FBI- No terror intent in men who had 1000 cellphones.

[techs]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060814/ap_on_re_us/phones_terror_charges

FBI: No terror groups in cell phone case
CARO, Mich. - TheFBI said Monday it had no information to indicate that the three Texas men arrested with about 1,000 cell phones in their van had any direct connection to known terrorist groups.

The release also said the FBI had no information indicating that the men, Palestinian-Americans living in Texas, had any direct links to any known terrorist groups or to the alleged plot to bomb trans-Atlantic jetliners that was announced in London last week.

Kowalski said there was nothing illegal about buying cell phones in bulk, but that profits from that kind of activity can be suspicious.

Adham Abdelhamid Othman, 21, of Dallas, and Maruan Awad Muhareb, 18, and Louai Abdelhamied Othman, 23, both of Mesquite, Texas, were stopped by police Friday outside a Wal-Mart store in Caro, about 80 miles north of Detroit after employees became suspicious when they purchased about 80 cell phones.

Local prosecutors charged them with collecting or providing materials for terrorist acts and surveillance of a vulnerable target for terrorist purposes.

The men told a magistrate Saturday that they were buying the phones for resale.

Louai Othman's wife, Lina Odeh, told The Associated Press on Saturday that she thought her husband and relatives were targeted because of their Arab descent. She said the men's families come from Jerusalem.




Looks like a case of panic and fear. Score one for the real terrorists.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Are you saying we shouldn't have looked into this?

Regardless of how it eventually panned out I would think that law enforcement would be completely derelict in their duties not to check out why three arab men were in posession of 1000 cell phones.

 

[Ronstang]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
Are you saying we shouldn't have looked into this?

Liberals want the big explosion first before they do anything. They are going to blame Republicans and Bush either way. No win situation with them. If the guys are innocent then let them go but it would be a travesty to ignore suspicious behavior to make the liberals feel good and then have a big attack.

 

[Gaard]

Is it possible to look into it without arresting and charging these men?

 

[Ronstang]

Originally posted by: Gaard
Is it possible to look into it without arresting and charging these men?

Nope....if they are guilty they would simply disappear. There is no margin for error in this kind of situation. If they are innocent then they have nothing to fear.

 

[jpeyton]

There is nothing illegal about buying cell phones in bulk.

And there are hundreds of millions of cell phones in the world. It takes two phones (not 1000 phones) to detonate a bomb. If you guys are stupid enough to believe we'll foil a terrorist plot by catching them at the point of sale for cell phones, our law enforcement officials will be running down dead-end leads for the next millenium.

Law enforcement will learn their lesson after they catch and release a few of these cases.

FYI, terrorists can also read. With highly publicized cases like these, I doubt they'll purchase more phones than they need. Besides, with a WalMart around every corner, there's no need to purchase an alarming number at any one store.

Remember guys, our job is to "out think" the terrorists.

 

[Ronstang]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
Law enforcement will learn their lesson after they catch and release a few of these cases.

Exactly, but they are going to have to learn by doing. Nothing is going to happen to these guys. I agree that it is silly to think the terrorists would need 1000 phones to blow something up. I never thought there was anything nefarious going on here but you have to be precausious and you have to learn in these days and ages. There is no room for error. It will not be suspicious behavior once the smoke clears....but it was yesterday.

 

[Pens1566]

Any "terrists" that get caught while buying hundreds of phones at walmart in one shot aren't really "terrist" masterminds in my book. We should all run to walmart for more duct tape and plastic though.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

There isn't any way to win in this situation...

1. We detain them till we find out what they are up to - they aren't up to anything illegal so we let them go. People cry "Racial Profiling" "Fascist State" blah blah blah...

2. We don't do anything because buying phones in bulk isn't illegal - then something happens and the cries of "We knew about these activities yet we did NOTHING" come out.

We've already seen what happens when you use option #2. Why do we have to wait until after the tragedy to employ our 20/20 hindsight? It is not against the law to be detained by the police for a brief period of time and held without charges. In this case the situation was suspicious enough to warrant detention until it could be determined what was going on.

Seriously, if you saw a van load of arab men with 1000 cell phones you wouldn't report that? If you saw a group of people buying up pre-paid cell phones in bulk you wouldn't report that either?

If I saw a guy buying 4-5 phones... ok, maybe he's outfitting his family. But when he buys 80 phones, with cash and in such a way that it won't trigger the authorities... COME ON!

 

[tommywishbone]

Comedy Central couldn't write this story. Pitiful.

 

[f95toli]

Can someone please explain exactly HOW you would use 1000 cell phones in a terrorist attack?
Is 1000 cell phones more efficient/dangerous than 1000 cameras? Or 1000 cuckoo clocks?

What did they think they where planning to do? Annoy people to death with bad ringtones?

 

[Pens1566]

What about 1000 timers for electrical appliances????

