ECS K7S5A vs. MSI KT3 ULTRA2 - signficant performance difference?

[dpk777]

Newegg has the ECS mobo for $53 shipped and the MSI for $83 shipped.

Is there a significant performance difference between the two?

I'm just looking to pop my XP1600 into a mobo, however, I don't know if I should pay the extra $$$ if there isn't going to be a noticable difference.
The only reason why I'm hesitant to get the K7S5A because it seems there are a lot of problems with it.

dpk

EDIT: I just checked the price for the MSI at Newegg and it dropped down to $79 + $4s/h...is this price just gonna gradually drop?

 

[Muse]

Originally posted by: dpk777
Newegg has the ECS mobo for $53 shipped and the MSI for $82.

Is there a significant performance difference between the two?

I'm just looking to pop my XP1600 into a mobo, however, I don't know if I should pay the extra $$$ if there isn't going to be a noticable difference.
The only reason why I'm hesitant to get the K7S5A because it seems there are a lot of problems with it.

dpk

These two MBs are at the top of my list, too. So's Newegg. Don't they say great minds think alike?
It's apparant that both MBs support the CPU. From my perspective, and I haven't been looking at this with a magnifying glass, but what stands out is the ATA133 support of the MSI board. I just checked out the board at MSI and it does appear that it supports USB 2.0. Newegg's product description says USB 1.1, but I believe this is in error. Also, the MSI has 3 DIMM slots and the ECS board can only use two, either SDRAM or DDR, not both. Of course, that's only part of the story. I will watch this thread with interest and hopefully we'll get some more info.

 

[harbinger52]

the MSI board also supports DDR333

 

[DollarBill]

If you plan on overclocking, its the MSI. K7S5A is not noted as a good overclocking board.

For the $86.00 I'm going for the Ultra2.

My 2 cents worth.

 

[Muse]

Originally posted by: harbinger52
the MSI board also supports DDR333

Is that the PC2700? Pretty expensive, though. Why would you want to pay that much? Is it worth it? I just read a post from someone in this forum saying that the ECS K7S5A board won't work with a PCI video card. That may rule it out for me since, for the time being I'd like to use my Matrox Millenium 4 MB PCI card.

 

[Buz2b]

the ECS K7S5A board won't work with a PCI video card

Not true. I have done this with that board a couple of times. In fact, using a PCI video card used to be a "troubleshooting technique" when having problems with an AGP card a while back. So, don't let this hold you back.
Keep in mind (as I think you know) that the K7S5A is not an "a$$ kicking" overclocking board. Yes, you can do some limited overclocking if you use one of the "altered" BIOS files that can be found on the OC Workbench ECS Forum These BIOS files are well used and tested by actual users of this board and perfectly safe to use. Keep in mind that using such a BIOS could render your warranty invalid as far as ECS is concerned though. However, they do give you some limited options not found in the "regular" BIOS files. I was able (in a current build of a system for my nephew) to overclock a Duron 950 to 1200 (1.2 GHz). Not too bad really.

hesitant to get the K7S5A because it seems there are a lot of problems with it.

I would encourage you to read more on this board at the site I linked to earlier. There is an excellent FAQ there and some pretty knowledgable users. A vast majority of the "problems" that surface are because folks get in the "I'm going to build a really cheap system mode and cut corners on some components; not the least of which is the power supply. If this is what you are thinking, then I would respectively suggest you DON'T get the ECS board. Spend the extra $30 for the MSI board because you will be happier in the long run. But, if you want a good "basic", reasonably fast system, with good room to expand then the ECS board is a good one. I've built many systems with this board and the only problems I've had were the ones I caused. Now, before anyone even thinks of "flaming" me for suggesting that they only had problems with this board because it was their fault; I am NOT suggesting that. I am only speaking from my own experience with this board and from those I have discussed on this forum and the other I mentioned.
Good luck with your choice.

 

[tart666]

I had the K7S5A board. For about two weeks. Then it died, lost the BIOS completely, would not boot. So I RMA'd it (thanks to nice people at newegg) The board that came back was rev.4 instead of rev.1, with the higher ZP resistor. Would not run at 133FSB at all. RMA'd again (! got full refund, nice people at newegg)

Now, consider this: crucial memory, ATI video, Athlon 1400C retail, not your "cutting corners" components. 300W PS, NEVER had a PS problem with ANY other motherboards I have seen. The ocworkbench moderator BANNED ME for suggesting it was NOT the power supply. All of my postings were deleted. I think he has a hard on for ECS, or he has stock in it, or something. That's why the remaining messages seem to point to PSU's.

Btw, if you read their forums, you will notice the company threatened to sue people who make posts suggesting it's a board problem. THink if this: that is the ONLY tech support you will get from them. Believe, I tried. calling/email absolutely useless.

