First PC build - converting gaming build to photoshop PC

[LightField]

I wanted to try to follow this build but craft it to my own needs -

http://teksyndicate.com/videos/build-amd-fx-6300-budget-gaming-rig

The specs:

CPU: AMD FX-6300 3.5GHz 6-Core Processor $129.99
Motherboard: ASRock 970 EXTREME4 ATX AM3+ Motherboard $106.98
Memory: Mushkin Redline 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1866 Memory $49.98
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive $89.99
Storage: Kingston HyperX 3K 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk $104.99
Video Card: XFX Radeon HD 7870 GHz Edition 2GB Video Card $219.99
Case: NZXT Tempest 410 ATX Mid Tower Case $59.99
Power Supply: XFX 650W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply $79.99
Total: $841.90



PLEASE when you POST threads asking for input on system builds tell us...

1. What YOUR PC will be used for. That means what types of tasks you'll be performing.

Photoshop, Manga studio.. drawing comics in super hi res (1200 DPI on 11x17 pages and larger) with many many layers of lines and color. I am just getting into this but I have heard it is extremely RAM intensive. I will also need to do a lot of multi tasking so I would like to max my RAM as much as possible and possibly use a RAMdisk get more power.

2. What YOUR budget is. A price range is acceptable as long as it's not more than a 20% spread

$800 so the above guide is a little over my price range... I have an old GT430 graphics card I am wondering if it could get me by for a little while until I can get more money. But someone recommended I should at least get this graphics card -

AMD Radeon HD 6670

3. What country YOU will be buying YOUR parts from.

US - I am looking for a good online supplier to order these parts throguh cheap. I am in California.. thought I read we have to pay more taxes on purchases.

6. If YOU intend on using any of YOUR current parts, and if so, what those parts are.

Would like to get by on a Geforce GT430 graphics card but don't know how realistic this is..

7. IF YOU plan on overclocking or run the system at default speeds

Don't know if I can.. reliability is my biggest concern.

8. What resolution, not monitor size, will you be using?

1920x1080

9. WHEN do you plan to build it?
Note that it is usually not cost or time effective to choose your build more than a month before you actually plan to be using it.

In about a week when the tax return gets in.

One big question I have about the board recommended above is how tou configure RAM.

I would like to be set with RAM for the future with upto 24GB and do it in a way where it's configured to max the RAM down the road if possible without having to remove sticks I am buying now.

I know this is excessive RAM but from everything I have heard with what I am doing I don't want to risk being underpowered there now or in the future.

What is a good brand for this? I would prefer reliable RAM rather than super crazy high speed performance if possible.

I hope this makes sense I am trying to learn all this stuff as quickly as possible.

 

[Ken g6]

Wow, that build you linked to is chock full of bad ideas. D: Especially for gaming. Let's start with [thread=2192841]Mfenn's build[/thread], drop the $360 GPU, and we'll work from there.

You missed question X: Do you have an OS? Be aware that Win7 home/OEM can only use 16GB RAM. Win8 home can use more.

For the RAM chips themselves, as long as you're not overclocking, you don't need to worry about the dumb big fins on RAM. So you can get this $80AP 16GB RAM. I wasn't paying attention - do as Mfenn says on his build to get 16GB RAM.

Sticking with your GT430 should be OK for now. Its worst problem is its DDR3 RAM, instead of GDDR5. We can discuss other options if you don't have to pay for an OS.

 

[LightField]

Hi Ken. Thanks for the response. Yes I need to get an OS thanks for reminding me. I didn't know Windows 7 could only use 16 GBs max. Someone recommended Windows 8 Pro OEM for performance.

I will check out the links and then post more.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

Hi Ken. Thanks for the response. Yes I need to get an OS thanks for reminding me. I didn't know Windows 7 could only use 16 GBs max. Someone recommended Windows 8 Pro OEM for performance.

I will check out the links and then post more.

Just to clarify, Windows 7 Home Premium has a limit of 16GB RAM. Professional has a 192GB limit.
Windows 8 Home Premium is "limited" to 128GB, while Professional can support 512GB. I wonder when we'll bump in to that...

As for performance, Win8 is slightly faster then 7. But where Win8 really shines is boot time. Not that you'd notice that on an SSD. I highly recommend you get one.