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: f95toli
Can someone please explain exactly HOW you would use 1000 cell phones in a terrorist attack?
Is 1000 cell phones more efficient/dangerous than 1000 cameras? Or 1000 cuckoo clocks?

What did they think they where planning to do? Annoy people to death with bad ringtones?

I don't think anyone thinks they are going to be used in a terrorist attack. (I can't find the link) I read that they bought the phones from Wal-Mart for $20 and sold them for $38. So the obvious questions are:

1. Who are they selling these phones to? Why would anyone pay $38 for a $20 phone? Why buy it off the street or off E-Bay when they could just as easily and annonymously buy them for cash at Wal-Mart?

2. Where is the money going? That is the question I want to know. Is this just a clever for-profit scheme these guys came up with for their own material benefit or are they forwarding the proceeds on to someone else? And if so, who and why?

 

[MIDIman]

It takes two phones (not 1000 phones) to detonate a bomb.
...
Can someone please explain exactly HOW you would use 1000 cell phones in a terrorist attack?

I believe another thought behind the original arrest was something about how these phones could be used to contact people within groups like Al Qaeda anonymously?

I don't understand why people are so angry with these arrests. The activity was suspicious, and suspicious activity needs to be reported. And while race adds to that, its also irrelevant - i.e. an 80-year old white American lady doing the same thing would be just as strange. Law enforcement can't be everywhere at once, and IMHO, its our duty as citizens of any country to at least report things that look out of place. Where's the harm in at least checking it out?

But, I suppose no one can really believe that until it personally happens to themselves...

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
If I saw a guy buying 4-5 phones... ok, maybe he's outfitting his family. But when he buys 80 phones, with cash and in such a way that it won't trigger the authorities... COME ON!

Because we all know it's the number one goal of a mastermind terrorist to trigger the authorities. It's not like people who can turn a profit reselling these phones would want them in bulk :roll:

There is no law in the books that makes it illegal to purchase cell phones in bulk.

 

[MIDIman]

Because we all know it's the number one goal of a mastermind terrorist to trigger the authorities. It's not like people who can turn a profit reselling these phones would want them in bulk :roll:

There is no law in the books that makes it illegal to purchase cell phones in bulk.

Agreed, there's no law against that, but they are not being charged for buying phones in bulk.

RE: the "suspicious activity" - a few clips from the story here:

Stevenson said the men went to the 24-hour Wal-Mart store early Friday and bought the cellphones despite a store policy limiting customers to three phones per purchase.

A Wal-Mart clerk who thought the purchases were suspicious alerted police.

"They target these stores late, in the morning, hoping to get an inexperienced clerk," he said.

Ohio investigators said they found information about airline flights and airports in the car of the suspects arrested in Marietta.

Prosecutors in Ohio have said the prepaid phones can be used to make hard-to-track international calls and have been linked to use by terrorists.

Wal-Mart has an agreement with cellphone manufacturers to enforce a limit of three cellphones per purchase, said John Simley, a spokesman for Wal-Mart Stores Inc., based in Bentonville, Ark.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
If I saw a guy buying 4-5 phones... ok, maybe he's outfitting his family. But when he buys 80 phones, with cash and in such a way that it won't trigger the authorities... COME ON!

Because we all know it's the number one goal of a mastermind terrorist to trigger the authorities. It's not like people who can turn a profit reselling these phones would want them in bulk :roll:

There is no law in the books that makes it illegal to purchase cell phones in bulk.

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

1. Who are they selling these phones to? Why would anyone pay $38 for a $20 phone? Why buy it off the street or off E-Bay when they could just as easily and annonymously buy them for cash at Wal-Mart?

2. Where is the money going? That is the question I want to know. Is this just a clever for-profit scheme these guys came up with for their own material benefit or are they forwarding the proceeds on to someone else? And if so, who and why?

Those are my questions...

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: Ronstang
Liberals want the big explosion first before they do anything. They are going to blame Republicans and Bush either way.

You wouldn't happen to understand that Bush is responsible for the mess we're in, would you? Did any other President start a war based entirely on lies that has cost the lives over 2600 American and tens of thousands of other lives with tens of thousands more wounded and tens of thousands more other dead and wounded?

No win situation with them. If the guys are innocent then let them go but it would be a travesty to ignore suspicious behavior to make the liberals feel good and then have a big attack.

That's total bullsh8! It was right to look into the cell phone purchase, but all the stink in the press is just the sound of one dog being wagged yet again to raise the public paranoia level.

 

[ECUHITMAN]

Originally posted by: Ronstang

Originally posted by: Gaard
Is it possible to look into it without arresting and charging these men?

Nope....if they are guilty they would simply disappear. There is no margin for error in this kind of situation. If they are innocent then they have nothing to fear.

So doing anything that would fall under the vague and undefined category of suspicious gives the authorities to arrest?