Conclusion (out of 10)
ECS: negative 20
newegg: +20

my 2  ¢

T

 

[xenolith]

No brainer, the MSI Utra2. Among other things including those mentioned earlier, the KT333 chipset has a much better memory controller which equates to much better performance even with slower PC2100 memory. And yes, PC2700 is "worth it" with this mobo, IMO.

BTW, Muse, your using a 4MB PCI video card? You're just asking for touble with that thing. A 64MB Geforce2 or Geforce4 MX is only around fifty bucks these days. LOL

 

[harbinger52]

PC2700 is worth it.

I say go with the KT3 ultra2. Should last a little while longer as far as upgrades go.

 

[DongTran]

BTW, Muse, your using a 4MB PCI video card? You're just asking for touble with that thing. A 64MB Geforce2 or Geforce4 MX is only around fifty bucks these days. LOL

Some people won't respond lightly to that. My roommate says stfu! He's broke as a joke....

 

[Muse]

Originally posted by: DongTran

BTW, Muse, your using a 4MB PCI video card? You're just asking for touble with that thing. A 64MB Geforce2 or Geforce4 MX is only around fifty bucks these days. LOL

Some people won't respond lightly to that. My roommate says stfu! He's broke as a joke....

I'm not broke, but at the moment I want to rebuild my 2nd system for good support for on-the-fly MP3 recording of stereo line-in analog sound. Right now the box produces crackling and can't do on the fly at even my modest sampling rates: AT, Tyan Tomcat 1 Rev. 4 MB, Cyrix P166+, 64 MB 60 ns. I've been troubleshooting the crackling but may just buy an ATX case, MB, RAM and CPU and if the onboard audio sucks (I expect this), a Turtle Beach Santa Cruz. The system currently has the MGA 4MB Millenium PCI card and I'm using my 1st monitor, VGA 14" monochrome. Don't laugh, that sucker is many times as sharp as color monitors from that day and probably sharper than most any CRT produced even today. B&W is just easier to converge. So, you see, I don't need a fancy video card for the time being. If I get a better monitor for my main system I suppose my 17" Nanao will be the one I use for my 2nd system. I am using an MSI geforce2 Pro 64 MB DDR videocard on my main system, but don't see the point in upgrading the 2nd system just yet... that is as long as it will support the older components.

 

[tritium4ever]

I upgraded from a K7S5A to a KT3-Ultra2 about a week ago and I've nothing but positive experiences (for both boards, actually). Running an Athlon XP 1700+ and 512MB of generic PC2100, I noticed a speed increase of slightly under 10%. I should be getting some PC2700 soon so I can take advantage of the KT333 chipset.

 

[hungrygoose]

keep in mind that the reason you may say more problems with this board(K7S5A) than others is due to the popularity in wide useage of the board.....i have used 6 of these, including the one in my main system.....the only problem i had was i recieved one with a dead floppy disk controller........RMA'd and everything was fine......i get about 8600 3dmarks now with a xp 1700+ and a 128 mb gainward geforce 4 ti4200 and 256mb crucial pc 2100 ddr.....very pleased to say the least.....rock solid also using a 300w antec ps

 

[VTrider]

Well, a few months ago I wouldn't touch a K7S5A (I have lots of experience with ECS motherboards), but I finally decided to jump right in the middle of this ECS party. I recently picked up a K7S5A as a temp. board until I figure out which KT333 board. I thought, well I'll see for myself I guess what all the whining is about. I couldn't be happier with the thing, for the money and performance....it rocks. I think everyone should buy one of these boards!

I would have to recommend the MSI though if your looking for a pretty much sure-bet, great performing , featured platform for your little XP1600. I mean sure, my K7S5A is fun and if you just want a really inexpensive, good performing Socket-A board w/no frills the get it too. I believe I have a revision 3 model, and I feel as though ECS has ironed out some of the bugs since the early release of this motherboard. Many of those 'problems' are/were legite hardware based, but a good % I believe were caused by...well I don't want to get flamed here, just caused by other 'overlooked' reasons.

One thing however I must point out about my K7S5A is that I experience this 'cold boot' stall syndrome about 25% of the time. It's been documented w/this board before. I'm running an Antec 430watt Truepower P.S so I doubt that's the culprit. I wouldn't be suprised if ECS just skimped out on capacitors on this board? (less capacitors, low quality = don't hold enough charge, quick enough to follow through with post/boot? Hmmm?).

-VTrider

 

[Muse]

Originally posted by: xenolith
No brainer, the MSI Utra2. Among other things including those mentioned earlier, the KT333 chipset has a much better memory controller which equates to much better performance even with slower PC2100 memory. And yes, PC2700 is "worth it" with this mobo, IMO.

