Election meddling fix

[Fanatical Meat]

things were looking good yesterday afternoon when a bunch of security experts appeared to have a plan on how to deal with it.
Few hours later while Trump was charging his batteries at a rally....

President Donald Trump's own administration adopts rhetoric, positions and interpretations of facts that directly conflict with the views and stated beliefs of the President himself, raising doubts about the unity and coherence of White House strategy on key issues -- including addressing election interference, broader foreign policy and domestic issues such as immigration or avoiding a government shutdown.
This strange duality played out Thursday as the intelligence and foreign policy chieftains mustered in the White House Briefing Room to promise what FBI Director Christopher Wray said would be "fierce determination and focus" to thwart Russian meddling in the midterm elections

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/03/poli...ference-white-house-response-trump/index.html

 

[MomentsofSanity]

I can't help but wonder if these guys go out and do these shows of unity only to turn on the TV at night while curled up in the corner rocking back and forth waiting to hear what the shit bag has done to completely undermine them.

How they haven't all quit just to maintain a shred of integrity is beyond me.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

a shred of integrity

Gotta have one to maintain it.

 

[interchange]

Here's what Trump said at the rally (referring to Putin):

"We discussed everything. ... We got along really well. By the way, that's a good thing, not a bad thing. Now we're being hindered by the Russian hoax -- it's a hoax, OK?"

 

[Fanatical Meat]

I can't help but wonder if these guys go out and do these shows of unity only to turn on the TV at night while curled up in the corner rocking back and forth waiting to hear what the shit bag has done to completely undermine them.

How they haven't all quit just to maintain a shred of integrity is beyond me.

I don’t know how anyone could work in this White House.
I’ll give the Intelligence guys a pass because it’s more of a duty thing.

 

[cytg111]

Here's what Trump said at the rally (referring to Putin):

"We discussed everything. ... We got along really well. By the way, that's a good thing, not a bad thing. Now we're being hindered by the Russian hoax -- it's a hoax, OK?"

As Pompeo testifies here
https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/27/politics/mnuchin-russia-sanctions-rusal/index.html
They discussed specifically lifting sanctions on Rusal, as quid pro quo for help with winning the election.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

I looked at the photo of Trump and Putin shaking hands in the article which I've never bothered with before. Trump is screaming submission to the alpha Putin. Putin's head is somewhat lowered, but his eyes are locked on Trump showing dominance. Trump is watching Putin and communicating a lower social status.

Full disclosure. I am an expert because I have lots of dogs/s

Seriously, that's what I see.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

As Pompeo testifies here
https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/27/politics/mnuchin-russia-sanctions-rusal/index.html
They discussed specifically lifting sanctions on Rusal, as quid pro quo for help with winning the election.

The motorhead cover looks like a uterus.

 

[HomerJS]

Dan Coats gave the only honest answer to what was said at their one-one meeting.

'I'm not in a position to know what was said at Helsinki"

Bolton stumbled his way into a little honesty when he stated "Putin said Trump brought up election interference" Get it?!?

The top intelligence people in the United States still don't know what that asshole agreed to. We do know at least one thing, since Trump just eased sanctions on a Russian company tied to one of Putin's oligarchs.

 

[Moonbeam]

What I hear is, "No need to impeach him", to the Republican congress. "We got this."

 

[VRAMdemon]

So..The entire national security cabinet (Homeland Security, DNI, Bolton, etc) stood before the media and stated unequivocally that Russia is attempting to interfere with the 2018 election, but that they're on the case.

I wonder: did we just witness a mini-coup? How much of this was on their own and in defiance of their boss? He is vomiting at his rally that the Russian hacking is a "hoax" again.

Now...Is this their prelude toward getting out front of the midterms in November. If the Democrats really do win big, they can claim that Russia interfered to make them win and throw complete doubt on the 2018 election. It's typical Republican projection combined with The Big Lie.

