Elephants are set to go

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,315
1,215
126
Beautiful.

We took a healthy white rhino population and made it go extinct in my lifetime.

Now it appears impossible to stop the extinction of the black rhino and the elephant. All set to be completed in my lifetime and most likely to occur in the next 10 years.

This IMHO is WORTH fighting a war over. It is worthy of spending BILLIONS of dollars to prevent. We won't and they will be wiped out. Truly sad.

http://mic.com/articles/95958/within-10-years-you-may-never-see-an-elephant-again#.9lJzBATKi

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realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
12,337
898
126
People were worried about global warming and its effects, and one effect was possible decline of polar bears. As it turns out those bears are adapting and are coming back in population.

Global warming is not an issue as to why other animals like Elephants are in danger. Why would "Warmists" make a global warming issue out of Elephants?
 
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Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
35,838
10,144
136
Safe zones are about the best we can do.
Given that it's Africa... the rest of the world would have to fund a military force just to protect it.
And then which country would really give up its land and natural resources? You're looking at taking this land by force.
Your animal defense may face military / terrorist opposition. Very costly.
 

rudder

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
19,441
86
91
agreed, I think poachers should be shot on sight. Not even close to joking about that.

As long as ivory is in demand (i.e., China) there will be a huge market and the poachers will likely be better armed than the guys that patrol these reserves.
 

KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
32,785
52,253
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As long as ivory is in demand (i.e., China) there will be a huge market and the poachers will likely be better armed than the guys that patrol these reserves.
Yup, I have a cousin that is a park ranger or safari guide in south Africa , the poachers will track the animals for days, then when they finally catch up to the animal and see that the horn is already cutoff what do they do? They shot the poor animal anyways in spite... cut the demand and they will be mostly left alone...
 

gorcorps

aka Brandon
Jul 18, 2004
30,741
456
126
As long as ivory is in demand (i.e., China) there will be a huge market and the poachers will likely be better armed than the guys that patrol these reserves.

China is not the only one to blame, the US is a strong second
 

MajinCry

Platinum Member
Jul 28, 2015
2,495
571
136
But God gave man dominion over the animals!

This calls for the greatest of prayer circles.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,948
126
The human race can only do one thing at a time. Right now the focus is on infinite growth of consumption. Once we get done with that we can focus on these other issues.
 

MajinCry

Platinum Member
Jul 28, 2015
2,495
571
136
The human race can only do one thing at a time. Right now the focus is on infinite growth of consumption. Once we get done with that we can focus on these other issues.

Nah, religion's 'ere to stay, ta make sure we stay stuck in the mud.
 

Harabec

Golden Member
Oct 15, 2005
1,369
1
81
As long as people around the world continue to be bloody morons this'll go on. Demand will be there until the last one drops, then a bloody moron will find that some other animal's part has magic properties and the cycle will repeat.

Humanity cannot be saved from itself quicker than the destruction it is causing.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,948
126
As long as people around the world continue to be bloody morons this'll go on. Demand will be there until the last one drops, then a bloody moron will find that some other animal's part has magic properties and the cycle will repeat.

Humanity cannot be saved from itself quicker than the destruction it is causing.

I think we evolved wrong. We are not gonna make it for the long haul. Hopefully some other animal on some other planet did it right.
 
Nov 8, 2012
20,842
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What is sad is that these poachers are dumb as a fucking rock.

ME GET MONEY NOW. ME KILL ANIMALS FOR MATERIAL!

You could actually make more money by populating the species instead of making your money grab go extinct. You know, like how farmers make and slaughter cows to make delicious meat?

Not that I condone skinning animals for material in general, just saying that they are stupid for killing their own market.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,948
126
What is sad is that these poachers are dumb as a fucking rock.

ME GET MONEY NOW. ME KILL ANIMALS FOR MATERIAL!

You could actually make more money by populating the species instead of making your money grab go extinct. You know, like how farmers make and slaughter cows to make delicious meat?

Not that I condone skinning animals for material in general, just saying that they are stupid for killing their own market.

Look up tragedy of the commons.
 

Grooveriding

Diamond Member
Dec 25, 2008
9,147
1,330
126
I think we evolved wrong. We are not gonna make it for the long haul. Hopefully some other animal on some other planet did it right.

