Faster proc with 8GB Ram OR Slower proc with 4GB ram and SSD cache

[alphazed1]

Hii,
my 1st post here but i have been a silent spectator for some time trying to take in all the information. Awesome forum you folks have here.

I work with computers but have never thought of the performance aspect in detail combined with better CPU's, RAM's, SSD's and better spinning HDD..

I am faced with the dilemma of choosing a couple of things for a new laptop that i am planning to buy. Posting some information below:

Purpose:-
1. running .net 4.5 on MS Visual Studio coupled with DB (MS Sql studio or Oracle sql developer) + HP's Load Runner VUgen software run (would use fiddler etc) -- these softwares would be a little heavy on the CPU and hence listed.
2. The usual stuff of listening to music, surfing net and watching movies (i do open multiple windows of the web browser).
3. Hosting a VM (if i can do so in my budget, very imp).

Budget -- 700 canadian dollars (based in canada for now).

Appropriate:- been looking around and reading a bit and i am thinking of going for a 3rd gen i5 proc + 8 GB Ram + 24GB SSD and a HDD (7200 rpm). (of course, am not hell bent on the processor being a 3rd i5 but what i meant was a decent proc). NO AMD processor from what i understand.

Confusion:
1. Went ahead and bought a Core i5-3337U + 8 Gb Ram (1600Mhz DDR3) + 750GB HDD (5400 rpm) + Win 8 + (no graphics card, Intel graphics basically) + NO SSD -- just did some net surfing etc but not very happy with the performance (its fast but not that snappy i am guessing), Also i didnt like Win8 much-- Asus R505C laptop (580 cad price).

2. Identified another laptop (Asus Elite S56CA-XX056H) with i5-3317U + 4GB Ram (DDR3 1600Mhz) + 24 GB SSD + 750 GB GHDD (5400 rpm) for a about 70 dollars more. (1 slot for RAM is free)

Question -- would the 24GB SSD laptop (used as cache) perform better then the no SSD laptop.
1. I know the boot times will go down with SSD and once it starts filling up then the same data retrieval for an application would be faster but will this mean the overall performance gets faster (snappier feel). I can always push in anothe 8GB Ram in the SSD laptop later (not sure if the Motherboard will support it though).
2. i do not have any specs on the SSD on the other laptop (Asus stock laptop). Can this be a deal breaker?

Kindly let me know of your thoughts please since i am quite confused and am jumping from one thought to the other.

 

[richaron]

I recently helped a family member buy one of those Asus laptops with a 24gb ssd, & for the price I would recommend it again. Add more ram as needed & it should be a decent system.
1. It acts like a software controlled cache for the hdd & is invisible to the user. Not sure exactly how the software is set up, but yes it seems it would optimise for most used programs & get snappier with use (up to a point).
2. Nope. Probly not as fast as a proper ssd, but still fast enough to make a huge difference.

Note:-The xxxxU cpus are low power & will never be top performers, I put them in the "good enough" category.
-After setting up a few new laptops recently, I have re-noticed how freaking long they take to do all their background updates slowing down the computer. In the future I'm counting on 6hrs of installs/restarts before I'll bother using the system.

 

[beginner99]

Note:-The xxxxU cpus are low power & will never be top performers, I put them in the "good enough" category.
-After setting up a few new laptops recently, I have re-noticed how freaking long they take to do all their background updates slowing down the computer. In the future I'm counting on 6hrs of installs/restarts before I'll bother using the system.

I bet the reason for that were the crappy 5400rpm hdds and not the CPU.

@OP

Get a real SSD. I know it's expensive but still. Worth it any day especially in a laptop because laptop HDDs are even slower than desktop ones and 5400rpm laptop hdds are just so slow the laptop will always feel sluggish.

 

[QuietDad]

Visual Studio and SQL wants RAM and processor. The bigger the CPU cache, The more RAM you have takes the disk drives more and more out of the equation. Research the CPU's in the laptops and buy one that allows the most physical RAM possible and fill it.

 

[alphazed1]

Thank you for the replies.
@richaron -- am guessing will go with the SSD nonetheless in that case..

@beginner99 -- getting a real SSD might be difficult since the budget will shoot by a lot then.. hybrid at its best is what i guessing..

@Quietdad-- i did see another laptop having i7-3630QM proc (6MB L3 cache) and a 8 GB ram under 700 cad.. but no SSD.. maybe i can consider that as well i am guessing..

 

[alphazed1]

not finding anything with more then 3MB L3 cache and 8 Gig ram for under 700 dollars.. (max was 4MB L3 with 6 GB Ram).. this gets more and more confusing now..

also, most of the manufacturers tend to occupy both the RAM SLots (2*4 GB ram etc).
ain't it cheaper to just push in one 8 gig ram and leave the other slot for the user?

 

[alphazed1]

how does this sound?..
i5-3230M.. B75 express chipset.. 4GB DDR3 ram (1600 MHZ).. 500 gig HDD (5400 rpm).. almost the same price as:

i5-3337U.. 8 GB DDR3.. 1600 MHZ ... 750 GB HDD.. 5400 rpm.. (have bought this already but can return it)..

