EPA mandate "kills" ambulance's engine

[Jaskalas]

EPA regulation causes ambulance to break down on way to hospital...
Patient dies...

When the D.C. fire department began buying these diesel engine ambulances a few years ago, officials knew they would have to manage them with a new emission control system that would automatically shut the engine down if it wasn't allowed to what's called "regenerate.”

What is this mandated emission control system for engines? Are we going to have newer vehicles break down and fail because of this genius? The EPA needs to be shut down before people get hurt and killed.

 

[xBiffx]

Everything has trade offs. When the environment comes first, something else doesn't. Most people don't put human health or safety at the forefront where it ought to be. Granted some things that the EPA offers do this but humans are not their objective. That is collateral damage so to speak.

 

[nehalem256]

When Ambulance 19 broke down, it was transporting 34-year-old Nathaniel McRae, who had just been in a shootout with D.C. police.

A medic continued to administer CPR while the crew waited for a second ambulance but McRae was pronounced dead at Howard University Hospital.

I don't see a problem here :whiste:

 

[Brainonska511]

I guess normal ambulances never break down?

 

[Jaskalas]

Some more information:

http://firechief.com/blog/epa-reverses-ruling-fire-truck-engine-regeneration

“Fire apparatus are going into ‘regeneration’ at the scene of fires to begin the burn off process causing units to shut down, thus leaving firefighters with no water to fight a fire until replacement units can arrive,” the SEAFC letter stated. “This situation could cause the loss of life to a fire fighter or to a taxpayer who is depending on the fire engine reaching them in time to save them and their property.”

SEAFC began the campaign following the report on the San Diego fire truck that shut down on scene, according to Dan Cimini, retired assistant chief for Myrtle Beach, S.C. Fire departments throughout the southeastern region also had reported problems with the regeneration process of the engines and spurred on SEAFC.

I guess normal ambulances never break down?

This "break down" is by design. It is intentional!

 

[PottedMeat]

Right now the military and construction industries are the only entities with an exemption.

wait, the construction industry already gets an exemption but first responder people don't? i guess we know who has the better lobbyists.

 

[Theb]

"It's going back to the manufacturer,” said Smith. “It should still be under warranty and let them get to the bottom of it.”

But in the future, the fire department may not have to deal with the issue.

In May of last year, after many complaints from other fire departments, the EPA issued a directive waiving the diesel emissions rules for fire engines and ambulances.

Donnelly was unaware of the directive and said he would look into it.

What is unclear is if the emissions controls can be disconnected or the fire department would have to buy new units without them.

When Ambulance 19 broke down, it was transporting 34-year-old Nathaniel McRae, who had just been in a shootout with D.C. police.

A medic continued to administer CPR while the crew waited for a second ambulance but McRae was pronounced dead at Howard University Hospital.

What is unclear is how long the crew waited for the second ambulance. But a spokesman for the fire department, Lon Walls, said "the delay did not affect care in any way.”

Interesting.

 

[Kadarin]

It is unacceptable that first responder vehicles shut down to comply with emissions regulations, thus endangering lives. However, this sounds like simple bureaucratic oversight rather than anything else.

 

[FaaR]

It is unacceptable that first responder vehicles shut down to comply with emissions regulations

Yes. But also, why isn't proper maintenance steps taken to prevent these engines from shutting down during an emergency? That's a very important consideration, if you have a first responder vehicle whose engine might shut down on you.

 

[Jaskalas]

It is unacceptable that first responder vehicles shut down to comply with emissions regulations, thus endangering lives. However, this sounds like simple bureaucratic oversight rather than anything else.

You think any vehicle should shut down like this?

First responder or not, I disapprove of the entire scheme.

 

[quikah]

What is this mandated emission control system for engines? Are we going to have newer vehicles break down and fail because of this genius? The EPA needs to be shut down before people get hurt and killed.

There is a particulate filter on diesel engines. If it gets too dirty it needs to be "regenerated". Basically the engine exhaust is raised by increase RPM to burn off the particulates, cleaning the filter. This has to occur every 100 or so miles. It is usually automatic and doesn't interfere with normal operation, but you need to drive around for it to work. I can see why vehicles that are not driven a lot can have problems.

