Father badly beaten after trying to protect his 12 year old daughter at Valleyfair

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jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: QED
We're kinda getting off-topic here, but the funny part of what you are saying is that typically, inner-city school districts spend as much, if not more, per-pupil than their suburban counterparts. Yet we know those same suburban schools typically outperform the inner-city ones which outspend them. Hence, it appears the problem is not one of funding... but of how resources are managed-- which is all done at the local level.

We can't get off topic since the topic became "I knew they were black."

As to your post something doesn't pass the smell test. You say that inner city schools outspend suburban schools on a per pupil basis? I don't know what they are factoring in, but mismanagement alone cannot explain why classes of students are using books a decade out of date while suburban kids get new books every few years. Teacher salaries are lower in inner city schools. So where's the money going?
 

Pocatello

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 1999
9,754
2
76
If it was a bunch of white thugs who were beating down a black person, this would had been big news across the world. Many "Civil Right Leaders" would be on CNN right now.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: Pocatello
If it was a bunch of white thugs who were beating down a black person, this would had been big news across the world. Many "Civil Right Leaders" would be on CNN right now.

Maybe because there was period of a few hundred years where that wasn't called a hate crime. It was called Wednesday.
 

KK

Lifer
Jan 2, 2001
15,903
4
81
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: Pocatello
If it was a bunch of white thugs who were beating down a black person, this would had been big news across the world. Many "Civil Right Leaders" would be on CNN right now.

Maybe because there was period of a few hundred years where that wasn't called a hate crime. It was called Wednesday.

Who let this tard out of P&N?
 

ric1287

Diamond Member
Nov 29, 2005
4,845
0
0
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: QED
We're kinda getting off-topic here, but the funny part of what you are saying is that typically, inner-city school districts spend as much, if not more, per-pupil than their suburban counterparts. Yet we know those same suburban schools typically outperform the inner-city ones which outspend them. Hence, it appears the problem is not one of funding... but of how resources are managed-- which is all done at the local level.

We can't get off topic since the topic became "I knew they were black."

As to your post something doesn't pass the smell test. You say that inner city schools outspend suburban schools on a per pupil basis? I don't know what they are factoring in, but mismanagement alone cannot explain why classes of students are using books a decade out of date while suburban kids get new books every few years. Teacher salaries are lower in inner city schools. So where's the money going?

metal detectors?

 

hanoverphist

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2006
9,867
23
76
Originally posted by: thepd7
Originally posted by: mattocs
This is why I carry a gun. As soon as I was hit, i'd kill them.

7 on 1? You don't have to be hit first, you just have to have a reasonable fear for your life (in TX at least). Not saying I would start shooting but as soon as yelling started and 7 guys are coming at me I am drawing.

same here, once they got within arms reach of you youre pretty much not gonna last very long. if you wait until you get hit, youll be hit by 7 fists and not be able to pull anyway. those guys need a bit of "training" tho, that was just wrong.
 

QED

Diamond Member
Dec 16, 2005
3,428
3
0
Originally posted by: jonks
Originally posted by: QED
We're kinda getting off-topic here, but the funny part of what you are saying is that typically, inner-city school districts spend as much, if not more, per-pupil than their suburban counterparts. Yet we know those same suburban schools typically outperform the inner-city ones which outspend them. Hence, it appears the problem is not one of funding... but of how resources are managed-- which is all done at the local level.

We can't get off topic since the topic became "I knew they were black."

As to your post something doesn't pass the smell test. You say that inner city schools outspend suburban schools on a per pupil basis?


Yep, typically. Take the Cleveland area for an example. The Cleveland school district is notoriously awful, consistently performing near the bottom in the entire nation in a range a metrics-- from graduation rates to SAT scores.

