FBI apologizes for using chainsaw to go through the door of an innocent woman's apt

[SpatiallyAware]

I have never actually heard of this happening, though I am sure very likely...any proof/articles that this has ever happened though?

I grew up in the absolute ghetto of atlanta. I saw firsthand this happening at least 3 times in my younger life, although the way it happened was never reported in the media. I suspect it's not something "they" want talked about, or we would end up with people fighting back with swat teams.

When you read about home invasions, these people are not picking your lock and silently entering your home and politely asking your wife and kids to sit still while they take your $200 tv and $500 worth of jewelry. These crews are terrible people, doing it for other reasons.

 

[sourceninja]

The problem with putting bullets through the door, as appropriate as it may be, is that you will be charged with murdering a law enforcement officer.

Unfortunately, in my state that is true. It didn't used to be true, but the Indiana Supreme court recently ruled you do not have the right to resist police illegally entering your home:

"We believe ... a right to resist an unlawful police entry into a home is against public policy and is incompatible with modern Fourth Amendment jurisprudence. We also find that allowing resistance unnecessarily escalates the level of violence and therefore the risk of injuries to all parties involved without preventing the arrest."

The key here is you would need to know they are police because indiana has very strong castle and stand your ground law. A no-knock warrant would make it hard to know it was police you are shooting at. Luckily law makers in my state realized this and the senate has been hard at work with a bill to allow you to defend yourself against illegal entry by police in many cases.

"The bill would allow residents to resist if the police officer wasn't identified or on official duty." The bill passed the senate and now moves to the house.

There have also been a few older cases where police were shot and the man was found not guilty. However, there are many more cases where shooting at the police trying to enter illegally results in the home owner being shot to death by the police.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

I don't care what any bill or law says. If someone comes through my door, I am protecting my life and the life of my family. Period. I don't break laws, I don't give police any reason to come in my home, end of story.


:thumbsdown: to the people that think you should wait for even a moment if someone is cutting your door down with a CHAINSAW.

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

Thought this was a joke

 

[lxskllr]

Thought this was a joke

It is a joke, just not the Ha Ha kind...

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

It is a joke, just not the Ha Ha kind...

Unless your jerking off and you hear heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee sound of a chain saw

 

[Anonemous]

Professional home invaders are known to do their invasions swat-style. This is why you often hear about how they have 'swat vests' and 'swat helmets'.. They kick your door down and scream FBI GET ON THE GROUND right before they tie you up and rape your wife and daughter in front of you, if not worse.





I live a legal, law abiding life. If someone kicks my door down for ANY reason I assume they are there to take my life or worse, and will react accordingly. I honestly don't care what they say or claim or anything else other than obvious police cars outside my home.

/this

Don't want to end up like that Conn. doctor's family who was the victim of a home invasion.

http://articles.cnn.com/2010-09-14/...-hawke-petit-joshua-komisarjevsky?_s=PM:CRIME

 

[reallyscrued]

I don't care what any bill or law says. If someone comes through my door, I am protecting my life and the life of my family. Period. I don't break laws, I don't give police any reason to come in my home, end of story.


:thumbsdown: to the people that think you should wait for even a moment if someone is cutting your door down with a CHAINSAW.

 

[PokerGuy]

No knock warrants are a travesty. I know why they want to have no-knock and all that, but the potential to harm or injure innocent people is simply to great. The potential for innocent people unknowingly injuring or killing officers in the process of defending themselves from unknown assailants is too great. It's a terrible concept.

 

[waggy]

No knock warrants are a travesty. I know why they want to have no-knock and all that, but the potential to harm or injure innocent people is simply to great. The potential for innocent people unknowingly injuring or killing officers in the process of defending themselves from unknown assailants is too great. It's a terrible concept.

the idea of them is great. Trouble i see is they are useing them FAR to often for bullshit reasons.

i agree with no-knock warrants. but they should be rare.

 

[Jeff7]

Forget about being a drug dealer, think a normal, law abiding citizen getting woke up in the middle of the night with a chainsaw cutting through your door. I'm not going to wait for them to finish up, ask to see their ID and offer them milk and cookies. It's the middle of the night with a fucking chain saw ripping through my house. I don't think they are are here to give me one of those big publisher's clearing house checks. I'm putting a couple bullets through the door.

Girl Scouts can get pretty goddamn nasty about fundraising if you don't buy their cookies the first time they go through the neighborhood.

 

[Howard]

the idea of them is great.

Nope.

 

[Rifter]

If this happened at my home they would get one warning shot, the as soon as i could pump another round into the chamber the rest would be going through that door if the chainsaw was still sticking through it.

This is of course assuming they were not identifying themselves as police officers.

Also since when does the FBI use chainsaws?

 

[janas19]

If this happened at my home they would get one warning shot, the as soon as i could pump another round into the chamber the rest would be going through that door if the chainsaw was still sticking through it.

This is of course assuming they were not identifying themselves as police officers.

Also since when does the FBI use chainsaws?

