Ferguson Police Chief Lied About Why He Released Alleged Michael Brown Robbery Tape

[xBiffx]

There are these facts:
.
.
So, they (FPD) release 1 piece of evidence that even they (the police department) claim had no impact on the shooting that shows the dead person breaking crimes for "no specific reason" while holding back other evidence just for shits and giggles.

Those aren't facts. That's your opinion.

 

[MixMasterTang]

Those aren't facts. That's your opinion.

The two items you conveniently out of your quote are facts, the 1 item you left in your quote is my opinion and was not presented as fact.

 

[xBiffx]

The two items you conveniently out of your quote are facts, the 1 item you left in your quote is my opinion and was not presented as fact.

Really, you started out with "These are the facts:". You've got three statements there and nothing in between them to indicate where the facts end and your opinion begins. You did present it as fact. That's what I was pointing out.

 

[MixMasterTang]

Really, you started out with "These are the facts:". You've got three statements there and nothing in between them to indicate where the facts end and your opinion begins. You did present it as fact. That's what I was pointing out.

I would assume an educated person such as yourself could differentiate my opinion in which I used the term "for shits and giggles" from the first two facts (which are repeated in my opinion).

 

[xBiffx]

I would assume an educated person such as yourself could differentiate my opinion in which I used the term "for shits and giggles" from the first two facts (which are repeated in my opinion).

I can. Its why I was able to point out just the statement in question and omitted the other two. However, I would think an educated person like yourself would know how to delineate information properly.

Fuck it, its not your fault, you've just been reading too much of what passes as "journalism" these days. Lots of people guilty of doing what you did. Doesn't bother me if you don't care.

 

[jackstar7]

I was overdue to revise my Ignore list.

 

[Attic]

There are these facts:

No evidence has been brought forward that anyone specifically asked for the video's release.

There is evidence that many people have requested for the release of 911 calls and witness statements yet those have not been released.

So, they (FPD) release 1 piece of evidence that even they (the police department) claim had no impact on the shooting that shows the dead person breaking crimes for "no specific reason" while holding back other evidence just for shits and giggles.

The video provides more information, nothing less, nothing more. Brown assaulting a clerk in a strong arm robbery,.. have to be pretty stupid to not see how this is important in what ensued shortly after with Wilson. At the very least from MB's frame of mind. Either MB on very good behavior in caution after this, or something else. Effect of robbery is not "nothing" in the encounter with Wilson.

The police chief claimed the video had no impact from Wilson's perspective on the initial encounter. That is all.

The robbery going out on radio with descriptions of MB and DJ is a possibility for why Officer Wilson returned to confront MB and DJ after initially leaving their location.

There were two confrontations. Initial, and second. Something drove the second one. What are likely drivers of the second encounter given the call about the robbery went out over police radios at some point? The witness account was that Wilson reversed quickly and aggressively to the two young men.

1) Robbery call goes out fitting MB and DJ descriptions
2) MB DJ do something to draw attention and get Wilson to return
3) Wilson looking to start trouble on 2nd but not 1st encounter
4) Wilson mistakes MB or DJ for someone else
5) Other

We can reasonable speculate as to what drove the second encounter.

Beyond that, the robbery clearly was on MB's and DJ's mind during their confrontation with the Officer. I hope that aspect doesn't need to be put to a grindstone to release the inherent truth while expecting everyone to just accept that it's impossible Wilson was aware of the robbery and suspects when he re-approached DJ and MB.

 

[alzan]

That's a lot of dumb to pack into one post.

Thanks for the opinion; it has been duly noted and properly filed.

 

[werepossum]

Are you suggesting that perhaps they called the police to say the MB was behaving himself in the store?

"9-1-1, what is your emergency?"

"No emergency. There's a perfectly polite nice young black man here buying a legal product and I just wanted to share my happiness that we can all get along. Have a nice day."

The video provides more information, nothing less, nothing more. Brown assaulting a clerk in a strong arm robbery,.. have to be pretty stupid to not see how this is important in what ensued shortly after with Wilson. At the very least from MB's frame of mind. Either MB on very good behavior in caution after this, or something else. Effect of robbery is not "nothing" in the encounter with Wilson.

The police chief claimed the video had no impact from Wilson's perspective on the initial encounter. That is all.

The robbery going out on radio with descriptions of MB and DJ is a possibility for why Officer Wilson returned to confront MB and DJ after initially leaving their location.

