Florida House Speaker speaks out against GOP plans to steal elections

Discussion in 'Politics and News' started by Phokus, Jan 25, 2013.

  1. Ausm

    Ausm Lifer

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    That's like stepping on someone's throat will simultaneously attempting to give them a hand up. :D
     
  2. GarfieldtheCat

    GarfieldtheCat Diamond Member

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    Funny how it's always the same 2 or 3 people always blindly defending anything sleazy that the GOP does.
     
  3. zanejohnson

    zanejohnson Diamond Member

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    jeez folks get with the times... alqueada said fox news will die.. and it is.

    i just turned it on for a second... still obama bashing with no basis.. flipped it back off.
     
  4. hal2kilo

    hal2kilo Diamond Member

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    It's really funny, turning onto the Fox Noise channel never disappoints. I think maybe just maybe they might get a news story in without getting an anti-Obama jab in, or just a libruls suck jab in, but no, it's always the same distorted dribble.
     
  5. Zebo

    Zebo Elite Member

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    they try to disenfranchise young too. Basically any democrat leaning. like that Texas voter ID Law, which accepts hunting licenses but not student IDs even though both are issued by state agencies.
     
  6. Oldgamer

    Oldgamer Diamond Member

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    I personally think we need to just have it decided by National popular vote and be done with the confusing, outdated electoral college vote.
     
  7. shira

    shira Diamond Member

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    Republicans are consistently the party of, "if we can come up with enough anti-democratic schemes to win the election, even though we get a minority of the votes, let's do it." If you want further evidence of GOP sleeze, just consider what happened this past Monday in the Virginia state senate:

    The state senate in Virginia is divided 20-20 between Democrats and Republicans. On Monday, state Senator Henry L. Marsh III (a Democrat) attended Obama's inauguration. On that day . . .

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...16fbd2-65da-11e2-85f5-a8a9228e55e7_story.html

    Without delay, the senate vote was held, and it passed along strict party lines, 20-19.

    The effect of this bill? It will change the outcome of the next Virginia election such that instead of there being a 20-20 tie in the state senate, there will instead be a 27-13 Republican supermajority. That's right, folks. Virginia is an evenly-split state. But the GOP think that if they can get away with a dirty trick like this one, they can create a supermajority that can pass any bill it wants.

    And guess what bill they plan on passing once they have this supermajority? The Virginia GOP wants to change the rules for awarding electoral college votes from "winner take all" to awarding votes based on the outcomes of each of Virginia's Congressional districts. Once the newly-created GOP supermajority gets done with congressional redistricting, the state in which Obama won all 13 electoral votes in 2012 would instead split those votes 9 to the GOP candidate and 4 to the Democratic candidate. Even a Democrat who wins 60% of the popular vote in Virginia is going to win only 4 electoral votes.

    And that, my friends, tells you everything you need to know about the new, improved Republican party. Who fvcking cares about the "will of the people" when the system can be manipulated such that the GOP can win elections regardless of how few votes it attracts?

    But I'm sure our hard-right forum members think this disgusting power grab is just fine.
     
  8. cubby1223

    cubby1223 Lifer

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    Democrats in my state of Illinois have gerry-mandered the districts to where they now control a (likely permanent) super-majority in the state legislature.

    In the most recent redistricting, several pairs of incumbent Republicans saw the redistricting place them in the same district so one of the pair is guaranteed kicked out of office next election cycle.

    It's what politics is and always has been. The only idiots are those who lay the blame on "the other party".
     
    #58 cubby1223, Jan 26, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  9. cubby1223

    cubby1223 Lifer

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    It's called life. If the Republicans don't power grab, the Democrats will continue to power grab. It is the game of politics. It is what politicians and political parties do.

    You are never going to eliminate power grabs. The best you can hope for is that over the long run the power grabs balance out between the two major parties.



    In a two party system, you can win an election one of two ways, either (A) winning over the voting public by doing what's best for the public, or (B) convincing the voting public that "the other side" is too disgusting to vote for.

    History has proven that the latter is far more effective than the former.
     
    #59 cubby1223, Jan 26, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  10. shira

    shira Diamond Member

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    Oh, puleeze. Obama won Illinois 57 to 41 over Romney. Redistricting the state isn't going to change the number of electoral votes a Democratic presidential nominee is going to win in Illinois - it will be 20 electoral votes regardless.

    Compare this with Virginia: Obama won the popular vote in Virginia 51 to 48, and was awarded all 13 electoral votes. If the Republicans get their way, a state that votes majority-Democrat is going to yield 4 votes to the Democrat. That's a tectonic shift. It's disgusting.
     
  11. nehalem256

    nehalem256 Lifer

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    I wonder if Republicans got the idea from when the Democrats in NY used their late night session to rush through their anti-gun bill? :hmm:
     
  12. nehalem256

    nehalem256 Lifer

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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_congressional_delegations_from_Illinois

    Actually it appears there are 6 Republican house seats. So Romney would have picked up 6 seats under the plan Republicans are using. And possibly 4 more would be up for grabs as it appears that in 2010 10 seats were Republican.
     
