Federal Judge Rules FDNY Exams Discriminated Against Minorities

[Sacrilege]

A federal judge ruled Wednesday that the New York City Fire Department used recruitment exams that discriminated against African-American and Hispanic applicants.

The ruling came in a lawsuit filed by the U.S. Department of Justice against the city of New York, with the suit challenging whether the city's written fire-department exams from 1999 to 2007 disadvantaged would-be African-American and Hispanic firefighters.

CNN Link

I wonder what was in the exam that led to this ruling. It was so egregious that the US Department of Justice filed the lawsuit. Now that precedent has been set in this case and the Hartford, CT case, can minorities in any line of work sue alleging discriminatory tests?

Perhaps a special separate, yet equal test for Black and other minority candidates is in order. Each test could be specially tailored to suit the needs of a special minority group, such as blind firefighters.

Thread regarding the case of the Hartford, CT firefighters:

Anandtech.com Forum Link

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: Sacrilege

A federal judge ruled Wednesday that the New York City Fire Department used recruitment exams that discriminated against African-American and Hispanic applicants.

The ruling came in a lawsuit filed by the U.S. Department of Justice against the city of New York, with the suit challenging whether the city's written fire-department exams from 1999 to 2007 disadvantaged would-be African-American and Hispanic firefighters.

CNN Link

I wonder what was in the exam that led to this ruling. It was so egregious that the US Department of Justice filed the lawsuit. Now that precedent has been set in this case and the Hartford, CT case, can minorities in any line of work sue alleging discriminatory tests?

Perhaps a special separate, yet equal test for Black and other minority candidates is in order. Each test could be specially tailored to suit the needs of a special minority group, such as blind firefighters.

Thread regarding the case of the Hartford, CT firefighters:

Anandtech.com Forum Link

Yes, because that is exactly what blacks have been fighting for. Separate but equal. :thumbsup: Wait....


Also, anyone can sue for anything. If people are dumb and couldnt pass the first test, a court isnt going to help them in life. They still wont pass subsequent tests.

 

[shiner]

Because fighting fires is totally different if you aren't white.

 

[Jaskalas]

Perhaps a special separate, yet equal test for Black and other minority candidates is in order.

Segregation? Arguments of the past have come back to haunt us.

Let me be clear. NO! You should be whipped for thinking it.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: OCguy

Yes, because that is exactly what blacks have been fighting for. Separate but equal. :thumbsup: Wait....


Also, anyone can sue for anything. If people are dumb and couldnt pass the first test, a court isnt going to help them in life. They still wont pass subsequent tests.

But an objective court ruled that the test was racist. If I remember from the New Haven thread, you oppose racism in all of its forms correct?

 

[lupi]

Originally posted by: shiner
Because fighting fires is totally different if you aren't white.

remember, white reflects and black absorbs.

 

[woodie1]

Originally posted by: lupi

Originally posted by: shiner
Because fighting fires is totally different if you aren't white.

remember, white reflects and black absorbs.

That explains a lot.

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: OCguy

Yes, because that is exactly what blacks have been fighting for. Separate but equal. :thumbsup: Wait....


Also, anyone can sue for anything. If people are dumb and couldnt pass the first test, a court isnt going to help them in life. They still wont pass subsequent tests.

But an objective court ruled that the test was racist. If I remember from the New Haven thread, you oppose racism in all of its forms correct?

Maybe you need a judge to tell you what to think, but until I see otherwise I'm calling bullshit on a racist test.

 

[DaveSimmons]

The test was so racist that the Bush administration DOJ filed suit:

http://ccrjustice.org/newsroom...scriminatory-hiring-pr
"On May 21, 2007, the Department of Justice filed a lawsuit against the City of New York, charging it with discriminatory hiring practices against black and Latino potential firefighters. ..."

 

[spittledip]

I wish we could see a copy of the test... I get tired of just getting little tid bits and having to wonder what is really going on.

 

[MotF Bane]

Originally posted by: spittledip
I wish we could see a copy of the test... I get tired of just getting little tid bits and having to wonder what is really going on.

+1

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: spittledip
I wish we could see a copy of the test... I get tired of just getting little tid bits and having to wonder what is really going on.

yeap.



a seperate but equal test? shit didnt people fight to do away with that?

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: Sacrilege
I wonder what was in the exam that led to this ruling. It was so egregious that the US Department of Justice filed the lawsuit. Now that precedent has been set in this case and the Hartford, CT case, can minorities in any line of work sue alleging discriminatory tests?

Perhaps a special separate, yet equal test for Black and other minority candidates is in order. Each test could be specially tailored to suit the needs of a special minority group, such as blind firefighters.

You apparently don't understand what the CT case was about... the issue wasn't whether the test could be thrown out because it was discriminatory toward minorities. The issue was that they concluded that the test was discriminatory based only on the fact that minorities did poorly on the test.

The questions on a test need to be relevant to the job. If they're relevant to the job, it doesn't matter if minorities do poorly.

 

[Patranus]

Originally posted by: mugs

Originally posted by: Sacrilege
I wonder what was in the exam that led to this ruling. It was so egregious that the US Department of Justice filed the lawsuit. Now that precedent has been set in this case and the Hartford, CT case, can minorities in any line of work sue alleging discriminatory tests?