I get a better processor (CPU boss recommends the 3230M over the 3337U).. will push in another 8GB Ram later an go for a complete 240 gig SSD (instead of the smaller 24gig SSD caching plan)..

Makes more sense?
do let me know of your thoughts please folks..

 

[Enigmoid]

You can almost always add ram or an SSD to a notebook. Changing the CPU is almost impossible.

Strongly recommend springing for an i7 quad if you are doing a lot of work. More than twice as fast and very useful, especially if running heavy programs. Two hyperthreaded cores may not cut it, especially at low clock speeds.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834215664

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834312833

Spend $50 on 8 GB ram and you are good. When you need to you can always upgrade to a SSD.

 

[alphazed1]

Thanks Enigmoid for that reply..
I would love to get the i7-3632QM.. a quad core would be definitely better in performance but then again it overshoots my budget out here in canda..

Will try to see if i can get some deal on a i5 quad core maybe or something..
so right now my priority is a better proc.. ram and ssd upgrades come later (maybe a yr later since warranty goes for a toss else)..

 

[Sunburn74]

You can almost always add ram or an SSD to a notebook. Changing the CPU is almost impossible.

Strongly recommend springing for an i7 quad if you are doing a lot of work. More than twice as fast and very useful, especially if running heavy programs. Two hyperthreaded cores may not cut it, especially at low clock speeds.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834215664

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834312833

Spend $50 on 8 GB ram and you are good. When you need to you can always upgrade to a SSD.

I agree. Once you buy the laptop you are locked into the CPU. I would get the better CPU and maybe switch out the drive later when you have more time and money

 

[sm625]

You arent going to notice 100MHz. Windows 8 is horrid with the seek times of a notebook HDD. It should be top priority to get a real true SSD if you dont plan on consuming more than 120GB. Unfortunately Windows is also rather cruel to these ULV processors. With all the bloat you are always going to have more than one core active so you arent going to see 2.5+GHz very often. I would seriously recommend a non-U processor, like a i5-3340M or a i5-3360M unless you absolutely need the extra couple hours of battery life. The i5-3360M will run at 3.2GHz under most typical usage scenarios. That is more than a 50% speed boost vs an i5-3317U. I'm not as concerned about the RAM because you can easily close programs and apps if it starts to complain.

 

[Enigmoid]

You arent going to notice 100MHz. Windows 8 is horrid with the seek times of a notebook HDD. It should be top priority to get a real true SSD if you dont plan on consuming more than 120GB. Unfortunately Windows is also rather cruel to these ULV processors. With all the bloat you are always going to have more than one core active so you arent going to see 2.5+GHz very often. I would seriously recommend a non-U processor, like a i5-3340M or a i5-3360M unless you absolutely need the extra couple hours of battery life. The i5-3360M will run at 3.2GHz under most typical usage scenarios. That is more than a 50% speed boost vs an i5-3317U. I'm not as concerned about the RAM because you can easily close programs and apps if it starts to complain.

There is at most a 30% cpu boost. The 3317U can run at its boost clocks (2.5 ghz) most of the time unless stress is put on the GPU as well.

Agree that SV is better than ULV but for heavy vm work a quad is the way to go.

But a ssd can always be added as can ram, the cpu you can't touch.

 

[alphazed1]

Hmmm..
Battery life is not a big problem for me here..
now the i5-3340M and the i5-3337U (one on my just bought laptop) are almost similar except for the clock speed.. (same processor architecture, L2 and L3 cache, same bus architecture and transfer rate etc etc).. clock speeds differ from 2.7 Ghz as against 1.8Ghz and turbo clock speed (3.4Ghz v/s 2.7Ghz).. another difference is the GPU Clock speed is 650 Mhz v/s 350 GHz..
i know I3340M would be faster but it adds about 200$ to my cost nonetheless.. Makes sense? ..

or how about i stick with the i5-3337U.. upgrade to 16GB Ram later (Windows 8 (64bit) supports and so does the processor.. though i am not sure my chipset does (is it really important?)).. and go for a total 240GB SSD down the line?

Question -- The Asus Technical support folks have no clue about the chipset on the R505CA laptop.. damn surprising and pathetic at the same time.. should i really figure out the chipset or assume that it ll support the 16GB ram and all will be well?..

 

[Compman55]

8GB today if you plan to run multiple applications. 2009/2010 4GB was passable.

 

[StinkyPinky]

I do notice some laptops come with 7200rpm drives. Would these make a significant difference?

 

[Enigmoid]

I do notice some laptops come with 7200rpm drives. Would these make a significant difference?

Maybe. Speed is also about platter density. But generally a 7200 rmp drive will be faster though much slower than a SSD and faster than a 5400 rmp drive.

But a good 5400rpm drive can be better than a poor 7200rpm drive though it is uncommon.