Eye strain from gaming - need help, will buy stuff :)

[briskdrop]

Hi anandtechers,

My monitor:
Dell 3007WFP-HC

I just started to play old multiplayer games again after 10 years gone -- Descent 1, and Descent 3. I also have played Dragon's Age Inquisition and some of other new games but they didn't give me eye strain like Descent 1-3 do right now. I am highly competitive in Descent games even though there are only a handful of old veterans around. Overload, a new 6dof game, will come out next year and I want to be ready for all of them. Price is not much of a concern.

I used to play on an old CRT Sony trinitron which I think had at least an 85Hz refresh rate. I always had my framerate capped at 60-65 frames because the mouse control on these games changes based on framerate. I never got eye strain problems on a CRT.

I'm wondering, how can I solve this (besides buying an old CRT)? I get noticeable eye strain after an hour. I've now spent like 3+ hours learning about Gsync, Freesync, input lag, etc

1. Are there some settings to try that can help with eye strain? Vsync is not an option as it increases input lag

2. I read that the Freesync/Gsync should help with eye strain, but they don't have anywhere near the low input lag of something like the BenQ XL2720Z -- are there any freesync or gsync monitors with low input lag/response time?

3. Does resolution affect input lag? I like a big monitor, but it seems all the best gaming monitors are 24 or 27 inch. Is there no way to get a 30+ inch screen with low input lag/response time? I noticed a lot of the bigger montitors like 29 inch 21:9 or 34 inch wide are high res but have more input lag and response time. If I load my games at a lower resolution than the big ones they do at max, will it reduce my input lag to an acceptable level? Descent 1 for example plays at 640x480. I can play descent 3 at any resolution but it has been nice at 1920x1200.

In an ideal world, I'd be able to buy a large screened monitor and have low input lag/response time. Is that even possible, or do I have to buy a 27inch?

I read articles with tech chart comparisons, and the 27 inches could get down to 1ms response time and like 3-4ms input lag, but something like a 29-34 inch 21:9 seemed to have 2-4ms response time and as low as 11ms input lag. That may not seem like a big difference to most, but I have played a ton of LAN and have noticed when LAN got a bit laggy, e.g. when a ping went from like 8ms to 25 or so.


Thank you for your time

 

[hawtdawg]

what do you have your brightness set at? I've found that i get eyestrain unless i have mine turned down significantly. Lower refresh caused eyestrain on CRT's, but LCD's are persistent, so the refresh rate isn't generally going to matter in terms of eyestrain.

 

[briskdrop]

I have it at the lowest the monitor will go, which isn't that dark actually. Any chance I'm causing a problem going too dark?

 

[bononos]

I have it at the lowest the monitor will go, which isn't that dark actually. Any chance I'm causing a problem going too dark?

You might want to turn up the brightness not down. Current flat screen led monitors often use PWM for modulating their brightness which might cause eye strain from the flickering backlight.
I found that turning up the brightness to 100% does cause less blur/flicker in the tests on this website:
http://www.testufo.com#test=blurtrail

You could check the flicker free monitor list to find a monitor which doesn't use pwm or has pwm but high enough refresh rate.
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/flicker_free_database.htm

 

[realibrad]

There are a lot of factors that go into eye strain.

Are you using fluorescent lights?
Fluorescent lights work by flickering on and off. Many monitors use this type of back lighting. When you have multiple sources of light all flickering your eye can pick that up and you will feel some strain.

Do you play in the dark?
Having ambient light will help reduce eye strain. As younger people, we have all likely played in a dark room. Its horrible for your eyes as they get older.

How close do you keep your monitors?
Having them too close can cause eye strain just as having them too far away.

Do you sit in a cube at work?
Not giving your eyes things to adjust focus on will allow the eyes to weaken.

Do you use corrective lenses?
This was the biggest thing for me. I wear contacts because I am near sighted. My contacts went from -3s to now -7s over a few years. I had gotten so used to eye strain that I did not realize how bad it was. On one of my visits he said that my eyes should not be getting as bad as they had been. He asked about my habits and then suggested I do a quick test. He held up a lens in front of my eye and had me focus on some letters. After about 30 seconds, he quickly removed the lens and asked me what I saw. I told him that the letters got super small and it took a second for my eyes to focus in. He said that I was likely giving myself huge amounts of eye strain and that I should try reading glasses.

So here I am about 3 months into using reading glasses at work at the age of 29 and its a huge difference. I had peaked at -8 and have gone down to -7 in that time. I actually feel like I might be down to a 6.5 now.

I dont know if you use corrective lenses but you should try reading glasses to see if you feel anything. It wont take months either, a few min and you would likely feel the difference.