There were two confrontations. Initial, and second. Something drove the second one. What are likely drivers of the second encounter given the call about the robbery went out over police radios at some point? The witness account was that Wilson reversed quickly and aggressively to the two young men.

1) Robbery call goes out fitting MB and DJ descriptions
2) MB DJ do something to draw attention and get Wilson to return
3) Wilson looking to start trouble on 2nd but not 1st encounter
4) Wilson mistakes MB or DJ for someone else
5) Other

We can reasonable speculate as to what drove the second encounter.

Beyond that, the robbery clearly was on MB's and DJ's mind during their confrontation with the Officer. I hope that aspect doesn't need to be put to a grindstone to release the inherent truth while expecting everyone to just accept that it's impossible Wilson was aware of the robbery and suspects when he re-approached DJ and MB.

That's certainly one possibility. Another is that they flipped him off (guaranteed to get a cop's dander up) or just didn't get out of the road. I'm assuming that the chief would have mentioned it had Wilson become aware of the robbery at any point in the confrontation, since it tends to be exculpatory to Wilson. (To me anyway; others may disagree.) I'm also assuming that this is not such a law abiding town that someone stealing $50 in cigars and pushing a clerk gets an APB, although that's more of a stretch as that might well be the policy.

 

[cubby1223]

It's interesting how much we treat similar scenarios very differently.

A video is released of Michael Brown committing strong-arm robbery, and it is wrong to use that short timeframe to make judgments on the person.

A video is released of Ray Rice committing assault and battery, and it is wrong not to use that short timeframe to make judgments on the person.

Just saying is all.

 

[smackababy]

It's interesting how much we treat similar scenarios very differently.

A video is released of Michael Brown committing strong-arm robbery, and it is wrong to use that short timeframe to make judgments on the person.

A video is released of Ray Rice committing assault and battery, and it is wrong not to use that short timeframe to make judgments on the person.

Just saying is all.

Um, no. People are using the Ray Rice tape to punish him for that act. The MB tape has nothing to do with what people are outraged by: that he was unarmed and shot by a white police officer, without knowing the actual circumstances of what happened.

The Ray Rice tape is the 'smoking gun' in that case, as it shows him committing an act he was punished for (and the punishment was subsequently made more severe, due to publicity). The MB tape is used as additional data to suggest that it is possible MB wasn't just cooperating with officers when he was shot.

 

[jackstar7]

Um, no. People are using the Ray Rice tape to punish him for that act. The MB tape has nothing to do with what people are outraged by: that he was unarmed and shot by a white police officer, without knowing the actual circumstances of what happened.

Yeah, but aren't they both black? I'm sure that's just one similarity...

 

[Attic]

"9-1-1, what is your emergency?"

"No emergency. There's a perfectly polite nice young black man here buying a legal product and I just wanted to share my happiness that we can all get along. Have a nice day."


That's certainly one possibility. Another is that they flipped him off (guaranteed to get a cop's dander up) or just didn't get out of the road. I'm assuming that the chief would have mentioned it had Wilson become aware of the robbery at any point in the confrontation, since it tends to be exculpatory to Wilson. (To me anyway; others may disagree.) I'm also assuming that this is not such a law abiding town that someone stealing $50 in cigars and pushing a clerk gets an APB, although that's more of a stretch as that might well be the policy.

Yep. I think the dollar value of merchandise stolen isn't as important as the assault on the clerk if that's what made it out over radio. Something like, "Possible strong arm robbery, suspects fitting xyz description in vicinity of x and y."

Given position of Wilson's car from photos after the incident (blocking off center of road at a diagonal) it would indicate the two were still possibly/likely walking down center of the road after Wilson left. This could have brought Wilson back. Though imagining this, it would be a rather aggressive possibly dangerous move for jay walkers after he didn't bother to ticket first run through.

I think the chances of MB or DJ heckling or otherwise demanding more attention from Wilson after he left are very unlikely given they are both aware they just robbed a store and are close to home.

Importantly, if we go by DJ's account of early encounter, Wilson came back abruptly absent anything DJ or MB did. Seemed to indicate to me that Wilson came back out of nowhere hearing DJ describe it.

Either way, for me that's a significant piece of the puzzle. The second encounter is what escalated, the nature of what prompted that fills in a pretty big hole in Wilson's early motives and situational awareness.