For the 2005-2006 school year, the Cleveland City School district spent $11,073 per pupil-- more than any of its suburban neighbors, all of whom outpeformed it. Solon, a nearby suburb, spend nearly $1,000 less per-pupil and yet was ranked as one of the top school districts in the nation. Avon, another nearby suburb, spent just $7,104 per student (a nearly $4,000 per student difference), yet outperformed Cleveland.


I don't know what they are factoring in, but mismanagement alone cannot explain why classes of students are using books a decade out of date while suburban kids get new books every few years. Teacher salaries are lower in inner city schools. So where's the money going?

That is a very good question-- because something obviously is not adding up. The teachers make less, they use older books, and yet they spend more. I have heard some urban school districts make the claim that their overhead costs are higher since their school buildings tend to be older and require more maintenance, their student's require more busing than other school districts, etc.

 

Zenmervolt

Elite member
Oct 22, 2000
24,512
21
81
Originally posted by: mattocs
This is why I carry a gun. As soon as I was hit, i'd kill them.

Let's see...

7 assailants. My carry weapon's capacity is 7 rounds in the magazine plus one in the chamber. Even though I carry "hot", I do not like those odds.

That's not to say I wouldn't draw, but I'd definitely recognise it as a somewhat less-than-ideal defensive situation.

ZV
 

ric1287

Diamond Member
Nov 29, 2005
4,845
0
0
Originally posted by: QueBert
Originally posted by: ric1287
Originally posted by: Pabster
Originally posted by: Svnla
"Today, more African-American men are in jail than in college. In 2000 there were 791,600 black men in prison and 603,032 enrolled in college. In 1980, there were 143,000 black men in prison and 463,700 enrolled in college"

Bolded for reflection. That's disturbing and yet so very, very sad. Bill Cosby is right.

and unfortunately that is somehow the "white man's" fault. Nobody else.

while not 100% it's definitely a big factor. Have you ever been to the inner city? My high school didn't have enough books for everyone, and the ones we had were outdated as hell. There were no books for anyone to take home, we didn't even have a library. The school had no money for any after school programs, it was the only HS I've ever seen where BOXING was taught in PE, we had a ring and everything. A lot blacks don't try hard enough, but it's hard to try at all when the schools in the inner cities are so bad they make the bad white schools look like nice private schools. I can safely say no matter how hard I wanted to learn I couldn't have at my HS. I ended up dropping out because it was pointless. And this coming from a white person, I can only imagine how the non whites at the school felt.

But that's still not an excuse to become a criminal. My (white) dad dropped out of high school and worked his ass off for the pass 40 years to support us. He didn't have to rob, kill or steal anything or anyone.

People use lack of education as a scapegoat for why they act like idiots. Quit blaming others for your communities shitty behavior and living conditions, change things yourselves.
 

hanoverphist

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2006
9,867
23
76
Originally posted by: rivan
Originally posted by: Arkitech
Originally posted by: Vonkhan
Originally posted by: Arkitech
Originally posted by: isekii
Yep all black

yep, that's right. because we all know only black people commit crime in this world

Here's a question for you: Were you surprised by the race of the accused offenders?

To be honest, I would'nt have been suprised no matter what group was involved. I was more outraged by the fact a dad was hurt trying to defend his daughter.

I'd have been surprised if it were 6 Indian guys... or 6 Canadians, though I'll agree with you that who committed the crime is really secondary to the tragedy of the crime itself.

obviously you havent ever been to a concert out at old compton terrace on the gila river reservation here in arizona. ive been cornered while taking drinks/ snacks back to tghe group i was with many times there by very large, drunk indians that dont want to pay for sodas and hot dogs. usually ive gotten out of it with help from friends that worked there (i worked there too, so did my dad. we had many friends in security and stagehands, and you really dont want to fuck with those guys).
 

rivan

Diamond Member
Jul 8, 2003
9,677
3
81
Originally posted by: hanoverphist
Originally posted by: rivan

I'd have been surprised if it were 6 Indian guys... or 6 Canadians, though I'll agree with you that who committed the crime is really secondary to the tragedy of the crime itself.

obviously you havent ever been to a concert out at old compton terrace on the gila river reservation here in arizona. ive been cornered while taking drinks/ snacks back to tghe group i was with many times there by very large, drunk indians that dont want to pay for sodas and hot dogs. usually ive gotten out of it with help from friends that worked there (i worked there too, so did my dad. we had many friends in security and stagehands, and you really dont want to fuck with those guys).