  13. cubby1223

    cubby1223 Lifer

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    So, you were not disgusted by my example of a blatant Democrat Party power grab? Either you are against all power grabs, or you are not. You don't get to cherry pick which power grabs you support and which power grabs you despise. Republicans in Virginia are gerry-mandering the state to strengthen the Republican Party. Democrats in Illinois gerry-mandered the state to strengthen the Democratic Party.

    It's hypocrisy plain and simple.



    I would be curious to know how many liberals disgusted by this news here, had previously voiced support for similar changes to the electoral college after the Bush victory over Gore...
     
    #63 cubby1223, Jan 26, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2013
  14. cubby1223

    cubby1223 Lifer

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    shira, I guarantee you there are Democrats in states that Romney won, who are looking at these happenings with great interest.
     
  15. cubby1223

    cubby1223 Lifer

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    Just because I can...

    an interesting little news article from a year and a half ago:
    http://content.usatoday.com/communi...electoral-college-gallup-poll-popular-vote-/1

    What Republicans in these swing states are doing, is following the will of the people and transforming their state to a system that more accurately reflects the popular vote of the state instead of the winner-take-all approach. Isn't that what we want? For the popular vote to matter more than the electoral college tally?


    Personally I would like to see the presidential election decided more closely reflective of popular vote than the winner-take-all by state approach, enacted in all 50 states, not just the few that are in the news recently. That's my stance.


    All you hypocrites in this thread, seriously?
     
  16. shira

    shira Diamond Member

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    This is BS. If this is what the Republicans wanted to do, they'd award electoral votes proportionally with the popular vote, with any "breakage" going to the candidate who gets the majority/pluarality of votes.

    Contrast this with what Republicans in Virginia are actually trying to do. They want to take a state where a Democrat won a majority of the votes, and change the rules so that a candidate who receives 48% of the popular vote wins 69% of the electoral votes.

    So, right, Republicans want what's fair. Sure they do That's why 56% of Republicans want to RETAIN the electoral college. Because Republicans are increasingly becoming a minority party, and they know that the electoral college + gerrymandering is their only way to win.
     
  17. fskimospy

    fskimospy Elite Member

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    Lol. You think they are changing it to more accurately reflect the will of the people? Is that why is most (perhaps even all?) of these states Obama would have gotten fewer electoral votes than Romney despite getting more actual votes? The guy with fewer votes getting more representation is a funny way of more accurately representing the people's will.

    It is a naked power grab, period. The only upside is that it is so blatant and so absurd that if they passed it they might prompt enough states to pass the national popular vote compact and abolish the electoral college altogether.
     
  18. Incorruptible

    Incorruptible Diamond Member

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    This, Why did the OP not make a thread pointing BOTH PARTIES ARE CORRUPT?
     
  19. monovillage

    monovillage Diamond Member

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    You mean that because someone was out of town those nasty politicians took action that wasn't fair? Sounds like what Obama did with his recess appointments doesn't it? Except that the Court ruled that what Obama did was unconstitutional! At least what the Republicans did was legal.
     
  20. cubby1223

    cubby1223 Lifer

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    Chances that these reforms actually happen in the states being discussed? 0.0001%.

    Chances that the progressive left will continue to be outraged over this until Maddow presents the new outrage story of the week? 99.9999%
     
  21. Paratus

    Paratus Diamond Member

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    So in PA Republicans tried voter ID for non existent fraud.

    In Ohio they tried limiting voting hours in Democratic leaning precincts.

    In Florida they limited voting days which affected heavily populated democratic precincts.

    In Virginia they want proportional distribution of EC votes where Romney won nothing last time.

    In Nebraska they dropped proportional voting where Obama did win one.

    And we've got folks here who will of course see no evil?

    [​IMG]

    Did I get this right?
     
  22. nehalem256

    nehalem256 Lifer

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    In Florida they allowed 8 early voting days (8 more than blue states such as Minnesota). This still was not enough for Democratic counties that were too stupid to setup enough equipment for their voters that took 40 min to fill out a ballot

    I can find no source for this.

    Nope. At least 2 points appear to be incorrect.
     
  23. GarfieldtheCat

    GarfieldtheCat Diamond Member

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    Quoted for blind partisan ignorance.

    Link

    How can you say that, when according to this proposed VA law, that despite Obama winning 51-47 (4 points ahead), he would only get 4 out of 13 electoral votes?

    Obama would have gotten 51% of popular vote, and only 30.7% of electoral college votes

    Care to explain this as the "will of the people"....perhaps you meant "will of the GOP"?
     
  24. Paratus

    Paratus Diamond Member

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    Is Florida Minnesota? Do they have the same population density? The same number of rural precincts and city precincts? Why should what works for Minnesota work for Florida?

    Why do you intentionally play dumb?


    As for Nebraska I was only paraphrasing what others have posted in this thread. I have not confirmed for myself.
     
  25. nehalem256

    nehalem256 Lifer

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    And currently Romney got 47% of the vote and got zero electoral votes care to explain this as the "will of the people"?

    Romney won a majority of the vote in 9 congressional districts and yet got no electoral votes care to explain this as the "will of the people"... perhaps you meant "will of Democratic voting districts"?

    Perhaps if Democrats stopped chastising people for "clinging to their guns and religion" they would be able to win support outside of a few concentrated urban areas.