E6600 OC Report -> Now E6700

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
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8/19/06: After some communication with a person in-the-know (easy guess :D), it's now quite obvious that there are problems with current motherboards, when dealing with 4MB Conroe chips. Basically if you want to go past 360~370FSB with this board, you will have to run FSB;Memory=1:1 or leave memory at "Auto". After that, the next wall will be either 400FSB (4MB L2 Chips) or 420~430FSB (2MB L2 Chips). The problem I had with the E6600 was its extreme inconsistency, which I have no explanation for.

So at this (still) early stage of Core 2 Duo overclocking:

1. Go with E6400/E6300 with a decent P965 board. This is the best possible scenario, really.
3. Foreget about E6600
4. If you're dying to get 3.6GHz, you can either 1) Get an E6300/E6400 and OC the hell out of it, or 2) Get an E6700. I'm beginning to believe Intel actually bins E6700s from E6600s.
5. For No.4-1) You'll need a P965 board such as DS3, P5B-Deluxe, etc. For No.4-2) I'd say the P5W-DH is still the best bet.

I will try to answer as many questions as possible within my knowledge. I know many people are very frustrated over something that shoulodn't be frustrating.


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8/18/06: I've gotten rid of the E6600. Before I started building this rig my goal was 3.6GHz with an E6600. While the goal was achieved I couldn't stand the high Vcore and accompanying heat/instability. (ASUS board didn't help. Boy, do I miss my DFI!) Now I have an E6700 and it's doing so much better. (3.6GHz @1.47V set in BIOS, drops to 1.45 under load measured via Everest) Intel must be doing a very good job binning these chips (4MB L2 cache chips) at this early stage of production. My sincere apologies for people who requested benches of their interest. Will do the runs as soon as I can.

Currently stable and probably would-be my 24/7 setting (Until ASUS let me choose the God damn multies):

E6700 @3.6GHz (1.47V)
P5W-DH @360FSB (FSB:RAM=4:5) / BIOS 1101
DDR2-900 / 3-4-4-9 (2.2V)
Max Temp 64~66C (read via CoreTemp)

*All voltages are selected values in the BIOS.

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Max Frequency w/ Stock (Auto) Vcore: 3.06GHz (9x340)
Max Frequency under Air-Cooling: 3.60GHz (9x400, 1.575V set in BIOS)

Vcore is way too high for my liking. Load temp 62~64C.

Test Setup

E6600 (OEM) (3.60GHz)
P5W-DH (BIOS 0801)
Xtreem DDR2-667 1GB x 2 (400MHz / 3-3-3)
Loaner 7950GX2 :D (550/700)
Thermalright Ultra-120 w/ Panaflo Medium

3DMark06: 10274 (very very close to my Opteron 165 SLI result)
3DMark05: 18435
Cinebench: X CPU 19 secs
PCMark05: 9008
Number Crunching: 32M

More benches to come. While I'm happy for 3.6GHz, the OC'ing capability of these 4MB cache chips is somewhat below the expectation. Especially compared with this.

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Below are MY findings that help with overclocking on P5W-DH. Please note that a setting that works on my system doesn't guarrantee the same effect on your system.

- For high FSB, disable HyperPath 3.
- Usually you will have to run memory at 1:1 for high FSB (>360), even though your memory can clock higher itself.
- If you have a power-hungry GPU (i.e. 7950GX2, X1900XTX), try setting "Slot Power" to "Heavy" in the BIOS.
- You can set the chipset/memory voltages to max for testing purposes. Also, it seems like everything screems for more voltages as FSB goes up. For instance, I only needed 2.1V for 800MHz (3-3-3) memory @266FSB, but @400FSB, I had to set the VDIMM @2.3V for the same frequency. Beats me.
- The rectangular'ed areas in this pic get extremely hot while OC'ing. Memsinks/active cooling wouldn't hurt.
- vFSB and vICH does little to nothing for OC'ing
- Enhanced C1 State, Intel SpeedStep, when set to "Auto", will disallow Vcore change.
 