I mean Indians from India, not native Americans - or is that what you mean?
 

rivan

Diamond Member
Jul 8, 2003
9,677
3
81
Originally posted by: ric1287
Originally posted by: QueBert

while not 100% it's definitely a big factor. Have you ever been to the inner city? My high school didn't have enough books for everyone, and the ones we had were outdated as hell. There were no books for anyone to take home, we didn't even have a library. The school had no money for any after school programs, it was the only HS I've ever seen where BOXING was taught in PE, we had a ring and everything. A lot blacks don't try hard enough, but it's hard to try at all when the schools in the inner cities are so bad they make the bad white schools look like nice private schools. I can safely say no matter how hard I wanted to learn I couldn't have at my HS. I ended up dropping out because it was pointless. And this coming from a white person, I can only imagine how the non whites at the school felt.

But that's still not an excuse to become a criminal.
My (white) dad dropped out of high school and worked his ass off for the pass 40 years to support us. He didn't have to rob, kill or steal anything or anyone.

People use lack of education as a scapegoat for why they act like idiots. Quit blaming others for your communities shitty behavior and living conditions, change things yourselves.

:thumbsup:
 

Pocatello

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 1999
9,754
2
76
Originally posted by: hanoverphist
Originally posted by: rivan
Originally posted by: Arkitech
Originally posted by: Vonkhan
Originally posted by: Arkitech
Originally posted by: isekii
Yep all black

yep, that's right. because we all know only black people commit crime in this world

Here's a question for you: Were you surprised by the race of the accused offenders?

To be honest, I would'nt have been suprised no matter what group was involved. I was more outraged by the fact a dad was hurt trying to defend his daughter.

I'd have been surprised if it were 6 Indian guys... or 6 Canadians, though I'll agree with you that who committed the crime is really secondary to the tragedy of the crime itself.

obviously you havent ever been to a concert out at old compton terrace on the gila river reservation here in arizona. ive been cornered while taking drinks/ snacks back to tghe group i was with many times there by very large, drunk indians that dont want to pay for sodas and hot dogs. usually ive gotten out of it with help from friends that worked there (i worked there too, so did my dad. we had many friends in security and stagehands, and you really dont want to fuck with those guys).

But I think the poster meant Indian guys from India. Drunken American Indians, they can be dangerous, just like any other group of drunks, it's best just to avoid them.
 

hanoverphist

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2006
9,867
23
76
Originally posted by: Mwilding
Originally posted by: mattocs
And I don't know if it makes me a bad person, but I would have zero remorse killing someone who threatened my life or the life of a loved one.
That's big talk. The vision of someone's eyes going lifeless as they bleed out in front of you would probably wake you up at night for years despite your bravado.

depends on the person. ive seen a few people die in my days, it doesnt last very long at all. when its someone you dont even know, it lasts even shorter. maybe im just a heartless asshole tho.
 

hanoverphist

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2006
9,867
23
76
Originally posted by: Deeko
Originally posted by: dainthomas
Originally posted by: thepd7
Originally posted by: mattocs
This is why I carry a gun. As soon as I was hit, i'd kill them.

7 on 1? You don't have to be hit first, you just have to have a reasonable fear for your life (in TX at least). Not saying I would start shooting but as soon as yelling started and 7 guys are coming at me I am drawing.

Haha, those punks would scatter like roaches.

You make the assumption that all 7 of them weren't packing themselves, and that you simply drawing your gun causes them to all open fire on you. Now you are not just beaten, you're dead, and possibly your daughter gets hit in the crossfire, too. Maybe you get one of them, maybe not....