I hope we get the true story behind store video release.

Tox should be back soon, and iirc the 1st autopsy should be released along with tox. Might get more information then.

Despite the many facets of the encounter and coverage, it still comes down to, IMO, 10-15 seconds. Was brown surrendering or a clearly a non threat or was he a reasonable threat to Wilson when killed?

I have a hard time imagining Wilson killing MB out of pure malice absent any provacation. Doesn't add up. Video shows MB capable of physical aggression beyond what most of us are capable of. The video has to line up with story Wilson gave. And Wilson IMO has to tell the truth, because he's knows any story he gives early will kill him if he's caught in a lie. He saw the investigation being conducted.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

I'm also assuming that this is not such a law abiding town that someone stealing $50 in cigars and pushing a clerk gets an APB, although that's more of a stretch as that might well be the policy.

You should listen to a police scanner when you get the chance. You will hear what the dispatchers transmit over their respective police band, all police radios on that band will hear the dispatcher's request. In many cases the closest available officer with respond by unit name and that they are en route to the location the dispatcher has requested help.

 

[werepossum]

Yep. I think the dollar value of merchandise stolen isn't as important as the assault on the clerk if that's what made it out over radio. Something like, "Possible strong arm robbery, suspects fitting xyz description in vicinity of x and y."

Given position of Wilson's car from photos after the incident (blocking off center of road at a diagonal) it would indicate the two were still possibly/likely walking down center of the road after Wilson left. This could have brought Wilson back. Though imagining this, it would be a rather aggressive possibly dangerous move for jay walkers after he didn't bother to ticket first run through.

I think the chances of MB or DJ heckling or otherwise demanding more attention from Wilson after he left are very unlikely given they are both aware they just robbed a store and are close to home.

Importantly, if we go by DJ's account of early encounter, Wilson came back abruptly absent anything DJ or MB did. Seemed to indicate to me that Wilson came back out of nowhere hearing DJ describe it.

Either way, for me that's a significant piece of the puzzle. The second encounter is what escalated, the nature of what prompted that fills in a pretty big hole in Wilson's early motives and situational awareness.

I hope we get the true story behind store video release.

Tox should be back soon, and iirc the 1st autopsy should be released along with tox. Might get more information then.

Despite the many facets of the encounter and coverage, it still comes down to, IMO, 10-15 seconds. Was brown surrendering or a clearly a non threat or was he a reasonable threat to Wilson when killed?

I have a hard time imagining Wilson killing MB out of pure malice absent any provacation. Doesn't add up. Video shows MB capable of physical aggression beyond what most of us are capable of. The video has to line up with story Wilson gave. And Wilson IMO has to tell the truth, because he's knows any story he gives early will kill him if he's caught in a lie. He saw the investigation being conducted.

I'm not trusting DJ's word on anything given that he blatantly lied about the shooting itself. Only thing he has going for him is putting back those cigars when Brown handed them to him - obviously he had no idea Brown was going to steal them and didn't want to steal them. For that matter, maybe it was a spur of the moment thing for Brown too.

You should listen to a police scanner when you get the chance. You will hear what the dispatchers transmit over their respective police band, all police radios on that band will hear the dispatcher's request. In many cases the closest available officer with respond by unit name and that they are en route to the location the dispatcher has requested help.

My college roommate was surgically joined to his, even slept with it, so I've heard quite a lot. I think the original call would have gone out over the radio, only Wilson was busy with another call and didn't respond. It's possible that Brown's description did go out and that's what caused Wilson to re-engage; that would explain a lot. I'm just guessing that the Chief would have mentioned that.

Quick scanner story - I was up cramming one night when my roommate came out all excited. (He had the ability to sleep through routine stuff but wake up if something exciting happened.) At a really nice apartment building (Mountain Creek Apartments) just past ours (Creek Ghetto Apartments) an undercover cop had four male suspects at gun point over a drug bust and was requesting backup. We listened for about an hour to the back-and-forth as the uniforms went back and forth with the dispatcher. They had rousted the family out of bed, searched their apartment, rousted and searched the two adjacent apartments, searched the 150 apartment in the next two buildings, nothing. After almost an hour the undercover agent called back (this is before cell phones, obviously) with some serious pucker factor wanting to know where his backup was. While we were listening to the search traffic, the cop was actually two doors down from us and had sent them to the wrong apartment complex - one where the rent was about 50% higher than ours.