I think a species evolving to self aware consciousness with the ability to bend the environment to its uses is a flaw of evolution in the long game. At least if humans are the typical route this evolutionary jump takes. Imagine if, for example, dolphins possessed the intelligence we do. They'd still be unable to do the sort of damage we are doing to the planet due to being confined to the ocean and lacking a physicality that lets them use tools.

In the big picture the Earth would probably have been better off had we never evolved. Our species could at worst render the Earth a dead husk no longer sustainable for life, at best we'll end up wiping ourselves and many other species out, leaving evolution to bring forward new species from the remnants.

Our species probably has only a few thousand years left on the Earth before we're gone due to some idiotic war or rendering the environment so polluted and exhausted that the Earth can no longer sustain us.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,789
6,349
126
I think a species evolving to self aware consciousness with the ability to bend the environment to its uses is a flaw of evolution in the long game. At least if humans are the typical route this evolutionary jump takes. Imagine if, for example, dolphins possessed the intelligence we do. They'd still be unable to do the sort of damage we are doing to the planet due to being confined to the ocean and lacking a physicality that lets them use tools.

In the big picture the Earth would probably have been better off had we never evolved. Our species could at worst render the Earth a dead husk no longer sustainable for life, at best we'll end up wiping ourselves and many other species out, leaving evolution to bring forward new species from the remnants.

Our species probably has only a few thousand years left on the Earth before we're gone due to some idiotic war or rendering the environment so polluted and exhausted that the Earth can no longer sustain us.

I still have hope that our Intelligence will eventually mature enough that we can focus on overcoming our faults successfully. We have developed a lot socially already, History shows a progression of sophistication in our thinking, avoiding past mistakes. However, it certainly also shows how some of our mistakes lead to civilization collapses before correcting those mistakes. If ours collapses too, hopefully it will be slow and gradual, to minimize the possibility of rash actions.
 

Grooveriding

Diamond Member
Dec 25, 2008
9,147
1,330
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I still have hope that our Intelligence will eventually mature enough that we can focus on overcoming our faults successfully. We have developed a lot socially already, History shows a progression of sophistication in our thinking, avoiding past mistakes. However, it certainly also shows how some of our mistakes lead to civilization collapses before correcting those mistakes. If ours collapses too, hopefully it will be slow and gradual, to minimize the possibility of rash actions.

Hopefully. One of the really interesting things about our species is that we'll reach a point where we're able to take over the process of evolution as it pertains to us and other species. As our understanding of DNA and RNA increases along with potential methods of manipulating it, we may take the evolutionary process in hand and start to curate our species. It could be a good thing or an awful one, but we're heading towards having that ability and it's no longer science fiction. We could very well be limited by our intelligence ceiling in our ability to understand more about nature. It takes exceptions to the norm like Einstein to make leaps in understanding no one else can make, that once made allow our understanding of nature to increase. If we gain the ability to increase our intelligence via genetic manipulation, it could be what drives us forward and gives us new understandings and ways to use nature we would have never been able to conceive of otherwise.

The challenge is collectively seeing our species reach a majority view of working towards positive goals and sharing a collective value in those goals. Currently we're killing ourselves slowly via our dominant economic system that ignores everything in the pursuit of increasing economic dominance. The system ultimately serves no real end game value, it's just used to incentivize people to go out and be productive.

We'll need to find a way to incentivize innovation without a capitalist system for things to turn around, imo. Alternately find a way to remove corruption from capitalism and somehow infuse it with notions of real societal returns. You can see some innovators starting to have this sort of vision, Elon Musk comes to mind. But we're still a long way out when you have politicians denying reality and science because their pockets are being padded by the wealthiest profiteers who care for nothing but increasing their wealth at the expense of everyone's future.

Right now capitalism is really just the best of a pile of stinky turds. We need something better in the long game. A puny minority ever increasing a number in their bank account is not really serving any good and is doing a lot of harm. The core values of the system are largely negative and reap destruction on multiple fronts.
 
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thraashman

Lifer
Apr 10, 2000
11,112
1,587
126
Edit: Original title was edited to remove the unrelated issue mention therefore I am removing my comment so as to not distract from the pertinent discussion.
 
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