I think I have read something about this before..
Here

 

[ECUHITMAN]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

1. Who are they selling these phones to? Why would anyone pay $38 for a $20 phone? Why buy it off the street or off E-Bay when they could just as easily and annonymously buy them for cash at Wal-Mart?

2. Where is the money going? That is the question I want to know. Is this just a clever for-profit scheme these guys came up with for their own material benefit or are they forwarding the proceeds on to someone else? And if so, who and why?

Those are my questions...

1) Why would anyone buy anything from an infomercial? Why would anyone buy anything from a gift shop? BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE DUMB.. It is how business makes money, if dumb people were not around to spend more money on junk the US economy would not be as it is today.

2) I have no idea where the money is going. And I am not sure the authorities have any better idea of what is going on now than they did before. It is really not that hard to lie to police, and if these guys were trained terrorists I am 100 POSITIVE they would not just simply roll over and spill their guts about how they were going to use the phones to buy whatever.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
There isn't any way to win in this situation...

1. We detain them till we find out what they are up to - they aren't up to anything illegal so we let them go. People cry "Racial Profiling" "Fascist State" blah blah blah...

2. We don't do anything because buying phones in bulk isn't illegal - then something happens and the cries of "We knew about these activities yet we did NOTHING" come out.

We've already seen what happens when you use option #2. Why do we have to wait until after the tragedy to employ our 20/20 hindsight? It is not against the law to be detained by the police for a brief period of time and held without charges. In this case the situation was suspicious enough to warrant detention until it could be determined what was going on.

Seriously, if you saw a van load of arab men with 1000 cell phones you wouldn't report that? If you saw a group of people buying up pre-paid cell phones in bulk you wouldn't report that either?

If I saw a guy buying 4-5 phones... ok, maybe he's outfitting his family. But when he buys 80 phones, with cash and in such a way that it won't trigger the authorities... COME ON!

DonVito asked this before...but why in the hell is buying a lot of phones "suspicious"? While I don't agree with the idea that we're better off rounding up every Muslim who looks at us cross eyed, even if that WAS the way to go, I'm not really sure this qualifies as suspicious behavior. Relatively unusual perhaps, but it's not like they were at Home Depot buying 2 tons of fertilizer.

This is EXACTLY what people like me are worried about. Everyone becoming such cowards that they're jumping at shadows, arresting and detaining people for the smallest reason, or no reason at all, just because it makes them feel safer. Nobody looks at the situation rationally, nobody takes the time to think through whether or not it's a good idea and nobody seems to care what kind of impact this will have on Muslim-Americans and Arab-Americans who are just as American as the rest of us and just minding their own business. And I know, I know, "racial profiling" is all the rage, but I wish people would stop thinking about themselves for one freaking second and think about the millions of innocent Muslim-Americans who didn't do anything wrong. Are they simply a casualty of the war on terror? Or do you even thinking about it...?

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

I am amazed that I seem to be the only one here who is curious as to WHY these guys had 1000 phones that they bought three at a time and paid cash for. (I know they only bought 80 at the Wal-Mart but I'm assuming they bought the other phones the same way)

That doesn't raise a red flag for anyone here?

They are operating a cash only business. Why?

What are they doing with the money? Is this a clever profit scheme or are they forwarding cash to mosques and "relief"organizations that serve as fronts for terrorist funding?

Are they filing tax returns on this money?

Where are they getting the money to buy the phones?

Am I the only one here who has these questions bouncing around in my head?

Normal, everyday people don't behave this way. They don't have hundreds of cell phones parted out in the back of a van. Why did these guys?


I can't believe these questions aren't popping up in your heads.

 

[Aimster]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
Are you saying we shouldn't have looked into this?

Regardless of how it eventually panned out I would think that law enforcement would be completely derelict in their duties not to check out why three arab men were in posession of 1000 cell phones.

check it out

dont arrest them. thats wrong.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy
I am amazed that I seem to be the only one here who is curious as to WHY these guys had 1000 phones that they bought three at a time and paid cash for. (I know they only bought 80 at the Wal-Mart but I'm assuming they bought the other phones the same way)

That doesn't raise a red flag for anyone here?

They are operating a cash only business. Why?

What are they doing with the money? Is this a clever profit scheme or are they forwarding cash to mosques and "relief"organizations that serve as fronts for terrorist funding?

Are they filing tax returns on this money?

Where are they getting the money to buy the phones?

Am I the only one here who has these questions bouncing around in my head?

Normal, everyday people don't behave this way. They don't have hundreds of cell phones parted out in the back of a van. Why did these guys?


I can't believe these questions aren't popping up in your heads.

Why is it your business? Unless you can demonstrate that they were doing something wrong, they are free to do whatever the hell they want...that's what it means to live in a free society. I don't have to go around explaining my every action to "concerned citizens" and overenthusiastic cops, and neither do you.

 

[conehead433]

Supposedly they were making a profit of $4 per phone. So I say arrest them and their customers for all being idiots even if they aren't involved in some larger conspiracy.