Dusty Baker in an Interview today, again compares Hank Aaron to Babe Ruth.

[Cyberian]

It is hard to compare players accross generations, but you can say where they stood in respect to the other players around them.

I think this is the only way you can[/b] compare players.
Bob Cousy probably wouldn't even make the NBA now, but he was a dominant player and a Hall of Famer in his day.

 

[Goldfish]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold
so, your argument is, all those managers are LOONS for walking bonds, cause if they hadn't walked him, more than 63 percent of the time, he'd make an out. hmmm. let's see, he has i think 70 intentional walks this season. so the others are because he has such amazing plate discipline. so ur arguing that over those 70 intentional walks, if he'd been allowed to swing away, for some reason, he would hit below his average??

Intentional walks is an official stat for when the catcher gets out of his stance and the pitcher throws out of the zone. How many of Bonds walks were four pitch walks where he had nothing to swing at?

 

[Goldfish]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold
And your point is?? name one player who hasn't slowed down as he reached 40?? even Ricky Henderson wasn't as fast toward the end of his career as he was at the beginning and bonds was NEVER as fast as ricky. but bonds was never supposed to be either.

bonds fanboy?? so?? i thought that's what fans did, appreciate greatness.

Henderson didn't play every day as he reached 40 like Bonds does, did he?

 

[PlatinumGold]

goldfish,

what exactly is your point?? your last two posts are meaningless and say nothing whatsoever.

my point is, Bonds is having one of the Greatest offensive seasons in the history of baseball, now what does henderson not playing everyday at 40 have anything whatsoever to do with that. also, what relevance is the Intentional intentioal bb vs the non intentional intentional bb?? so what??

sheeesh.

 

[Goldfish]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold
my point is, Bonds is having one of the Greatest offensive seasons in the history of baseball, now what does henderson not playing everyday at 40 have anything whatsoever to do with that. also, what relevance is the Intentional intentioal bb vs the non intentional intentional bb?? so what??

sheeesh.

I thought your point was that Bonds is better than Ruth, Aaron, DiMaggio, Mantle, Teddy Ballgame, etc?

Sheesh. I'm done.

 

[Pretty Cool]

Racism? You have got to be kidding. If you are old enough to remember Aaron's 715th homer, you should have remembered that Dusty Baker came up with the Braves and was a teammate of Aaron. During that period, Aaron was approaching the record, while Baker was a rookie. Is it hard to believe that an impressionable youngster would admire a celebrated veteran who was about to break an "impossible" record? Frankly, almost all athletes will favor those who are contemporary to them and/or those who were teammates over players of a different generation. If Joe DiMaggio, Ted Williams, or whomever else would have been a teammate of Baker's, I am sure that person would have been mentioned instead.

 

[Yossarian]

Here is one statistical example of why Aaron cannot compare to Ruth:

In 1920 Babe Ruth hit 54 home runs. That is more HR than every other **TEAM** in the majors except Philadelphia (60).

Ruth changed the way the game was played, he made the long ball a major factor in a way it never had been before. Aaron hit a lot of homers for a long time but he didn't cause a fundamental change in hitting.

I will second the opinion that Goldfish makes no sense whatsoever

 

[bizmark]

I'm not really a baseball fan any more, but I think that you can only compare greatness across generations, by referring to one's greatness relative to one's generational peers.

The thing is, great athletes (and others, I guess) rise to meet their competition. When the competition increases in intensity (i.e. pitchers start throwing faster, yadda yadda yadda) then the batters must compensate by improving themselves. Sure Ruth never faced any great pitchers by modern standards, but maybe if he had, he would have lost some weight and gained some control and been just as good (relative to other players) now as he was then. He didn't have to do so back then, though, so he didn't. He could dominate the game while remaining a fatass.

Time results in better technologies, drugs, techniques, etc. that improve every aspect of a sport. Hell even something as simple as a new shoe technology could make a difference. But as long as it imparts that difference equally among all teams/players, there's really no difference made. Sure they can hit longer balls or run faster or whatever, but they can do so only in the face of stiffer competition from other teams and players.

 

[Bluefront]

You guys are leaving out at least one important fact about Ruth......he was a great pitcher before he changed positions and became an every-day player. The management decided he would be more valuable as a hitter. He had world series stats as a pitcher that lasted a long time.

Now who here in 2002 would leave Babe Ruth off his roster? Most sports people put Babe Ruth as the #1 baseball player of all time....without reservation, so do I. I saw everyone mentioned here play ball...except Ruth. Nobody comes close, when you take in all his many talents, and what he did for the game.

 

[fr]

Originally posted by: Pretty Cool
Racism? You have got to be kidding. If you are old enough to remember Aaron's 715th homer, you should have remembered that Dusty Baker came up with the Braves and was a teammate of Aaron. During that period, Aaron was approaching the record, while Baker was a rookie. Is it hard to believe that an impressionable youngster would admire a celebrated veteran who was about to break an "impossible" record? Frankly, almost all athletes will favor those who are contemporary to them and/or those who were teammates over players of a different generation. If Joe DiMaggio, Ted Williams, or whomever else would have been a teammate of Baker's, I am sure that person would have been mentioned instead.

I think Baker was standing on deck when Aaron hit that homer so he got a really good view of it (maybe this was a different homer).

 

[joe678]

Originally posted by: Cyberian

It is hard to compare players accross generations, but you can say where they stood in respect to the other players around them.

I think this is the only way you can compare players.
Bob Cousy probably wouldn't even make the NBA now, but he was a dominant player and a Hall of Famer in his day.

you cant compare ruth this way without taking in consideration that no blacks, hispanics, etc. were even allowed to play during ruths era. imagine how many HRs a guy like bonds or arod would have hit in that time. who knows how many or ruth's peers would not even have been good enough to be in the league had blacks were able to play... im not taking away anything from ruth, they would all face the same pitchers, etc. but i dont doubt there would be others up there near his numbers...

 

[JoeBaD]

Red Dork - "a fat ass like Ruth"

How friggin' ignorant are you to criticize Ruth like that.

Ruth was/is the best. He has numerous records that still have not been broken.

You can't compare athletes between generations. You can only compare them against their peers. And Ruth was awesome.
If he were alive today and was able to take benefit of today's conditioning, training, and, oh yes, steroids, he would be even more awesome.

Red, sometimes you're alright, and sometimes, like now, you speak out of your arse.

Oh, and don't tell me Bonds and Sosa (amoungst others) haven't had a little hormonal help.

 

[Red Dawn]

And Ruth was awesome.
If he were alive today and was able to take benefit of today's conditioning, training, and, oh yes, steroids, he would be even more awesome

But would he? He never met a fat laden sausage he could pass up. He'd probably be like John Kruk was.

 

[JoeBaD]

Red-

Ruth wasn't just a great hitter, he was also a great pitcher. He didn't pitch because the Yanks wanted him in the lineup every day.

Just think how good he would have been if he laid off the sausages!