Perhaps a special separate, yet equal test for Black and other minority candidates is in order. Each test could be specially tailored to suit the needs of a special minority group, such as blind firefighters.

You apparently don't understand what the CT case was about... the issue wasn't whether the test could be thrown out because it was discriminatory toward minorities. The issue was that they concluded that the test was discriminatory based only on the fact that minorities did poorly on the test.

The questions on a test need to be relevant to the job. If they're relevant to the job, it doesn't matter if minorities do poorly.

Incorrect.

The CT case was about the city throwing out the case to mitigate their exposure to a lawsuit. The city did not say that the test was racist but threw out the results because they feared they *might* be sued because of the results.

 

[BarrySotero]

Originally posted by: DaveSimmons
The test was so racist that the Bush administration DOJ filed suit:

http://ccrjustice.org/newsroom...scriminatory-hiring-pr
"On May 21, 2007, the Department of Justice filed a lawsuit against the City of New York, charging it with discriminatory hiring practices against black and Latino potential firefighters. ..."

Not too far from me Alberto Gonzales was also suing a city over elections he said were unfair to Latinos. Alberto had his priorities.

 

[Hacp]

Next, the SAT will be made illegal because Hispanics and African Americans do poorly, even though African immigrants do quite well on the test.

 

[Mursilis]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
But an objective court ruled that the test was racist.

What makes you think the court was "objective"? The article itself lacks a detailed explanation either of the test itself, or the basis of the ruling.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

Originally posted by: spittledip
I wish we could see a copy of the test... I get tired of just getting little tid bits and having to wonder what is really going on.

+1

+1

Without seeing the test, none of us really have a clue if it was fair.

 

[brandonb]

I'm sure all of us can find racism in everything, provided we look hard enough.

"Mary the pilgrim came to America in 1675, we declared independence from English in 1776, how many years was it between Mary and independence?"

"Huh? That question is culturally biased!"

"It's a math question"

"You racist!"

 

[DrPizza]

Originally posted by: brandonb
I'm sure all of us can find racism in everything, provided we look hard enough.

"Mary the pilgrim came to America in 1675, we declared independence from English in 1776, how many years was it between Mary and independence?"

"Huh? That question is culturally biased!"

"It's a math question"

"You racist!"

quoted for almost truth. However, I proctor a lot of NY state exams. I teach in an almost all white school district. (98%?) On a test a couple years ago, there was a word problem, and the name of a person mentioned in the word problem was "Laquisha." (or something like that) Several of my students raised their hands because when they were going through the word problem, they got stuck on the pronunciation of that name. "It doesn't matter." As I thought about it, I realized the test makers were making efforts to make the math test as multicultural as possible with crap like that. I laughed when I realized that the inner NY city kids probably couldn't pronounce it either.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

Originally posted by: spittledip
I wish we could see a copy of the test... I get tired of just getting little tid bits and having to wonder what is really going on.

Precisely.
I mean did the test say " Tyrone (a "racial slur") stole 3 cars last week. He set fire to 2 of them this week. What is the percentage of cars Tyrone has set on fire?"

Or is it because like usual, the test was to hard and the "minorities" were incapable of understanding the questions because they don't want to take the time to learn the academics?

 

[ayabe]

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski

Originally posted by: spittledip
I wish we could see a copy of the test... I get tired of just getting little tid bits and having to wonder what is really going on.

Precisely.
I mean did the test say " Tyrone (a "racial slur") stole 3 cars last week. He set fire to 2 of them this week. What is the percentage of cars Tyrone has set on fire?"

Or is it because like usual, the test was to hard and the "minorities" were incapable of understanding the questions because they don't want to take the time to learn the academics?

This.

How can a test meant to asses job knowledge or potential be racist?

White FF's and black FF's perform the same duties, don't they?

 

[MovingTarget]

IIRC, in order for a test to be considered racist you have to be able to point to a specific question or circumstance that gives an unfair advantage based on race. (i.e. giving white firefighters more advance notice and better access to test study materials would be considered racist) Just because blacks/hispanics do worse on average does not mean that the test is racially biased. The recent SCOTUS ruling now says that a test cannot be thrown out and/or results discarded to avoid potential lawsuits based on the appearance of bias in the results.

So, what about this test is considered racist? The article doesn't say.

 

[brandonbull]

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski

Originally posted by: spittledip
I wish we could see a copy of the test... I get tired of just getting little tid bits and having to wonder what is really going on.

Precisely.
I mean did the test say " Tyrone (a "racial slur") stole 3 cars last week. He set fire to 2 of them this week. What is the percentage of cars Tyrone has set on fire?"

Or is it because like usual, the test was to hard and the "minorities" were incapable of understanding the questions because they don't want to take the time to learn the academics?

Aw shits. Can't be given out no racist maths test.

 

[CitizenKain]

Republicans defending racism? Who would have thought.

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Precisely.
I mean did the test say " Tyrone (a "racial slur") stole 3 cars last week. He set fire to 2 of them this week. What is the percentage of cars Tyrone has set on fire?"

Or is it because like usual, the test was to hard and the "minorities" were incapable of understanding the questions because they don't want to take the time to learn the academics?

Amazing. Remember, all brown people are stupid and should be put to death according to JeffreyLebowski, the forums premier KKK member.