least these guys didn’t kneel during an anthem. Unlike those unpatriotic sons of bitches protesting... well... god knows what.

 

[interchange]

I think the larger problem in police is unconscious bias and systems that lead to greater punitive intervention and escalation in minority and poor areas. Those are systems issues which should be addressed at the system level and not the individual level. And yet, the fact that such overt racism could exist at all in any department more with more than a handful of officers illustrates how appallingly strong those biases are. Major interventions to change police culture are desperately needed and long overdue.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

And yet police apologists wonder why Black Lives Matter exists. Some cops are purposefully setting out to frame innocent black people, yet the anti-BLM types doubt that police would let skin color dictate their use of force.

Or why football players kneel.

 

[Moonbeam]

I think the larger problem in police is unconscious bias and systems that lead to greater punitive intervention and escalation in minority and poor areas. Those are systems issues which should be addressed at the system level and not the individual level. And yet, the fact that such overt racism could exist at all in any department more with more than a handful of officers illustrates how appallingly strong those biases are. Major interventions to change police culture are desperately needed and long overdue.

I see this as something far worse, in my opinion than racism. It looks a lot more to me like psychopathic predation in the guise of racism, a seeking of economic advantage in the form of job performance with an eye to glory and raises. Racism is just a tool to feeding personal advantage in the form of income and status. I can see the same thing happening in a one race situation. It's basic ethical corruption I think.

 

[UglyCasanova]

I see this as something far worse, in my opinion than racism. It looks a lot more to me like psychopathic predation in the guise of racism, a seeking of economic advantage in the form of job performance with an eye to glory and raises. Racism is just a tool to feeding personal advantage in the form of income and status. I can see the same thing happening in a one race situation. It's basic ethical corruption I think.

Ultimately it seems like he was trying to hit his numbers, and race made its way into it. You’re probably right that in a one race situation this would still occur. Police need funding and they have to hit their numbers to get it. So they do predatory police work to get it which undermines their credibility within the community and society as a whole is the worse for it. Guy needs to be in jail along with any that followed his orders.

 

[Sunburn74]

What a mess. First I hope he goes to prison. Secondly going back and reviewing all the cases of potentially fraudulent plea deals and cases will be incredibly hard. This is just sad.

 

[Viper1j]

One of the reasons I keep my shield on me after all these years..

I've seen attitudes change like flipping a switch when they find out I'm a retired deputy..

Might have been a hoot to travel through his little town and have him pull that shit on me.

 

[UglyCasanova]

What a mess. First I hope he goes to prison. Secondly going back and reviewing all the cases of potentially fraudulent plea deals and cases will be incredibly hard. This is just sad.

Yep, that’s going to be a nightmare because it opens up doubt on a bunch of prior cases.

 

[Viper1j]

He just handed a lot of people a free Get Out Of Jail card.

 

[WHAMPOM]

One of the reasons I keep my shield on me after all these years..

I've seen attitudes change like flipping a switch when they find out I'm a retired deputy..

Might have been a hoot to travel through his little town and have him pull that shit on me.

Reported as resisted arrest and shot four times in the back to subdue more likely. "He was reaching for his waist band!"

 

[Viper1j]

Reported as resisted arrest and shot four times in the back to subdue more likely. "He was reaching for his waist band!"

Not me. I'm not stupid. I keep my hands on the wheel, and say "I'm a cop! My shield is in my right back pocket, my weapon is in the glove compartment. Feel free to remove it." Then I open the door by reaching out the window.

Sad I have to go through that, but I have a grandson to play with.

 

[umbrella39]

Place this next to the racism that has already come out against Gillam, it's gonna get really ugly in Florida.


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...o-raul-fernandez-charlie-dayoub-a8445021.html

I actually fear for him and not just because this is Florida where it doesn’t always seem the safest place to be black... There have always been unhinged people out there. That's nothing new... No, the issue now is that these unhinged have found like-minded morons on the Internet which makes them feel less isolated, less of an outcast, and more mainstream. They have even found the man at the top is sympathetic to their plight... Has emboldened them...

Isolationism probably saved a lot of lives when I was growing up since those people who might snap at any given time were down Mom's basement and not communicating with the outside world. Now these guys are grown, on their own (in some cases) on the Internet 24/7, are armed, and in their mind... they are ready to go do their Savior's bidding...

It’s always been comical when I hear folks spouting off about how Obama was the most racist, most racially divisive POTUS ever simply by being half black and daring to speak about racism that still very much exists in this country…

Obama was clearly just a poser when it comes to the pro we now have…

 

[Darwin333]

Ultimately it seems like he was trying to hit his numbers, and race made its way into it. You’re probably right that in a one race situation this would still occur. Police need funding and they have to hit their numbers to get it. So they do predatory police work to get it which undermines their credibility within the community and society as a whole is the worse for it. Guy needs to be in jail along with any that followed his orders.

Yeah but this guy took it way over the top and had 100 percent clearance rate two years in a row. That is simply unheard of, if the idiot would have settled for a reasonable clearance rate he might not have gotten caught.

 

[Darwin333]

What a mess. First I hope he goes to prison. Secondly going back and reviewing all the cases of potentially fraudulent plea deals and cases will be incredibly hard. This is just sad.

Luckily it's a very small police force with very few crimes so there aren't that many cases. Another thing to consider is the guilty people that are likely to get set free because of this. I honestly don't know how you can trust any police work from the years he was sheriff, you'd almost have to vacate all of the convictions that didn't have overwhelming evidence that couldn't be fabricated.