I am guessing that the people doing maintenance on these vehicles are not familiar with these systems and not forcing regenerations so these problems don't occur.

 

[boomerang]

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Casualties can be expected if we want to survive the catastrophic effects of global warming climate change.

 

[Jhhnn]

EPA regulation causes ambulance to break down on way to hospital...
Patient dies...



What is this mandated emission control system for engines? Are we going to have newer vehicles break down and fail because of this genius? The EPA needs to be shut down before people get hurt and killed.

Yeh, let's just go back to the good old days of the Love canal, rivers that caught on fire & urban smog so thick that people with respiratory problems couldn't go outside some days.

It's a brilliant plan.

 

[Jeff7]

Yeh, let's just go back to the good old days of the Love canal, rivers that caught on fire & urban smog so thick that people with respiratory problems couldn't go outside some days.

It's a brilliant plan.

It'll be fine. The free market will take care of it, because business owners exclusively care about the welfare of the community, not their own bottom line, and because government regulation is only good for murdering people in ambulances.

 

[chucky2]

Actually this is sort of a catch-22. Rather than adopt nationally EU diesel regs, we allowed CARB to defacto set our nations light auto emissions policy - the EPA just does what CARB wants/is going to do anyways. We don't get to leverage existing diesel tech the rest of the world employs, but rather, added stuff tacked on for us due to CARB policies that have little public benefit in the face of the massive mileage gains diesel yields.

This is not to say that a DPF isn't needed in TRoTW, it is (at least, recently), so that'd be not a good argument to be used here but rather one of our failure to leverage diesel in a nation that could actually seriously benefit from it, thereby screwing our diesel base and penetration (minds out of gutter folks).

Really the failure here is manufacturers, who should have employed a limp home mechanism rather than a total shutdown. However had we mirrored EU diesel regs, our diesel market penetration would be far more, and things like this would likely have long been weeded out due to experience gained/strict laws not needing to be followed or presumed to be followed. Oh well...

 

[Ophir]

There is a particulate filter on diesel engines. If it gets too dirty it needs to be "regenerated". Basically the engine exhaust is raised by increase RPM to burn off the particulates, cleaning the filter. This has to occur every 100 or so miles. It is usually automatic and doesn't interfere with normal operation, but you need to drive around for it to work. I can see why vehicles that are not driven a lot can have problems.

I am guessing that the people doing maintenance on these vehicles are not familiar with these systems and not forcing regenerations so these problems don't occur.

Please don't bring truth into this. They're having a great time playing make believe.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_particulate_filter

 

[herm0016]

There is a particulate filter on diesel engines. If it gets too dirty it needs to be "regenerated". Basically the engine exhaust is raised by increase RPM to burn off the particulates, cleaning the filter. This has to occur every 100 or so miles. It is usually automatic and doesn't interfere with normal operation, but you need to drive around for it to work. I can see why vehicles that are not driven a lot can have problems.

I am guessing that the people doing maintenance on these vehicles are not familiar with these systems and not forcing regenerations so these problems don't occur.

yep. We deal with this all the time, the systems built in the last year or so are much better than the systems that are 5 years old. the problem usually comes because the trucks are run to power pumps and things using a PTO and the manufacture will not let the regen process happen when the pto is engaged. The consiquince of it happening to us is not death, but an oil well blowout.

 

[Lithium381]

Some more information:

http://firechief.com/blog/epa-reverses-ruling-fire-truck-engine-regeneration




This "break down" is by design. It is intentional!

hah, notice how you're refered to as a 'taxpayer' instead of a citizen in those quotes . . . . no hiding it now

 

[Jhhnn]

Please don't bring truth into this. They're having a great time playing make believe.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_particulate_filter

Yep. Hair trigger big gubmint outrage chubby. It squirts before it even gets hard.

 

[ichy]

It is unacceptable that first responder vehicles shut down to comply with emissions regulations, thus endangering lives. However, this sounds like simple bureaucratic oversight rather than anything else.

But some people will never miss the chance to make a mountain out of a mole hill.

Don't forget that diesel engine emissions used to be really, really nasty. I'm sure that a few people died as a result of all the crap they put in the air.