Henny

Senior member
Nov 22, 2001
674
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Originally posted by: Nightmare225
Nice, mines shipping from them too. Tracking number is XXXXXX
on Fedex.com! I'm so happy :D

You should not show your tracking number on a public forum!! I would delete it ASAP.
 

Skott

Diamond Member
Oct 4, 2005
5,730
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The current mobos are a bottleneck I think. If we get better mobos you should get closer to the 4GHz mark.
 

soydios

Platinum Member
Mar 12, 2006
2,708
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/agree Skott
AFAIK, 400MHz is the most you can definitely get out of the P5W-DH. Some people get more (the AnandTech review got 430-440MHz), but it depends. Low multipliers FTL. :'(
 

gramboh

Platinum Member
May 3, 2003
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Hmm sucks you had to use that much voltage. Default is 1.4 right? I was hoping the 6600 would get 3.4-3.6 with less voltage on a XP-120 as that is what I am thinking of buying. I want the 4MB cache.
 

Pabster

Lifer
Apr 15, 2001
16,986
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Originally posted by: Kwint Sommer
1.2GHz OC isn't as good as the ES did but it is still a very nice OC.

I should say so. 3.6GHz with the 4MB L2 cache is very close to 4GHz with only the 2MB cache.
And not many are getting that out of their 6300/6400.
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
22,384
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That's not necessarily correct, Pabster. While the extra cache gives the E6600 an edge, Conroe also gains a performance boost from running at a higher FSB. For example:

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2795&p=6

I estimate that an E6300 at 4 ghz would out-perform an E6600 at 4 ghz simply due to the difference in FSB and memory speeds. However, getting an E6300 to 4 ghz would be quite a difficult task.

In either case, the ideal setup would be an E6800 at 4 ghz using 7x571 for the extra cache and extra FSB speed.
 

Duvie

Elite Member
Feb 5, 2001
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Good to see the cinebench score....It helps to prove my hypothesis on how it will relate to my quad boxes...Running with 1.8ghz cores (my 265 opties) OC'd to 2.5ghz but with ram wayyylow (353ddr) (still testing so I haven't tweaked the memory) I get 1180's for mutlicpus...I bet I get the ram scores up I will hit 1200 and then the idea I had it will take close to 3.8-4ghz of conroe to equal it will be approximately correct......
 

Pabster

Lifer
Apr 15, 2001
16,986
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Originally posted by: DrMrLordX
However, getting an E6300 to 4 ghz would be quite a difficult task.

...Which was my point.

In either case, the ideal setup would be an E6800 at 4 ghz using 7x571 for the extra cache and extra FSB speed.

Yeah, if you want to drop $1200 for an X6800. And good luck finding a board that'll do 571 FSB.
 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
13,310
687
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PCMark05 score added.
3DMark05 score updated.

I'm thinking of doing comparison of performance/L2 cache since I have an E6300 at my disposal. 2.8GHz 2MB L2 vs 2.8GHz 4MB L2. The board doesn't let me choose lower multies, but I learned that it's possible via CrystalCPUID.
 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
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Originally posted by: gramboh
Hmm sucks you had to use that much voltage. Default is 1.4 right? I was hoping the 6600 would get 3.4-3.6 with less voltage on a XP-120 as that is what I am thinking of buying. I want the 4MB cache.

And that is with the new King-of-the-Hill HSF, Ultra-120. I'm afraid the XP-120 won't be able to cut it if you have to raise Vcore this much. With added Vcore and heat, you get the same impression of Toledo vs Manchester. These 4MB L2 cache CPUs are heavy weighters, and it feels like I'm dragging the frequency up. On the other hand, the E6300 seemed to be jumping up as I push it slightly.
 

myocardia

Diamond Member
Jun 21, 2003
9,291
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Originally posted by: lopri