BTW, Muse, your using a 4MB PCI video card? You're just asking for touble with that thing. A 64MB Geforce2 or Geforce4 MX is only around fifty bucks these days. LOL

I read informationin the MSI MB newsgroup saying these boards aren't a good match with PC2700. OK with PC2100 or PC3000. I quote from a post in this NG from8/20/02:

Mushkin uses the KT3 Ultra to represent VIA KT333 chipsets. I am using a
Mushkin PC2100 module in my KT3 Ultra-ARU with excellent results. The
suggest not using PC2700 but instead PC2100 or PC3000 due to issues with
the board. Here is the quote from their web site:
******
MSI KT3: VIA KT-KT333 chipset (VIA website)
The MSI KT3-Ultra as representative mainboard for the VIA KT333 chipset
has been qualified as 100 % compatible with Mushkin Level22 PC2100 and
PC3000 and higher DDR DIMMs.

USER TIPS: The MSI KT3-Ultra uses an AMI BIOS, which, in some cases does
not properly read the memory SPD. In addition, the KT3 is somewhat
capricious regarding memory. We do not recommend the use of 256MB PC2700
and 512MB PC2700 with this particular board. We further recommend using
the default settings and to manually adjust the latency settings in the
CMOS setup for optimal performance. At 157 MHz FSB, the board switches to
a 1/5 PCI divider but only if the frequency is set high enough in the CMOS
setup.

RECOMMENDED DIMMS:
512Mb Level 2
256Mb PC3000
256MB PC3200

 

[VTrider]

Wow, I've never heard a compatibility problem between the MSI KT3-Ultra and PC2700 DDR before? That's a suprise for me!

-VTrider

 

[SunnyD]

I personally wouldn't get either.

I've had an ECS K7S5A... biggest pain in the ass I ever had. And yes, I did read the faqs, the message boards, documentation, and yes, I had it running, but the damn thing is so finnikey it's just not worth it - you get what you pay for.

As far as the MSI board goes, it's not a gripe against that particular board (though I've heard a few really bad stories about it too), but MSI in general. First, customer service isn't a toll free call. Be forewarned. Expect a couple hours on hold. With that aside, I ordered a K7N415D-Pro from Newegg, it was intermittantly working for a period of 2 months, and finally gave up the ghost in the end. So I RMA'd the board. 2 weeks later, I give a call to find out what the status is on the RMA. The response I got was that the board was tested good, and would be returned to me - the original board - after I had tested and retested and swapped out every single part right down to the CPU multiple times (and all the parts are currently working in other machines flawlessly). Well, another two weeks passed before my board was even shipped to me, and in the end, it wasn't even the motherboard I shipped out (the one they said they would return). I had a different board, a different serial number, and a really really unexplainable time of it. On top of that, I ended up selling the returned board on FS/FT out here, and it turns out that board is defective too. MSI sucks.

My suggestion - get a Shuttle AK35GT2/GT2R. You won't be disappointed.

 

[joe4324]

I dont know what you were doing with it sunnyd but my K7S5A's have eating everything I can throw at them. right now I'm using Generic DDR and a Sblive. my cheap DDR dont work my Nforce and my soundcard pukes my KT133a board.

Maybe you were doing something crazy with it but I've built 20+ systems out of this board and have had virtually NO trouble with it. I just threw away about 14 ECS boxes last week because they were cluttering up my closet. I should of took a picture of it

back to the point, get the MSI if you want to do ANYTHING besides toss a system together and forget about it. the k7s5a is a wonderful board. I even OC mine but it doesnt make it easy

 

[lobe]

If you plan to keep the motherboard for a couple of years, it is worth the extra $30 to get the MSI KT3 Ultra2. If you are the kind of person who has to monkey around and change motherboards a lot, just get the ECS k7s5a board for now and play with that until you are bored.

I have an ECS K7S5A board that installed completely great and has run without any problems whatsoever-with a duron 950 first, and now an Athlon XP 1700+. This is with an enlight 250W power supply. I never used the onboard sound though, used an sb live value-$20 card now.

 

[Muse]

Originally posted by: VTrider
Wow, I've never heard a compatibility problem between the MSI KT3-Ultra and PC2700 DDR before? That's a suprise for me!

-VTrider

Here's the page, see for yourself, half way down.

 

[worm]

I have been looking at a similar decision, but ECS K7S5A - MSI KT3 Ultra2 - $79, GA-7VRX - $80, ABIT KR7A-133R refurb - $60. I went to Fry's and they had the MSI K7T266Pro2 - A and 2000+ combo for $140 so I picked it up. I have been reading reviews on the MSI (AMI BIOS, etc.), obviously a different model, and may return it and buy from Newegg. I really did not care that it was a 2000+ versus a slower version. In fact I thought I would choose a retail version so I would not have to figure out the fan. I will be watching you thread looking for tips.

Thanks,

John