You are right about the plea deals though, I'd be hard-pressed to believe that any of the cases the prosecutors chose to charge actually went to trial. Especially considering these are non-violent crimes, most innocent people still take the plea deal because if they don't and lose at trial with their shitty public defender they can face 10-20 (or more) times the jail time. Some of them probably got offered probation/time served or the prosecution would go for the max of 10-15 years if they took it to trial. For the life of me I will never understand that. How can think a person deserves zero jail time for their crime if the plead guilty but if they don't and make you do your job you then think that they deserve 10-15 years and even longer in some cases. This is not the fair trial system that our justice system is supposed to be based on.

 

[Darwin333]

Not me. I'm not stupid. I keep my hands on the wheel, and say "I'm a cop! My shield is in my right back pocket, my weapon is in the glove compartment. Feel free to remove it." Then I open the door by reaching out the window.

Sad I have to go through that, but I have a grandson to play with.

If you are white you will get away with that, if you aren't I'd still be really concerned in certain areas.

 

[Viper1j]

If you are white you will get away with that, if you aren't I'd still be really concerned in certain areas.

Living in the age of dash/body cams helps a little. Most cops know what happens to cops on the other side of those bars..

Which reminds me, I was going to send some Preparation H to Michael Slager next week.

 

[Sunburn74]

Luckily it's a very small police force with very few crimes so there aren't that many cases. Another thing to consider is the guilty people that are likely to get set free because of this. I honestly don't know how you can trust any police work from the years he was sheriff, you'd almost have to vacate all of the convictions that didn't have overwhelming evidence that couldn't be fabricated.

You are right about the plea deals though, I'd be hard-pressed to believe that any of the cases the prosecutors chose to charge actually went to trial. Especially considering these are non-violent crimes, most innocent people still take the plea deal because if they don't and lose at trial with their shitty public defender they can face 10-20 (or more) times the jail time. Some of them probably got offered probation/time served or the prosecution would go for the max of 10-15 years if they took it to trial. For the life of me I will never understand that. How can think a person deserves zero jail time for their crime if the plead guilty but if they don't and make you do your job you then think that they deserve 10-15 years and even longer in some cases. This is not the fair trial system that our justice system is supposed to be based on.

The fact that we have a judicial system that if used as designed (ie all cases go to trial) would absolutely collapse within a day or two is mind boggling to me. This is not my sentiment but the sentiment of pretty much every prosecutor and judge out there.
Unfortunately I don't know what the alternative is. I guess we could move away from jury trials but that seems less egalitarian as a society.

 

[Darwin333]

The fact that we have a judicial system that if used as designed (ie all cases go to trial) would absolutely collapse within a day or two is mind boggling to me. This is not my sentiment but the sentiment of pretty much every prosecutor and judge out there.
Unfortunately I don't know what the alternative is. I guess we could move away from jury trials but that seems less egalitarian as a society.

Oh make no mistake, I wasn't arguing the abolishing of plea deals just that the way they are currently used is crazy. There has to be some happy medium that allows innocent people to try and prove their innocence without risking 15 years in jail versus 6 months or 0 months. The only way that people who aren't made of money take that risk is if even with the plea deal you are going away for a very long time like being charged with murder.

"it is better 100 guilty Persons should escape than that one innocent Person should suffer". - Benjamin Franklin

PS The biggest problem is just how big our prison/justice system is. We have more people in jail than any other nation both total and per capita not even counting the people who are on some sort of supervision with parole/probation. Even if you escape jail time after a felony conviction you are severely restricted in your job opportunities going forward so the cost to society is too big to even calculate.

 

[The Merg]

Mr Atesanio had a history of celebrating his own apparent successes, claiming at one commission meeting in 2013, "This year, as we stand, we have a 100 per cent clearance rate on burglary cases in the village of Biscayne Park. This is the first time I’ve ever known that to happen in any department that I’ve ever been in."

Yeah, first clue that something is amiss is that they had a 100% clearance rate. Although the year after he left, they only had 19 crimes occur (and managed to close out none of them).

- Merg

 

[The Merg]

Oh make no mistake, I wasn't arguing the abolishing of plea deals just that the way they are currently used is crazy. There has to be some happy medium that allows innocent people to try and prove their innocence without risking 15 years in jail versus 6 months or 0 months. The only way that people who aren't made of money take that risk is if even with the plea deal you are going away for a very long time like being charged with murder.

"it is better 100 guilty Persons should escape than that one innocent Person should suffer". - Benjamin Franklin

PS The biggest problem is just how big our prison/justice system is. We have more people in jail than any other nation both total and per capita not even counting the people who are on some sort of supervision with parole/probation. Even if you escape jail time after a felony conviction you are severely restricted in your job opportunities going forward so the cost to society is too big to even calculate.

From what I have seen, it is very rare for someone to end up getting a lot of time when they don't have a record or even any kind of significant record.

When it comes to felonies, most of the time I see that the prosecutor and defense will agree to guidelines, which the judges get when someone is convicted. In most cases, when it comes to larceny crimes and credit card crimes, if you don't have a record, your guidelines state that you should get probation. I've even seen where people have prior felony convictions and and the guidelines will still end up being for probation.

My favorite is when the prosecutor will offer a felony with guidelines, which will be probation, or multiple misdemeanors with active jail time (maybe a week or two weeks), and the person will take the felony. SMH...

- Merg