DX11 Market Steam Hardware Survey - AMD maintains 80% of the DX11 Market

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Lonbjerg

Diamond Member
Dec 6, 2009
4,419
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He doesn't seem to know. :eek:

Ever since his posts in a physx thread claiming he was running Mafia 2 on high with high physx on a GTX 285 at 1920x1200 with smooth framerates and then another thread were he was praising the almighty tessellator of Fermi and how we would all be going forward with such technology but he doesn't even own a DX11 card himself.

After those two blunders I started writing off his posts/opinions for what they clearly are.

I was using a GTX285 as GPU and a 9800GT as PhysX GPU at the time..at 1600x1200 (LED's are for colorblind people)
(Prove me wrong by linking to that post...I dare you)

Since then I got a $2000 bonus from work...and hardware have changed...i don't list my rig, but I can tells you that I also have 12 GB of RAM...and uses most of it daily.
Didn't that help the topic?
Was that relevant?

Funny how Ad Hominem are the trademark of the AMD camp these days...

But have you guys (AMD camp) decided amongst yourself if Steam is "valid" or not yet? :)
 

Skurge

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2009
5,195
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We are not talking about the entire graphics market.
If we where the numbers would be something like 50% Intel (IGP's).

But we are talking about gaming GPU's
Bought by gamers.
DX11 GPU's are irrelanvt to all others than gamers.
And the large sample size makes it darn accurate.
A point you still avoid to answer..says it all dosn't it?

Trust me, there are tons of people in other parts of that world that don't use steam. They are still gamers. I know a lot of people who don't have gaming cards, but use steam. My friends mom would be one. All she plays is Peggle and Plants vs Zombies.
 

TemjinGold

Diamond Member
Dec 16, 2006
3,050
65
91
I think the issue with representation here is that DX11 gpus =! gaming gpus. There are loads of people who own HTPC cards that are still considered DX11 gpus but are too weak to play any such games. The folks are numerous and would not be on steam as they don't game. Hence, the sample is not representative.
 

Lonyo

Lifer
Aug 10, 2002
21,938
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I think the issue with representation here is that DX11 gpus =! gaming gpus. There are loads of people who own HTPC cards that are still considered DX11 gpus but are too weak to play any such games. The folks are numerous and would not be on steam as they don't game. Hence, the sample is not representative.

Uh Steam is representative.
It's completely logical.
GTX580 = DX11 card (known fact)
GTX580 users = gamers (see post #118)
Steam users = gamers (#112)
Lots of people 'use' Steam (15 million+ accounts)
Therefore DX11 card users = gamers = Steam users
So Steam is representative of DX11 users because lots of people use it. (#123)
 
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kevinsbane

Senior member
Jun 16, 2010
694
0
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But have you guys (AMD camp) decided amongst yourself if Steam is "valid" or not yet? :)

I don't get it. Whether or not the Steam survey is valid (representative of video cards, or gamers, whatever) or not... why does it matter? What does just knowing market share and market share changes tell us? Without any other info, it doesn't tell us much except that the marketshare that NVIDIA has increased due to *some factors.

*These factors may or may not include:
1. NVidia selling more cards than AMD
2. NVidia selling less cards than AMD
3. Nvidia selling the exact same number of cards as AMD
4. Nvidia selling cards while AMD cards have disappeared
5. both AMD and NVidia selling fewer cards than were thrown away
6. Nvidia selling cards while AMD sold nothing
7. Nvidia selling no cards while AMD cards were thrown away
8. etc.

I mean, I can see the point in arguing which ones of these took place, but you can't use the steam survey itself to back up your point.
 

TemjinGold

Diamond Member
Dec 16, 2006
3,050
65
91
Uh Steam is representative.
It's completely logical.
GTX580 = DX11 card (known fact)
GTX580 users = gamers (see post #118)
Steam users = gamers (#112)
Lots of people 'use' Steam (15 million+ accounts)
Therefore DX11 card users = gamers = Steam users
So Steam is representative of DX11 users because lots of people use it. (#123)

Your logic does not hold. GTX580 may equal DX11 card but the reverse is not true and that's critical to your argument.
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
561
126
Your logic does not hold. GTX580 may equal DX11 card but the reverse is not true and that's critical to your argument.

