# Electromagnetics and Energy

#### Hamburgerpimp

##### Diamond Member
My friend and I were discussing Electromagnetic Weapons and Psychotronic Warfare and how the Soviets/U.S have experimented with them for decades. He said a Doctor in Australia has patented a device that will produce 2.5 Kilowatts of continuous power out of empty space in a vacuum. Where energy is actually extracted out of time.

We live in a 3 dimensional world. The energy created by this device would actually come from the 4th dimension; space-time. So, Time in this case would be energy and compressed at the same rate as which Matter is compressed into energy.

E=mc² and thus E=tc² (t is delta-t)

The Doctor has been issued a Patent for it and apparently will begin distributing it in the near future. Anybody heard of it or have any comments on it?

#### q2261

##### Senior member
If this is true, why isnt it frontpage news everywhere?

Sounds to me like a MAJOR breakthrough.

#### dkozloski

##### Diamond Member
Sounds to me like major Bull\$hit.

#### Hamburgerpimp

##### Diamond Member
Sounds to me like major Bull\$hit.

I expected more of an intelligent answer from the Highly Technical Forum.

Actually, he's a Ph.D., nuclear engineer, retired Lieutenant Colonel (U.S. Army), CEO of CTEC, Inc. His name is Thomas Bearden. He was granted U.S. Patent # 6,362,718 on March 26, 2002. The prototypes are almost done and it will produce 2.5 Kilowatts of continuous power. Later models are aimed at producing 10 Kilowatts. I found this, as well:

Tom Bearden claims that when a Source ( a dipole ) is connected to a resistive load, the most important part of the principle is the information transfered to the load at the speed of light by the S-Flow. The S-Flow is pure EM energy which flows through the space and outside the conductor. This energy is Free and only this part must be used as a "free lunch". Just after this very short time, after that the switch is closed ( the transient phase ), the current begins to flow in the circuit. This transient phase is named the Relaxation Time. In copper, the relaxation time is incredibly rapid, it's about 1.5 x 10-19 sec. When the current flows ( the permanent phase ), the circuit consumes power from the Source and dissipates energy by Joule's Effet.

#### dkozloski

##### Diamond Member
If you believe this kind of stuff I'll send the tooth fairy around with a proposal to sell you a big bridge in New York. A patent if it indeed exists doesn't mean a thing as the device doesn't have to work to get one. A discussion on this invention(?) belongs over at Art Bell's website. I apologize for being blunt but this stuff is humbug at best and some kind of promotion/swindle at worst.

#### Hamburgerpimp

##### Diamond Member
this stuff is humbug at best

LOL, I suppose you used that very line all through your High School classes? Perhaps College too, if you made it there?

#### Hamburgerpimp

##### Diamond Member
Here disprove this.

Or perhaps you'll just yell "humbug" because you can't grasp the concept.

#### CTho9305

##### Elite Member
Originally posted by: Hamburgerpimp
Sounds to me like major Bull\$hit.

I expected more of an intelligent answer from the Highly Technical Forum.

That's a pretty funny quote, considering what you posted. I looked at hte patent and it is really hard to read. Would you, since you are obviously more knowledgeable than the three of us who have replied so far, please explain it in terms we can understand?

Throwing around terms like "Fourth dimension" doesn't make you sound smart. And, uh, if the Soviets/U.S. experiemtned with this stuff, why did a doctor in Australia do this work?

BTW - if you connect a source to a resistive load, you have a battery with a resistor across the terminals. What am I missing?

The fact that something is patented means nothing. Is this 6 year old brilliant? The patent office lets a LOT of stupid things go by.

edit: i looked at the figures in the patent. Looks to me like the output is (as expected) purely the result of power supplied by the power source
If one flipflop could generate power, then cpus (with thousands) plus a few small magnets should be able to power your homes

#### Hamburgerpimp

##### Diamond Member
Like I said, Anybody heard of it or have any comments on it?. Meaning, I was under the assumption that a more educated person than myself in Highly Technical Forum could enlighten me on this. You seem to think I'm selling the damn thing.

#### CTho9305

##### Elite Member
Originally posted by: Hamburgerpimp
Like I said, Anybody heard of it or have any comments on it?. Meaning, I was under the assumption that a more educated person than myself in Highly Technical Forum could enlighten me on this. You seem to think I'm selling the damn thing.
oh, you sounded like you were. if you're honestly asking, let me give you the clearest answer: there is NO free lunch. power has to come from somewhere... whether it is your power supply, a chemicla reaction (which runs out - reversing a reaction costs the same energy running it forwards put out), and so on.

I swear I saw that posted here already, with a very in depth discussion. I will try to find.

<edit>
I can't find it. I will look more.
</edit>

#### RossGr

##### Diamond Member
Like I said, Anybody heard of it or have any comments on it?. Meaning, I was under the assumption that a more educated person than myself in Highly Technical Forum could enlighten me on this. You seem to think I'm selling the damn thing.

Humm.... Seems to me they did inlighten you, you just didn't like what you heard. As for the motionless generator, as I say to everyone who has such a miracle machine, quit talking, and build it. Perhaps the reason they not are beening made is simply because they don't work.