As Ken pointed out, if you don't game you should be able to get by on a GT430 fine. Especially as it saves you $220, that you can put into other components... :hmm:

 

[Ken g6]

Win7 Home can only use 16GB. Win7 Pro can use more, as can all (64-bit) versions of Win8. It looks like Windows 8 is cheaper than Win7 Pro.

 

[LightField]

Hi Insert_Nickname. Thank you. Yeah, my only concern in the graphics card department is that I heard photoshop uses it when zooming in photoshop and when rotating the canvas.

This sounds like a small issue but with what I am doing you are constantly manipulating the image so if it isn't smooth or slow or lags etc then it could probably get annoying. Also the image sizes are massive because of the detail and many layers etc. So this could cause issues too.

 

[LightField]

Also, I am not going to have many programs so I am wondering if I could get by on a smaller SSD for now and then get a larger one of those later too? Like a 64.. but I heard those might have issues with windows being that small.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

Hi Insert_Nickname. Thank you. Yeah, my only concern in the graphics card department is that I heard photoshop uses it when zooming in photoshop and when rotating the canvas.

This sounds like a small issue but with what I am doing you are constantly manipulating the image so if it isn't smooth or slow or lags etc then it could probably get annoying. Also the image sizes are massive because of the detail and many layers etc. So this could cause issues too.

If you want to be 100% sure, you should look at the GT650(non-TI). It should be enough to use Photoshop to its full potential. But someone who is more knowledgeable about Photoshop will have to clarify that.

Also, I am not going to have many programs so I am wondering if I could get by on a smaller SSD for now and then get a larger one of those later too? Like a 64.. but I heard those might have issues with windows being that small.

I -did- once fit a Win7 Pro + Office 2010 installation on a 40GB HDD (old laptop, don't ask). So its possible, but I would recommend getting a ~128GB or even ~256GB. They have a much better price-to-capacity then the smaller ones. You can just use a cheap 1-2TB HDD (with backup of course) to store your images.

 

[LightField]

I heard the larger SSDs were faster too.. Where can I cut the price? haha

Maybe I should just wait on the SSD altogether?

 

[LightField]

If you had to choose between a more powerful processor OR a SSD which would you pick?

So the i5 without the SSD or the AMD with the SSD?

Mind you this is for a photoshop machine... if that makes a difference.

 

[Ken g6]

If you had to choose between a more powerful processor OR a SSD which would you pick?

So the i5 without the SSD or the AMD with the SSD?

Mind you this is for a photoshop machine... if that makes a difference.

Personally, I'd get a different i5 with the SSD:

Replace this:

CPU: AMD FX-6300 3.5GHz 6-Core Processor $129.99
Motherboard: ASRock 970 EXTREME4 ATX AM3+ Motherboard $106.98

With this:
i5-3470, $184 @Amazon (Or you can get a 3350P for $180@Newegg if you must save those $4.)
MSI B75 mobo, $62 (Edit: Found it at Amazon with free shipping.)

$5-$9 more.

 

[LightField]

ken, do you know the max RAM that motherboard will take?

 

[Sleepingforest]

Looks like it has four slots, so 32GB (standard for consumer ATX motherboards). That's plenty for anyone not running VMs.

 

[LightField]

So if you have 4 slots the max RAM you can install is 32GB?

Does it matter how you install it? So I could put 3 sticks of 8 in and then at a later date put a 4th in?

 

[Sleepingforest]

The mobo will specify in the manual what order you should install in (for example, it may indicated to fill the blue slots first), but other than that, you should be able to stick in any number of sticks. It's just generally most efficent to buy in pairs for an Ivy Bridge mobo.

 

[LightField]

I just figured out the free RAM deal... that might allow me to get the better i5 chip because I do have my mind set on getting lots of RAM right or wrong.

 

[Sleepingforest]

Um... So you're buying RAM just to have a number to smile at? Rather than an actual purpose? Or am I interpreting "lots of RAM right or wrong" incorrectly? I would recommend a build like this:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3470 3.2GHz Quad-Core Processor ($149.99 @ Microcenter)
Motherboard: Biostar H77MU3 Micro ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($59.99 @ Microcenter)
Memory: G.Skill Value 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($29.98 @ Outlet PC)
Memory: G.Skill Value 8GB (1 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($29.98 @ Outlet PC)
Storage: Intel 330 Series 180GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($159.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Toshiba 2TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($89.99 @ Microcenter)
Video Card: Gigabyte GeForce GTX 650 1GB Video Card ($99.99 @ Microcenter)
Case: BitFenix Merc Beta (Black) ATX Mid Tower Case ($39.98 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: Corsair Builder 430W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V Power Supply ($24.99 @ Newegg)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8 Full (64-bit) ($99.99 @ Newegg)
Total: $784.87 after $50 in rebates. If you have no Microcenter nearby, buy the CPU from Amazon; that total cost is $818.67AR.

