Erdogan Vows Turkey Will Crush U.S. 'Terror Army' in Syria (Kurdish YPG)

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crashtech

Lifer
Jan 4, 2013
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Turkeys biggest problem is the West running around the Middle East like a bull in a china shop for the past twenty years. The West has long since given up the mantle as an agent for peace and stability in the Middle East.

How many terrorist attacks have the PKK perpetrated inside Turkey in just the past two years? 100? 200? Count them for yourself. We are allying ourselves with a force that is destabilizing Turkey and strengthening Erdogan's legitimacy. I can totally see America attacking Turkey and igniting a civil war that morphs in a regional war involving Eastern Europe and Russia. Fucking insanity.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurdish–Turkish_conflict_(2015–present)
If your knowledge goes back that far, why are you giving Turkey such a pass? Did the Armenian Genocide not really happen, in your view? Turks proudly carry the Ottoman legacy along.
 
Nov 25, 2013
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Until they quit doing terror on Turkey's soil, this is a legit use of Turkey's military resources. If Mexico was staging attacks on America over a prolonged period of time, America without question would invade Mexico and attack the sources. This is not complicated. America wanted the tar baby, they got the tar baby.

the YPG operates in Syria given that they are Syrian Kurds. You don't seem to know much regarding the Kurds (and Turkey). My suggestion is some *real* research (as opposed to reading a wiki article).

EDIT: btw, the above is not intended as an insult. It's an observation.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
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Until they quit doing terror on Turkey's soil, this is a legit use of Turkey's military resources. If Mexico was staging attacks on America over a prolonged period of time, America without question would invade Mexico and attack the sources. This is not complicated. America wanted the tar baby, they got the tar baby.

The wiki you linked details many incidents, but it seems they are targeting Turkish military, not civilians. It sounds like a rebellion/civil war to me more than terrorism, but YMMV.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
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The wiki you linked details many incidents, but it seems they are targeting Turkish military, not civilians. It sounds like a rebellion/civil war to me more than terrorism, but YMMV.

For clarity on that point,
Moving into Syria and Iraq to continue that violence is just another day in the Middle East.
Speaking of which, some updates,
Kurds have managed to fire a few rockets into Turkey in response to the violence, not that it'll do them any good.
 
Mar 11, 2004
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Until they quit doing terror on Turkey's soil, this is a legit use of Turkey's military resources. If Mexico was staging attacks on America over a prolonged period of time, America without question would invade Mexico and attack the sources. This is not complicated. America wanted the tar baby, they got the tar baby.

Maybe you should consider that Turkey's government has been perpetrating atrocities themselves? Using your argument, you could easily spin American Independence actions as terrorism.

"Legit use", as though that means anything. By that token, it was legit use by Assad to attack those same groups in his own country. That you're trying to defend Turkey doing literally the exact same shit that Assad was doing and seemingly cannot see that, well that says everything that needs to be said of your argument.

Again, you're defending Turkey outright helping Assad to continue doing what he was doing. A Turkey that just a couple of years before was calling Assad's actions atrocities, and called him a terrorist.

If your knowledge goes back that far, why are you giving Turkey such a pass? Did the Armenian Genocide not really happen, in your view? Turks proudly carry the Ottoman legacy along.

Well duh, Turkey says it didn't happen so it didn't!
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
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More idiocy from people who don't understand the big picture and who think that everything on Earth is Post Trump, Ergo Propter Trump.

Turkey has been turning towards Russia and away from the Western Bloc for a long time now. It happened long before Trump and it's primarily based on what Europe has been doing to them, not what we're doing to them.

What EU is doing to them exactly ??
 

Oric

Senior member
Oct 11, 1999
883
57
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EU has been an excuse machine to NOT let Turkey in, long before Erdogan came into power. EU has accepted poorer and more corrupt countries into the union but there was always another excuse to not let Turkey in. It is no wonder Turkey is trying to create her alternatives for future.

By the way, Turkish tanks and troops are being hit by weapons that USA has given to YPG in the past couple of days. All those terrorist enclaves will be cleaned in the end, no doubt.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
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By the way, Turkish tanks and troops are being hit by weapons that USA has given to YPG in the past couple of days. All those terrorist enclaves will be cleaned in the end, no doubt.

People tend to shoot back when you try to kill them. The point is Turkey didn't have to invade, those weapons were for stopping ISIS.

Syria war: Turkey suffers deadliest day in Afrin offensive
Five of the troops died when their tank was attacked in the Afrin region.
...
Turkey has now lost 14 soldiers in fierce clashes during the offensive.
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
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EU has been an excuse machine to NOT let Turkey in, long before Erdogan came into power. EU has accepted poorer and more corrupt countries into the union but there was always another excuse to not let Turkey in. It is no wonder Turkey is trying to create her alternatives for future.

The only one responsible for Turkey not being accepted in EU is Turkey themselves.


https://ec.europa.eu/neighbourhood-enlargement/policy/glossary/terms/accession-criteria_en

Accession criteria
European Commission - Enlargement - Accession criteria

The accession criteria, or Copenhagen criteria (after the European Council in Copenhagen in 1993 which defined them), are the essential conditions all candidate countries must satisfy to become a member state. These are:

  • political criteria: stability of institutions guaranteeing democracy, the rule of law, human rights and respect for and protection of minorities;
  • economic criteria: a functioning market economy and the capacity to cope with competition and market forces;
  • administrative and institutional capacity to effectively implement the acquis* and ability to take on the obligations of membership.