What the fudge? You must be talking about a shotgun/bolt-action. If you had a semi-automatic that basically means you'd fire one round and then a second later shoot through the door?

Haha

 

[Rifter]

Im talking shotgun. Im in canada, getting your hands on a full auto weapon is almost impossible, as is getting your hands on a pistol. Getting shotguns and bolt action rifles is easy. Getting semi auto almost isnt worth it as there is a small magazine size limit for semi auto's.

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

No knock warrants are a travesty. I know why they want to have no-knock and all that, but the potential to harm or injure innocent people is simply to great. The potential for innocent people unknowingly injuring or killing officers in the process of defending themselves from unknown assailants is too great. It's a terrible concept.

Um. First of all doef doef your in under 3 seconds. Then they are tactically trained to do house penetration. There's no such thing as killing a cop like that. I don't think a innocent person will grab his gun and fire like hell cause 9.9/10 times you will see the government vehicles standing outside when you peak out the windows. Yes a person runs to the windows first when they hear something like that.

But why did they use a chain saw? We used a ram or they use a hammer and knocked a hole through the wall

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

Im talking shotgun. Im in canada, getting your hands on a full auto weapon is almost impossible, as is getting your hands on a pistol. Getting shotguns and bolt action rifles is easy. Getting semi auto almost isnt worth it as there is a small magazine size limit for semi auto's.

Shotgun or not you will die.

 

[janas19]

Im talking shotgun. Im in canada, getting your hands on a full auto weapon is almost impossible, as is getting your hands on a pistol. Getting shotguns and bolt action rifles is easy. Getting semi auto almost isnt worth it as there is a small magazine size limit for semi auto's.

Yeah. I just reread your post and realized you said "pump" the round DERP.

 

[Rifter]

Shotgun or not you will die.

Doubtful, i would fire from behind hard cover, obviously.

Besides doesnt the US have castle laws(i think thats what they are called) that allow you to defend your home with force? So they cant really come in guns blazing if you are following the law. Not to mention if they dont identify themselves after the warning shot im pretty sure you would be within your rights to kill them if they tried to enter your home(this is what castle laws are for in my limited understanding of them).

 

[janas19]

You can legally shoot someone for entering your home unlawfully, but it's also dependent on the state as well.

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

Doubtful, i would fire from behind hard cover, obviously.

Besides doesnt the US have castle laws(i think thats what they are called) that allow you to defend your home with force? So they cant really come in guns blazing if you are following the law. Not to mention if they dont identify themselves after the warning shot im pretty sure you would be within your rights to kill them if they tried to enter your home(this is what castle laws are for in my limited understanding of them).

Lay off the crack and Steven Seagull movies man. You think cops storm in blindly you got no clue. You will be dead before lifting the shotgun

 

[Rifter]

Lay off the crack and Steven Seagull movies man. You think cops storm in blindly you got no clue. You will be dead before lifting the shotgun

If they have yet to breach the door(note that chainsaws are not fast, not nearly as fast as a ram) how will they shoot me if they are not inside my home? Do they have heatseaking bullets that go through walls? I gurantee you i will be up and in possesion of my shotgun long before they breech my front door(i live in a apartment with concrete walls and metal doors, good luck breeching a metal door quickly with a chainsaw), so they will be unable to see me lift the gun. Not to mention if i can see them and they can see me i would identify them as police and not fire upon them.

Also i said i would fire a WARNING shot, which if they are police would be followed by them identifying themselves and then i would ask to see identification and a warrent and it would all work out fine. If they did not identify themselves it would then proceed to get ugly.

 

[paperfist]

Why would they use a chainsaw on the door? Those huge door knockers the have would be more efficient I would think and leaves them ready to enter the second the door is down. You take a chainsaw to the door and you'll have these crazy atot's shooting at you through it.

 

[WelshBloke]

I hate people like you. I hope to hell your response was fashioned to get a rise out of people because you are exactly the reason why people want to ban guns.

Considering the outcome of this scenario (no deaths, but a few nightmares) and putting that into perspective, what would shooting at the door had solved? You don't know why someone has a chainsaw and is coming through your door, you are as idiotic as the police in blindly barging into the wrong apartment.

Unless you meant 'if you were a drug dealer with everything to lose and someone came through with a chainsaw' you would shoot at the door. In which case I misread what you wrote.

What?

I'm a lefty, UK living, no gun owning liberal and even I think that would be the time to start throwing lead very quickly towards the door.

People chainsawing down your door in the dead of night, as a rule, aren't going to be friendly.

 

[Rifter]

What?

I'm a lefty, UK living, no gun owning liberal and even I think that would be the time to start throwing lead very quickly towards the door.

People chainsawing down your door in the dead of night, as a rule, aren't going to be friendly.

100% this.

Anyone saying you would be out of line shooting a warning shot and then defending with force if needed in this situation is insane.

Police use battering rams not chansaws, there is ZERO reason to assume this would be a police entry, especially since they WERE NOT identifying themselves as police.