You should follow the bread crumbs. Lonyo doesn't disagree with. But you just disagreed with someone else. :)

Kudos Lonyo, I see what you did there.
 

Grooveriding

Diamond Member
Dec 25, 2008
9,110
1,260
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I was using a GTX285 as GPU and a 9800GT as PhysX GPU at the time..at 1600x1200 (LED's are for colorblind people)
(Prove me wrong by linking to that post...I dare you)

Since then I got a $2000 bonus from work...and hardware have changed...i don't list my rig, but I can tells you that I also have 12 GB of RAM...and uses most of it daily.
Didn't that help the topic?
Was that relevant?

Funny how Ad Hominem are the trademark of the AMD camp these days...

But have you guys (AMD camp) decided amongst yourself if Steam is "valid" or not yet? :)

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30514750&postcount=127

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30514841&postcount=129

No mention anywhere of using an additional gpu for physx.

Again, you were making bogus claims for nv hardware that do not match reality. Unless playable is chugging along in your book.

http://www.techspot.com/review/312-mafia2-performance/page7.html

GTX 285 score = 30fps, even if you do a 460+285 = 37fps

Case closed.


I won't waste any more time on a back and forth with you, maybe if every post you made was not so skewed it would be worth having a discussion with you, unfortunately that's not the case and I care about what I get out of my hardware far more than who manufactured it.
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
31,413
9,307
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You should follow the bread crumbs. Lonyo doesn't disagree with. But you just disagreed with someone else. :)

Kudos Lonyo, I see what you did there.

I just scanned through the last couple of pages of this thread and its not surprising people are getting confused.:\

I've no idea what this thread is about any more, if someone wants to summarise it leaving out the ego stuff I'd be grateful.
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
561
126
I just scanned through the last couple of pages of this thread and its not surprising people are getting confused.:\

I've no idea what this thread is about any more, if someone wants to summarise it leaving out the ego stuff I'd be grateful.

Well, in a nutshell:

"NVIDIA is outselling AMD!"
*insert middle school math lesson*
"Steam surveys are useless!"

Couldn't have said it best, unless I drew something. haha.
 

taltamir

Lifer
Mar 21, 2004
13,576
6
76
Every single survey out there would love to have a base of +100.000 participants.

You know how many people are asked in a eg. Gallup poll?
~1.000 people.

Read up on polls, sample sizes and accuracy:

but if gallop was to, say, only poll new yorkers they will get very inaccurate results.
The question isn't whether or not this is an extremely accurate representation of the steam community. The question is whether steam accurately represent gamers at large.
Would you say new yorkers accurately represent the USA as a whole?
 

dust

Golden Member
Oct 13, 2008
1,328
2
71
So all the gamers have at least one Steam game is that right?

Ever heard of Myth or Razor?

It may be ten times as much gamers that own those games and never had to go through Steam. To think Steam survey is representative of anything is childish.
 

taltamir

Lifer
Mar 21, 2004
13,576
6
76
So all the gamers have at least one Steam game is that right?

Ever heard of Myth or Razor?

It may be ten times as much gamers that own those games and never had to go through Steam. To think Steam survey is representative of anything is childish.

this is going way too far the other way... to think steam survey represents everything is misguided. But that doesn't mean it doesn't represent anything

I am sorry but what are those? :confused:

the worst point and click inventory puzzle games ever made... the worst because they have the worst moon logic of any game in the genre.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MoonLogicPuzzle
 
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Lonyo

Lifer
Aug 10, 2002
21,938
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So all the gamers have at least one Steam game is that right?

Ever heard of Myth or Razor?

It may be ten times as much gamers that own those games and never had to go through Steam. To think Steam survey is representative of anything is childish.

Even more sensibly, talk about World of Warcraft.
Last time I saw numbers, Steam had 15 million accounts (personally I have 3, for reasons not relevant).
WoW has what, 12 million accounts? That's almost the same size but none of those players require Steam (and it's a modern game, with reasonable system requirements probably at least equal to some of the most popular Steam games, e.g. Counterstrike Source with the expansions).
Steam represents Steam users, but not World of Warcraft users, who are presumably also gamers.
 