And that is with the new King-of-the-Hill HSF, Ultra-120.
That Thermalright Ultra 120 is far from being the best heatsink around. Don't be posting FUD like that, some people don't know any better. Best heatsinks: (1)Tuniq Tower (1)Scythe Ninja (3)Zalman 9500 are definitely the top three at the moment.

edit: Oops, I forgot the Thermaltake Big Typhoon, which is better than a Zalman 9500.
 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
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Tuniq 120 and Ultra 120 are comparable from my experience. Unfortunately the Tuniq won't be available anytime soon. (Unless you have one already, like I do. ;) ) I've heard their factory caught fire or something :D and it'll take time for them to resume production. But compared to Ninja and Zalman, I'd have to give it to the Ultra-120. It's really not a big deal either way, since these top-line HSF will be within 3~5C of one another. Lowering ambient temp will probably be more productive when it comes to OC'ing. Still my point stands that you will need some serious cooling if you want/need to crank the Vcore up to 1.575V.
 

Skeeedunt

Platinum Member
Oct 7, 2005
2,777
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Thanks for the post, interesting to see how these are holding up.

Could the motherboard really be the OC bottleneck, if the the vcore had to be raised that much already?
 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
13,310
687
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Originally posted by: Pabster
Yeah, if you want to drop $1200 for an X6800. And good luck finding a board that'll do 571 FSB.
You forgot to add DDR2-1140 memory in your comment. :laugh:


 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
13,310
687
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Originally posted by: Skeeedunt
Thanks for the post, interesting to see how these are holding up.

Could the motherboard really be the OC bottleneck, if the the vcore had to be raised that much already?

I'm going to dig in and find out who's responsible, but for now it seems to be the CPU. I say this because the frequencies respond to voltages quite well, to certain extent. But this is just a hypathesis for now. Tomorrow I will do some in-dept testing. :laugh:
 

myocardia

Diamond Member
Jun 21, 2003
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Originally posted by: lopri
Tuniq 120 and Ultra 120 are comparable from my experience. Unfortunately the Tuniq won't be available anytime soon. (Unless you have one already, like I do. ;) ) I've heard their factory caught fire or something :D and it'll take time for them to resume production. But compared to Ninja and Zalman, I'd have to give it to the Ultra-120. It's really not a big deal either way, since these top-line HSF will be within 3~5C of one another. Lowering ambient temp will probably be more productive when it comes to OC'ing. Still my point stands that you will need some serious cooling if you want/need to crank the Vcore up to 1.575V.
You've obviously never read a heatsink review: links to every heatsink review ever done, it seems. Here's a direct comparison between the Scythe Ninja, Zalman 9500, and TT Big Typhoon, done at Anandtech: link

edit: Wow, after going through enough of those reviews, I finally found what all of us are looking for: Tuniq Tower 120, Scythe Ninja, Zalman 9500, and TT Big Typhoon against one another. It seems that I wasn't giving the Tuniq Tower enough credit (though it can't be bought at the moment, like you said), and was giving the Big Typhoon too much credit. Well, you learn something new everyday (hopefully :D).
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
22,384
12,195
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Originally posted by: Pabster

And good luck finding a board that'll do 571 FSB.

That's what the upcoming ATI chipset (R600 I think?) is for . . . supposedly it's hitting 550 mhz FSB in testing already.
 

bunnyfubbles

Lifer
Sep 3, 2001
12,248
3
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Originally posted by: Skott
The current mobos are a bottleneck I think. If we get better mobos you should get closer to the 4GHz mark.

I'm thinking thats gonna be bs, the chipset should require more voltage to get the system stable when approaching higher FSB, not the CPU.
 

Some1ne

Senior member
Apr 21, 2005
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Is the stepping on the OEM chip the same as that on the retail ones (I think the retail box chips are stepping 'B')?
 

lopri

Elite Member
Jul 27, 2002
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Added a SuperPI 32M result.
Added some P5W-DH tips that worked for me.
 

CowboyFarmer

Member
Nov 24, 2002
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Thanks lopri for publishing the data. This will definitely help me when my parts are here next week. Appriciate your effort for sharing your findings.