Turkey haven't met those Criteria ever, especially today they drift further and further away from Democracy, Human rights etc etc ;)
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
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bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
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He has vowed to slaughter them... so unless we want a war with Turkey... we're going to let him.

He did?

Turkey’s President Recep Tayyip Erdogan on Tuesday said his army would “soon lay siege” to the Kurdish enclave of Afrin in Syrian Kurdistan (Rojava) amid reports of pro-Syrian government forces advancing to the border.

“In the coming days, swiftly, we will lay siege to the center of the town of Afrin,” Erdogan said, addressing the Turkish Parliament.

The President reiterated his claim that the decision to launch the military incursion into Afrin was “to create a safe and livable area” for Syrian refugees in Turkey to return. “We did not go there to burn it down.

http://www.kurdistan24.net/en/news/6a76e7e6-ecdb-45d6-96fe-bff510c56ed9
 

Oric

Senior member
Oct 11, 1999
883
57
91
There are 4 million Syrians in Turkey, sheltered, looked after on Turkey's account. There needs to be safe havens under Turkey's protection for relocation back to Syria.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
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There are 4 million Syrians in Turkey, sheltered, looked after on Turkey's account. There needs to be safe havens under Turkey's protection for relocation back to Syria.

Turkey is also continuing its long slide into religious authoritarianism. They were once looked to as a model of how a primarily Islamic country could also be secular and democratic. That is in the rear view mirror. Turkey's future is pretty clear and it is beyond bleak... poverty and ignorance.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
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Of course he won't use those words. Either he views himself as a good guy, or he'll play the PR game to parry international pressure / condemnation. But when a military wants to sweep northern Syria from one end to the other... and they've already killed a thousand people in the campaign, what would you call the action?
 

Oric

Senior member
Oct 11, 1999
883
57
91
Turkey is also continuing its long slide into religious authoritarianism. They were once looked to as a model of how a primarily Islamic country could also be secular and democratic. That is in the rear view mirror. Turkey's future is pretty clear and it is beyond bleak... poverty and ignorance.

That is not the topic we are discussing but needs an answer, Turkey breaks free of globalist control and turns into an independent nation state, just like US with Trump or Russia with Putin or India with Modi. Of course the effect of religion will be more on the social life, that is a desired effect because secular/liberal socities did not make it past a few generations and stalled socially and demographically. As they get older and less mobile, immigrants from other countries just flood in.

Let's get back to the subject. Syria is not a Kurdish State, YPG is the other facet of PKK, a terrorist organization. USA may wish to create a new puppy state with Kurds but that will not be tolerated on Turkish borders.
 

crashtech

Lifer
Jan 4, 2013
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...Let's get back to the subject. Syria is not a Kurdish State, YPG is the other facet of PKK, a terrorist organization. USA may wish to create a new puppy state with Kurds but that will not be tolerated on Turkish borders.
What would you do with the Kurds, if you had a choice? Assimilating them into Turkey and surrounding countries has not seemed to work so well.
 

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
26,328
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That is not the topic we are discussing but needs an answer, Turkey breaks free of globalist control and turns into an independent nation state, just like US with Trump or Russia with Putin or India with Modi. Of course the effect of religion will be more on the social life, that is a desired effect because secular/liberal socities did not make it past a few generations and stalled socially and demographically. As they get older and less mobile, immigrants from other countries just flood in.

Let's get back to the subject. Syria is not a Kurdish State, YPG is the other facet of PKK, a terrorist organization. USA may wish to create a new puppy state with Kurds but that will not be tolerated on Turkish borders.

Maybe if Turkey didn't treat the Kurds like shit you wouldn't have the problems you do. Actively trying to suppress someone's language and cultural tends to make them violent over time.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
That is not the topic we are discussing but needs an answer, Turkey breaks free of globalist control and turns into an independent nation state, just like US with Trump or Russia with Putin or India with Modi. Of course the effect of religion will be more on the social life, that is a desired effect because secular/liberal socities did not make it past a few generations and stalled socially and demographically. As they get older and less mobile, immigrants from other countries just flood in.

Let's get back to the subject. Syria is not a Kurdish State, YPG is the other facet of PKK, a terrorist organization. USA may wish to create a new puppy state with Kurds but that will not be tolerated on Turkish borders.

Not sure how dismantling your education system helps with that mission. Not sure how scrubbing science from the classroom contributes to that. However that is exactly what Turkey is doing. You just went from a slightly more educated county than average to a slightly less educated country. That is your canary in the coal mine. You are raising a generation of scientific illiterates. In twenty years your country will be fucked beyond recognition.


http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/opinion/taha-akyol/why-is-turkeys-education-system-failing-120058

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Today, according to the World Economic Forum, Turkey was in 91th place in 2008 in the international secondary education quality ranking. It fell back to 105th place in 2016-17.