Or..Is the reality is much less nefarious. At the cabinet level - despite their many, grievous, flaws - they're genuinely appalled at the idea of Russian meddling; and politically, they know they're getting killed by the Administration's inept response to the attack. So they took it upon themselves to do what their boss is unable and/or unwilling to do: make a strong statement on the problem and the response (and pretend that Trump is right there with them.)

 

[Fanatical Meat]

^^^^yes a whole bunch spoke about it. I heard pieces of coverage on CNN yesterday

mini coup is an interesting thought

*I had a similar thought about *if* there is an enormous blue wave. Russia just has to release some garbage about how they influenced or worst case how a voting machines totals were changed even one machine one trivial amount. Trump will say they’re not legitimate leaders and hump the shit out of that for 2 years.

 

[kage69]

What a coincidence. I've long likened this admin's foreign policy to Python's "200m Freestyle for Non swimmers." haha

I suppose we could also liken the turn over rate to Python's Marathon for the Incontinent, but in this case it's a different person that runs back onto the track.

 

[HomerJS]

^^^^yes a whole bunch spoke about it. I heard pieces of coverage on CNN yesterday

mini coup is an interesting thought

*I had a similar thought about *if* there is an enormous blue wave. Russia just has to release some garbage about how they influenced or worst case how a voting machines totals were changed even one machine one trivial amount. Trump will say they’re not legitimate leaders and hump the shit out of that for 2 years.

Trump has already lit that gaslight claiming the Russians are going to favor the Dems. He'll come out with a big "I told you"

 

[VRAMdemon]

^^^ Yes, The Russians really might actually hack to help democrats in some districts, giving Republicans the 'evidence' they need to declare the election a sham. This might have been talked about in private at Helsinki.

Then...Hard Core Republican Trumpsters claim that Democrats didn't really win and refuse to certify the elections at the state level, refuse to seat members of Congress, or otherwise refuse to recognize the legitimacy of the elections.

 

[HomerJS]

^^^ Yes, The Russians really might actually hack to help democrats in some districts, giving Republicans the 'evidence' they need to declare the election a sham. This might have been talked about in private at Helsinki.

Then...Hard Core Republican Trumpsters claim that Democrats didn't really win and refuse to certify the elections at the state level, refuse to seat members of Congress, or otherwise refuse to recognize the legitimacy of the elections.

When are we going to require paper backups so all elections be audited???

 

[Fanatical Meat]

When are we going to require paper backups so all elections be audited???

All should have per backup and all should understand some are not going to be filled correctly (hanging chad) and some mis scans will happen

 

[SMOGZINN]

When are we going to require paper backups so all elections be audited???

Either when Republicans no longer have a majority say in how elections are run, or when the election tampering no longer mostly benefits them. As long as both of those are true they will make sure that no effective methods of preventing election tampering is allowed. That, of course, begs the question if Democrats were benefiting from election tampering and had the ability to do something about it would they? I honestly don't know the answer to that question, I suspect they would simply because I think they believe that a fair system favors them.

That means that the best solution is for everyone, Republican and Democrat alike, to demand that we implement strong system to prevent election tampering.

 

[Mandres]

When are we going to require paper backups so all elections be audited???

I keep hearing that same drum beat, what do you mean? How would paper backups be any more secure than the current electronic data? Both rely 100% on the integrity of your local officials conducting the election. Election machines are not connected to the internet, so the specter of foreign hackers changing the votes is pretty absurd.

 

[VRAMdemon]

Or..this admission by his entire security cabinet that the Russians are planning on hacking the up coming elections was done In defense of their boss, not in defiance of him. Don't forget that all of these people were appointed by Trump and are answerable to him.

This may be just the next wall of the cover-up. The Trump administration has already tried to shut down the investigation and convince people that no crime ever occurred. That's worn too thin. So now they'll try to take over the investigation so they can control where it goes and how slowly it moves. Or bring everything to a halt by shutting down the government.

 

[hal2kilo]

Or..this admission by his entire security cabinet that the Russians are planning on hacking the up coming elections was done In defense of their boss, not in defiance of him. Don't forget that all of these people were appointed by Trump and are answerable to him.