I'm just saying. A gun does not automatically make you a god. 7 on 1 is still 7 on 1.

i can almost guarantee there were at least 2 not packing. the cowards that went for their friends. if they had been packing they had put them in the dads face as soon as he confronted them. if any one of the others had been carrying a gun, they likely would have pulled it for the scare factor before they attacked him.
 

JS80

Lifer
Oct 24, 2005
26,271
7
81
Originally posted by: QED
Originally posted by: QueBert

while not 100% it's definitely a big factor. Have you ever been to the inner city? My high school didn't have enough books for everyone, and the ones we had were outdated as hell. There were no books for anyone to take home, we didn't even have a library. The school had no money for any after school programs, it was the only HS I've ever seen where BOXING was taught in PE, we had a ring and everything. A lot blacks don't try hard enough, but it's hard to try at all when the schools in the inner cities are so bad they make the bad white schools look like nice private schools. I can safely say no matter how hard I wanted to learn I couldn't have at my HS. I ended up dropping out because it was pointless. And this coming from a white person, I can only imagine how the non whites at the school felt.

We're kinda getting off-topic here, but the funny part of what you are saying is that typically, inner-city school districts spend as much, if not more, per-pupil than their suburban counterparts. Yet we know those same suburban schools typically outperform the inner-city ones which outspend them. Hence, it appears the problem is not one of funding... but of how resources are managed-- which is all done at the local level.

It's not how resources are managed, it's how the parents give a shit about their students. My guess is the higher spending in inner-city schools is to pay for higher security and more administrators to try to figure out how to "reach these keeeeeds."
 

Howard

Lifer
Oct 14, 1999
47,982
10
81
Originally posted by: Arkitech
Originally posted by: scott916


I fear for the direction of the black community as a whole when these kids (at least where I live) are far more prevalent than those with self-respect and dignity.

The argument could be made that they're merely more vocal and thus stand out more, and I would love to believe it, but casual observation shows it to be simply not the case.

I have to vehemently dispute this, it's just not the case. I've lived in a black community for the first 25 years of my life (currently live in a mixed community now) and I've had plenty of experience and first hand observations of what exists there. It is a myth that most young black men are thugs and prone to violence, while it is true that there are some who do choose that way of life but it's inaccurate to state that the majority of black youth are criminals.
need stats immediately
 

hanoverphist

Diamond Member
Dec 7, 2006
9,867
23
76
Originally posted by: rivan
Originally posted by: hanoverphist
Originally posted by: rivan

I'd have been surprised if it were 6 Indian guys... or 6 Canadians, though I'll agree with you that who committed the crime is really secondary to the tragedy of the crime itself.

obviously you havent ever been to a concert out at old compton terrace on the gila river reservation here in arizona. ive been cornered while taking drinks/ snacks back to tghe group i was with many times there by very large, drunk indians that dont want to pay for sodas and hot dogs. usually ive gotten out of it with help from friends that worked there (i worked there too, so did my dad. we had many friends in security and stagehands, and you really dont want to fuck with those guys).

I mean Indians from India, not native Americans - or is that what you mean?

no, i was talking feather indians, not red dot. (slurs free of charge, to fit in with this thread better :p)
 

Linux23

Lifer
Apr 9, 2000
11,333
705
126
I guess that's stereotypical black behavior?:roll:

What's stereotypical white behavior? Going postal? Bringing guns to school and having shootouts, ala Matrix style?
 

GoingUp

Lifer
Jul 31, 2002
16,720
1
71
Originally posted by: hanoverphist
Originally posted by: Gobadgrs
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: Anubis
Originally posted by: KK
Originally posted by: isekii
Yep all black

surprised?

not at all

Is Michigan a concealed carry state?

you have to be registered owner in michigan, but they acknowledge arizonas CCW as registration there.

I mistyped. Michigan does have CCWs, but you have to get registered for one.