 

[briskdrop]

You might want to turn up the brightness not down. Current flat screen led monitors often use PWM for modulating their brightness which might cause eye strain from the flickering backlight.
I found that turning up the brightness to 100% does cause less blur/flicker in the tests on this website:
http://www.testufo.com#test=blurtrail

Wow, I tried that test, with brightness down it looks like 5-6 lines that are "excited" or fuzzy and alternate in dark light. When I switch the monitor to full brightness, as I do so I notice the 5-6 distinct alternating color lines begin to fuse until at full brightness it represents more like a grey band (much wider than 1pixel). It has some fuzziness or excitedness but is not in as distinct way. It looks more like a solid grey band with fuzziness. There is also some 'stuttering'

You could check the flicker free monitor list to find a monitor which doesn't use pwm or has pwm but high enough refresh rate.
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/flicker_free_database.htm

Both BenQ's, XL2720Z and XL2730Z are on that flicker free list. Makes me want to try one even more!

Thoughts on the above 2 options? If I get the 2730Z I'll have to upgrade video card also to take advantage of Freesync. Also, I would probably need to play games at a higher resolution since native resolutions always seem to work best.


Realibrad:

I got laser eye surgery a long time ago (after playing all the games) so I don't think there are lens options for me? I don't get the reading glasses thing as I can see just fine at any distance, short, medium, whatever.

Viewing distance is about 22 inches. No fluorescent lighting.


Edit: Video card can't be the culprit as I get eyestrain on 2 different machines with different video cards but the same monitor, all using the DVI connection.

 

[bononos]

Wow, I tried that test, with brightness down it looks like 5-6 lines that are "excited" or fuzzy and alternate in dark light. When I switch the monitor to full brightness, as I do so I notice the 5-6 distinct alternating color lines begin to fuse until at full brightness it represents more like a grey band (much wider than 1pixel). It has some fuzziness or excitedness but is not in as distinct way. It looks more like a solid grey band with fuzziness. There is also some 'stuttering'

Both BenQ's, XL2720Z and XL2730Z are on that flicker free list. Makes me want to try one even more!
.........

The monitor isn't going to be used with the brightness setting way down, its just to quickly find out if the monitor uses pwm. PWM with a high enough frequency could still work for flicker sensitive people.

The XL2720Z is a 1080 monitor so the pixel pitch is around 0.311 which is a larger than what is usually recommended to reduce eye strain, depending on how far away the monitor is from your face. 0.28mm max used to be what was recommended.

Changing the color temperature to a warmer setting (reduce blue light) might help reduce eye strain as well.

Modern fluorescent lighting which uses electronic ballasts should be running at very high frequency so flickering and eye strain should not be an issue.

 

[realibrad]

Realibrad:

I got laser eye surgery a long time ago (after playing all the games) so I don't think there are lens options for me? I don't get the reading glasses thing as I can see just fine at any distance, short, medium, whatever.

Viewing distance is about 22 inches. No fluorescent lighting.


Edit: Video card can't be the culprit as I get eyestrain on 2 different machines with different video cards but the same monitor, all using the DVI connection.

All Lasik surgery does is reshape the lens of your eye. As your eyes get older, they lose elasticity and you get a condition known as Presbyopia. Everyone's eyes age differently and other conditions can effect this. In fact, if you look around, you will find that many people say they got Presbyopia sooner after getting Lasik. Newer methods of Lasik is supposed to be better, but if you got it a while ago, you may be developing this condition.

If I were you, I would try some weak reader glasses and see if that helps. Readers are cheap and you can get them everywhere. Try them for a little bit, and if they dont work, return them. I bet that if you really are sitting only 22 inches away, you are getting eye strain from your vision.

 

[bystander36]

One other possible cause of your eye strain is latency. You mentioned needing low latency for competitive gaming, but for myself, this also causes me to get motion sickness, but pretty much only in 1st person games. Descent is 1st person, DA:I is not. If it was the monitor's lighting, flickering or any other visual characteristic, you'd expect it to always happen, but since it is only in some games, it could be motion sickness.

Find a monitor with ultra low input lag/latency, keep your FPS high and don't use v-sync. If it is due to latency induced motion sickness, that should help.

 

[briskdrop]

Hey guys - thanks for your time on making comments for my problem, I appreciate it!

Bystander36: I doubt I have motion sickness because I've basically never gotten that in my life with any game or anything. I can read in the car, whatever. I'm now noticing some eye strain just using this monitor. I'm also noticing some burn-in and occasional "green snow" -- so I think it's time to move on.

I bought the BenQ XL2730Z which should come in about a week. I'll pair it with a freesync card soon but start out without it. It's flicker free, ultra low absolute input latency, should be great!


Realilbrad -- I guess I'm confused about the reading glases thing as I don't have trouble with focusing on anything. I see just fine. Is eye fatigue a symptom? I would have thought things would be hard to see with that condition, but they are not.

 

[realibrad]

It's a common misconception. I can focus on things easily up close. The fatigue is because as your eyes get older they lose elasticity so your eye muscles have to flex even harder to get the eye to change its shape. Eventually your eyes get so stiff that your muscles won't be able to flex enough and then you get the situation where you see people reading at the end of their arm's length.

If you are around 30 I would try some weak readers. I'm 30 in September and I'm not exaggerating when I say it made a huge difference. I don't need them to read, it just makes it easier.