#### Mingon

##### Diamond Member
I spent some time working on EM guns - this imoh sounds like someone fishing for a patent i.e. describe somwthing that is perhaps plausable, then if it is possible claim it was their idea somewhere down the line

#### dkozloski

##### Diamond Member
What that clown describes in his application is a simple transformer that is biased for an unknown reason by permanent magnets. Like all transformers the output would be less than the input because of eddy-current, resistive and capacitive losses. My guess is that the output waveform would look similar to that of a magnetic amplifier or a saturable reactor without the ability to regulate the output current. The device might be useful for something, like being the basis for a stock swindle, but it sure isn't going to generate anything except empty pockets for the investors.

#### rgwalt

##### Diamond Member
I don't buy it... If this machine worked, it would violate the first and second laws of thermodynamics.

Ryan

#### dkozloski

##### Diamond Member

Quote: "You seem to think I'm selling the damn thing."

#### Geniere

##### Senior member
Believe it or not, there may be some credence to this. I recall reading an artical by some scientists from a Texas university who were able to extract energy from outside the universe (whatever that means). A phenomenon similar to "tunneling" was hypothesized as the means. In their case no usable energy was realized but nevertheless was measurable. I recall two large (conductive???) plates were used and separated by a small gap. Whatever tunneled through was trapped.

I'll try to find the article.

Regards

#### CTho9305

##### Elite Member
Originally posted by: Geniere
Believe it or not, there may be some credence to this. I recall reading an artical by some scientists from a Texas university who were able to extract energy from outside the universe (whatever that means). A phenomenon similar to "tunneling" was hypothesized as the means. In their case no usable energy was realized but nevertheless was measurable. I recall two large (conductive???) plates were used and separated by a small gap. Whatever tunneled through was trapped.

I'll try to find the article.

Regards

casimir effect. there was a thread on that in HT not too long ago... try a search.

#### Shalmanese

##### Platinum Member
The US Patent office no longer grants patent claims for any device which purports to produce perpetual energy.

#### earthman

##### Golden Member
Isn't this how Dr. Who's TARDIS works?

#### dkozloski

##### Diamond Member
You would still need the DiLithium crystals and the phasitron. Maybe you could appeal to the Romulans for help.

#### AnthraX101

##### Senior member
I've had a discussion about this with some of my friends. Quite simply, you are stealing from a permanent magnet. Basically we decided one of two things would happen:

1) This would, in some way, demagnetize the permanent magnet. You would be left with a worthless hunk of metal.

2) The tidal forces in the magnet would be to great, and you would be left with a pile of dust.

If someone cares to actually put forward a reason that this would work, I would love to hear it.

AnthraX101

#### mygumballs

##### Member
everyone should really keep an open mind about this because currently, quantum physics is taking a very strange turn as physicists are observing very peculiar phenomenon which go against some previously accepted rules. one of which might be relevant to this topic is something my current modern physics teacher mentioned. physicists are starting to propose that there is no such thing as a vacuum. they've observed that space void of any matter, EM waves or gravitational waves will some times spontaneously create an electron-positron pair. this implies that even so called "empty space" still contain some signs of energy being present. this is all part of a growing category of physics called "quantum strangeness". my physics teacher, who IS a very good physicist, told us about this so please don't persecute me...

#### RossGr

##### Diamond Member
Originally posted by: mygumballs
everyone should really keep an open mind about this because currently, quantum physics is taking a very strange turn as physicists are observing very peculiar phenomenon which go against some previously accepted rules. one of which might be relevant to this topic is something my current modern physics teacher mentioned. physicists are starting to propose that there is no such thing as a vacuum. they've observed that space void of any matter, EM waves or gravitational waves will some times spontaneously create an electron-positron pair. this implies that even so called "empty space" still contain some signs of energy being present. this is all part of a growing category of physics called "quantum strangeness". my physics teacher, who IS a very good physicist, told us about this so please don't persecute me...

The thing is this is not a question concerning QM, this is a problem dealing with E&M, there is very little that is not understood about E&M it is a very well understood field of physics. Your teacher is correct in telling you about the sea of virtual particle which exist everywhere in the universe, only it is not all that new and not in the least contraversial, in fact it is a very well established part of phyics. Agian there is nothing there that will effect the operation of a permenate magnet motor. You might want to do a web search on the Casmir effect, this is the name for the "vacuum energy" it again is pretty well understood and there is no free lunch there.

A key to these permenate magnet motors is that there is no such thing as a permentate permenate magnet, they are only magnets for a long time, not permenately. As they do work, they will become demagnetized, the harder they work the quicker they demagnetize. BTW: What does it mean to work a magnet? If you clamp a magnet to a metal plate and leave it there it is doing NO work, in fact this is called a keeper and is the method used to extend the life of a magnet. IF every 10sec you pulll the magnet off the plate, and put it back you are now working the magnet. It is the changeing of the magnetic flux that does work.

#### Cogman

##### Lifer
People saying this is imposible should reconsider. Im open to the thought that he might have suceeded in makeing such a divice (if so we need to get it down to the size of a batery so I can get one for our Laptop, Endless playing time ) But really, in the 1400's the Human race thought that it knew everything about the world, but then some guy, Who was rejected 3 times might I add, Travel into the middle of nowhere and found a Landmass that doubled the size of the earth, (How big the scientists thought the earth was.) We could know comparitivly Nothing about a basic Princable, like gravity. Maybe gravity doesnt alway atract, Maybe sometimes it repels...

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