This may be just the next wall of the cover-up. The Trump administration has already tried to shut down the investigation and convince people that no crime ever occurred. That's worn too thin. So now they'll try to take over the investigation so they can control where it goes and how slowly it moves. Or bring everything to a halt by shutting down the government.

Yea, it was weird. You wonder is the intelligence part of the cabinet going rogue, or were they actually trying to make out like that was the presidents policy. I doesn't help that Trump immediately turned around that same night at a rally screaming about bad press and the Russian thing being a hoax. Nothing but mixed messages. Can't pin him down on anything, probably on purpose.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

With some mental exhaustion and overload, I actually chose yesterday to make an idiot rule-of-thumb. Since Trump is likely a traitor, just as likely a gross tax cheat and violator of the emoluments clause, a whoremonger so corrupt that he thinks he's above the law, I cannot accept any part of a "Trump legacy." It must all be reversed. All foreign policy, all tax policy, all domestic policy.

So I conclude that Coats, Nielsen, Wray and the rest have concocted a dog-and-pony show. "The Government" should've been all over the Russian campaign like flies on a dead bunny rabbit as early as spring, 2017. Of those, I might assume that Coats and Wray know what they're doing in their respective sandboxes. Nielsen had come up through the Bush administration in HS. Wray was a careerist, or so I hope he was.

Congress authorized billions for these chuckleheads to address the problem, and they'd chosen not to spend it.

"Agree to disagree" -- hell. They ought to put these people on trial once the more likely catastrophes materialize.

Also, in answer to some posters who define "holes in the sieve of possibilities" for what could happen with some limited success of Russian meddling, thanks for the insights. It scares the hell out of me.

 

[Jhhnn]

I keep hearing that same drum beat, what do you mean? How would paper backups be any more secure than the current electronic data? Both rely 100% on the integrity of your local officials conducting the election. Election machines are not connected to the internet, so the specter of foreign hackers changing the votes is pretty absurd.

Down at the precinct level it's quite rare for both parties not to be represented. That extends up through every level of the vote counting process. They keep each other honest. Hand recounts are fairly common. Purely electronic voting negates that entirely. Down at the precinct level, there's no way to tell if the vote has been honestly tabulated. Paper trails are the only way to insure that they have been. It's the only tangible proof we have.

Contracts work the same way for the same reasons.

 

[ivwshane]

You know what's sad? Four years ago a thread like this would have been deemed crazy and everyone it would be looked at like an anti vaxxer or a 9/11 truther.

The fact that we even have to have this conversation and the fact that such a conversation is backed up by the head of our intelligence agencies is just mind blowing. That's not even adding to it that the fucking president of the united states might be involved and at the very least he's personally ignoring this issue. Let's not even think about the 30% of the country who not only supports the traitor but they are so mesmerized by him that reality literally means anything trump wants it to mean, no questions asked.

And you have people like greenman who don't have any concern.

 

[Mandres]

Down at the precinct level it's quite rare for both parties not to be represented. That extends up through every level of the vote counting process. They keep each other honest. Hand recounts are fairly common. Purely electronic voting negates that entirely. Down at the precinct level, there's no way to tell if the vote has been honestly tabulated. Paper trails are the only way to insure that they have been. It's the only tangible proof we have.

Contracts work the same way for the same reasons.

I'll preface this with full disclosure; I'm a local election official, and my county uses dre voting machines (100% electronic). I welcome any reasonable argument about how a paper based system is more secure but I've never heard a convincing one once we get down into the details of the procedures in place around how the data is collected, transmitted and compiled. It always comes down to someone's vague sense of unease about electronic voting, and the perception that paper ballots are simpler and therefore better, and so we should all go back to the old ways. We don't hear public outcry insisting that banks return to paper ledgers because they're more secure and auditable. It's exactly the same thing - both systems are completely secure if your local officials are honest and competent.