Lonbjerg

Diamond Member
Dec 6, 2009
4,419
0
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http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30514750&postcount=127

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30514841&postcount=129

No mention anywhere of using an additional gpu for physx.

Again, you were making bogus claims for nv hardware that do not match reality. Unless playable is chugging along in your book.

http://www.techspot.com/review/312-mafia2-performance/page7.html

GTX 285 score = 30fps, even if you do a 460+285 = 37fps

Case closed.


I won't waste any more time on a back and forth with you, maybe if every post you made was not so skewed it would be worth having a discussion with you, unfortunately that's not the case and I care about what I get out of my hardware far more than who manufactured it.

You forget this post:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30485167&postcount=189

I'll make a FRAPS tomorrow(affter putting the cards back in)...right now sex with the GF has priority...
 

SirPauly

Diamond Member
Apr 28, 2009
5,187
1
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I appreciate the data offered by Steam or anything really -- data is data. But, tend to look at numbers like Mercury Research or Jon Peddie a bit more closer. Another one is revenue, profit and margins but data is data.

When I look at Steam, it shows to me how important execution is. It simply takes time to combat the months and months AMD enjoyed as the only DirectX 11 player in town and by offering a pretty balanced and compelling choice.
 

NoQuarter

Golden Member
Jan 1, 2001
1,006
0
76
I just cant believe an avid pc gamer would not have any games like HL 2, TF 2, Portal, L4D or others. and some games such as Metro 2033, FEAR 2, Mafia 2 and Just Cause 2 require Steam even if they are not made by Valve.

We need Blizzard's + Steam's, most people I know that play WoW don't use Steam. I did convince a few of them to set up Steam last week to buy L4D2 for $5 though.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Even more sensibly, talk about World of Warcraft.
Last time I saw numbers, Steam had 15 million accounts (personally I have 3, for reasons not relevant).
WoW has what, 12 million accounts? That's almost the same size but none of those players require Steam (and it's a modern game, with reasonable system requirements probably at least equal to some of the most popular Steam games, e.g. Counterstrike Source with the expansions).
Steam represents Steam users, but not World of Warcraft users, who are presumably also gamers.

I am sure manyof those WoW gamers also use Steam. I still think Steam is a pretty good representation of what the gaming market for discrete graphics looks like. The biggest indicator of this is Intel only representing ~6.5% of the userbase.
 

hdfxst

Senior member
May 13, 2009
851
3
81
When was the last time anyone here was asked to participate in the steam survey?I don't think steam automatically collects data from everyone,it's just a sample.The last time i was asked i was using a 6600gt agp card.
 

railven

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2010
6,604
561
126
We need Blizzard's + Steam's, most people I know that play WoW don't use Steam. I did convince a few of them to set up Steam last week to buy L4D2 for $5 though.

And yet on the other side of a similar coin: all my guild mates in WoW minus one have Steam. The one that doesn't have Steam doesn't play anything but WoW haha.
 

taltamir

Lifer
Mar 21, 2004
13,576
6
76
When was the last time anyone here was asked to participate in the steam survey?I don't think steam automatically collects data from everyone,it's just a sample.The last time i was asked i was using a 6600gt agp card.

I am pretty sure the EULA just grants them the right to automatically collect hardware data (they don't need and should not ever ask you what you have, their software can automatically determine exactly what hardware you have; they should ask permission to use their software to do that, which I think they do in the EULA)
 

HeXen

Diamond Member
Dec 13, 2009
7,828
37
91
i hate steam. i'm a retail box type of person, i miss the old huge pc game boxes though but i still prefer to collect the physical media.
 

toyota

Lifer
Apr 15, 2001
12,957
1
0
i hate steam. i'm a retail box type of person, i miss the old huge pc game boxes though but i still prefer to collect the physical media.
again many popular games have to be activated through Steam so whether you hate it or not has nothing to do with it.