(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-02-14 19:15 EST-0500)

It's got a nicely sized SSD, a GTX 650 for the CUDA cores, a fairly large HDD, and an i5. Just remember to partition off a small piece of that SSD as a scratch disk.

 

[LightField]

I have just heard that with the kind of work I will be doing it is very RAM intensive.... so that is something I have as my main priority. But I may be over estimating that because I don't know for sure it will be an issue. But to me it is easier to get a better graphics card later or a SSD than it is to mess with the RAM. Maybe that's just me personally I don't know.

Plus I have always had PCs very under powered with RAM.. so that might add to it.

 

[LightField]

Thank you sleepingforest! I like the number I gotta eat then I will check it out in depth.

 

[Sleepingforest]

RAM is much easier to upgrade. Power down, disconnect from the wall, take the side off your computer, lie it sideways, and snap in some extra DIMMs. To upgrade a graphics card, you'd need to follow the first four steps from before, then unplug power connectors, unscrew the card, and remount the new one.

Also, 8GB is the standard right now. I don't use all of that 8GB listening to music, having 50 tabs open, and running some background programs. 16GB will be sufficient.

 

[LightField]

RAM is much easier to upgrade. Power down, disconnect from the wall, take the side off your computer, lie it sideways, and snap in some extra DIMMs. To upgrade a graphics card, you'd need to follow the first four steps from before, then unplug power connectors, unscrew the card, and remount the new one.

Also, 8GB is the standard right now. I don't use all of that 8GB listening to music, having 50 tabs open, and running some background programs. 16GB will be sufficient.

But aren't you supposed to have matching RAM etc? Install it in pairs.. ? It's a mystery to me. That's why I feel like I should take care of it now. Also, if something goes wrong installing the ram and if you zap it with static or bend a wire then you are screwed. I would prefer to just max it out as much as I can now. BUt maybe after I build my own PC I won't be as skittish about it.

Also... the people who work on photoshop and do these kinds of projects always say "you can never have too much RAM. Max it out." The people who aren't familiar with this kind of work always seem to say.. "anymore than 16GBs is overkill.

 

[max347]

I'm not sure if you would be open to the idea, but you may be able to grab a used GTX 285 and save some money there.

Cards that can do Mercury-
http://www.adobe.com/products/premiere/mercury-playback-engine.html

 

[max347]

I really like SleepingForest's build above.

Are you a student by any chance? You may be able to get Windows cheaper if so.


People are recommending 16gb now and then adding 16gb later because it makes sense- ram prices usually only go down (until a new kind comes out), and it is so easy to upgrade.

I agree, many people building systems for this purpose always say max out the ram, but I guess I have never seen anyone back up the logic with a screen shot of them maxing it out either. I can only get to around 7GB editing videos. Also, keep in mind your primary drive will be an SSD , so access times will be fast anyway.

 

[LightField]

Sleepingforest... I think you did it! You are the master.

I am still torn with the graphics card versus more RAM.. since I could use my GT430 but like you say I could get more of that RAM later. Is the brand and type likely to be around later?

 

[Torn Mind]

But aren't you supposed to have matching RAM etc? Install it in pairs.. ? It's a mystery to me. That's why I feel like I should take care of it now. Also, if something goes wrong installing the ram and if you zap it with static or bend a wire then you are screwed. I would prefer to just max it out as much as I can now. BUt maybe after I build my own PC I won't be as skittish about it.

Also... the people who work on photoshop and do these kinds of projects always say "you can never have too much RAM. Max it out." The people who aren't familiar with this kind of work always seem to say.. "anymore than 16GBs is overkill.

A pair of RAM with the same size and other specs can run in dual channel mode, which increases the amount of bandwidth available. While people tend to use sticks of matching brands with identical specs, you should be able to use RAM from different companies and still get it provided the timings are the same.

Removing static is as simple as being in contact with metal, preferably that case chassis. An anti-static wristband works by conducting electricity(slowly since it has a 1 MegaOhm resistor) to whatever it is attached to.