Dual core vs Quad core & other hardware for general 3D work?

[plastick]

I am an average 3D hobbiest and I use Cinema 4D and some zBrush. Know that I am not super anal about getting every speck of power and efficiency from every piece of my system but I do want something much much better that can handle big scenes very well without slowing down, with good render speeds, etc. I currently use a single core Athlon 64 +3000 with 2 gigs of ram and a GeForce 7800GS which is just ok for what I do, but not really for intense scenes with over a thousand polygons, multiple textures and lights, etc.

So I was looking around and saw the Q6600 cpu and was wondering if something like that is good for 3D or not. I am assuming that a Quad core will be better than Dual just because it process more faster, but I dont know if there are any known problems/lack of performance with Quad CPUs. I am assuming that for current application coding reasons that C2Ds are just as good for now.

I'm also trying to find a good video card but I am not that clear on how a video card impacts 3D work, but I am assuming that something like an XFX8800GTX would be good enough.

I am looking to spend around $800 for an upgraded mobo/cpu/ram/video which should be enough, imo, for what I do. I already have a 500watt psu and hard drives.

So can anyone help me out to decide what I should consider getting for a good 3D desktop?

Thanks

 

[myocardia]

Originally posted by: plastick
So I was looking around and saw the Q6600 cpu and was wondering if something like that is good for 3D or not.

Well, since Cinema 4D is multithreaded, you'll get about 8x as much performance out of a Q6600 or Q6700, as you're getting from your current system.

I'm also trying to find a good video card but I am not that clear on how a video card impacts 3D work,

The speed of your video card only affects rendering speed, but, it's almost the only variable in rendering speed. In other words, if your video card is twice as fast, you'll get nearly two times the rendering speed.

but I am assuming that something like an XFX8800GTX would be good enough.

An 8800GTX is at least three times as fast as a 7800GS, so yeah, it would make a huge difference in render times.

edit: An 8800GTX won't render anywhere near as fast as a $400-500 workstation card, though, like a FireGL or Quadro.

 

[JonnyBlaze]

The video card only displays your models faster or slower and has NOTHING to do with rendering times.

 

[myocardia]

Originally posted by: JonnyBlaze
The video card only displays your models faster or slower and has NOTHING to do with rendering times.

What exactly did you think "render" meant? When it can take up to 30 minutes to draw that model, don't you think that drawing it faster would be an improvement?

 

[plastick]

myocardia: Rendering in a 3D application generally means to render the full scene or animation which is where everything is calculated to make the final picture. I do know what you mean though, but yeah, as Jonny said, the video card only handles the models in the view port (still important), but the CPU is the main thing that calculates everything in the scene. However, In video games (which is what background I am assuming you are from) the video card takes on a lot of the calculations, but there are a lot less of those than in a real beefy 3D scene.

 

[Modelworks]

Go with the quad core.
Cinema 4D will make full use of it in the renders.
I have noticed that cinema 4d does not use but two cores when running things in the viewports, animation preivews, physics calcs.
Not sure of the reason for this.
It does use 4 cores, or 8 cores in my case, when doing the final render.

A 8800GTX will work fine. Try to get one with the most memory on the card possible.
If you don't then when you rotate viewports , like with bodypaint, and your using large textures,
you can run into problems where the screen pauses as it rotates while textures are swapped to the card.

I actually use a 8800gts 640MB even though its slower than the 8800gts 512mb,
just for the extra texture storage space.
It has come in handy several times.

With an nvidia based card you can also take advantage of gelato.
Gelato came out from nvidia several years ago and at first wasn't too great.
But the latest version is really something to consider.
It uses the gpu on the graphics card with the host cpu to speed up render times.
http://www.nvidia.com/page/gz_home.html


If gelato keeps improving , I may just start building quad video card systems to do the rendering. It really is that much faster.

Example:
Scene with 8 cores, rendered in 2 min, 32 secs.
8 cores + Gelato , rendered in 1min , 48 secs.

I know some people will say that is only about 45 secs faster, no big deal.
But it is a big deal when your rendering 24fps and you have to do 2 minutes worth.
Gelato saved me 36 hours.

 

[Tempered81]

my suggestions:

cpu: q6600 or e8400 or e7200

mobo: P35 intel namebrand known well for overclocking

ram: pc1000 or 1066mhz for the dualcores | 800mhz for the quad

gpu: 8800gt512, 8800gts512 or 8800gtx 768

 

[plastick]

Modelworks: Thanks for the input. I was hoping that someone would suggest Quad core!!! Also, thanks for mentioning Gelato. I have wondered if such a program exists, and now I know that it does, and thats very cool! I will give it a try

jaredpace: Thanks for your input as well. I will look up info on that hardware. Also, I wondered if I should go with Intel or AMD. I have always used AMD, but I am willing to try Intel multi-cores if they are known to be better.

One more thing: I am not an overclocker

 

[myocardia]

Originally posted by: plastick
I have always used AMD, but I am willing to try Intel multi-cores if they are known to be better.

Definitely go with Intel this time. There's no comparison.

One more thing: I am not an overclocker

Then you should definitely spend slightly more for either a Q6700 or a Q9450, instead of the Q6600.

 

[plastick]

This probably isnt the right forum for this, but what also would be a good quality and stable power supply for a Quad core system?

 

[bryanW1995]

there are tons of good psu's that often go on sale. check out the hot deals section for good psu deals and then go to the psu forum to find out which one is the best value.

 

[myocardia]

I have two 610 watt PC Power & Cooling units that are awesome, but there are many good PSU's out there, like Bryan has already said. Just go with a good brand (PC P&C, Seasonic, Corsair, among others), rated for at least 500 watts, if you end up getting an 8800GTX.

 

[GuitarDaddy]

Gigabyte DS3L $90

Q9300 $285

Mushkin 2x2gb ddr2-800 $72 AR

EVGA 9600GT 1GB $215 AR

That totals $662 after rebates

For your $800 budget upgrade the CPU to Q9450 or X3350 if you can find one


*edit* NCIXUS has the X3350, kinda high at $381 but still within your $800 budget


Many would recommend the Q6600/Q6700 based on price, but IMO the added clockspeed, 45nm tech, runs cooler, saves energy is worth the price premium in the long run especially in cpu intense apps like rendering.

And the 45nm stuff overclocks so easily on low voltage it's a no brainer to clock up to 3-3.2ghz with no voltage increase

 

[plastick]

Thanks guitarDaddy

For PSU, I am currently using this Rosewill. Is it good enough or should I upgrade that as well for Quad core?

 

[GuitarDaddy]

The specs on the Rosewill PS are plenty to cover a quad and a mid-high GPU, but I have no experience with them as far as reliability and the reviews don't look too good there on the egg, but you know how that goes people with problems are more likely to post a review

 

[Tempered81]

how about this PSU?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817101033

 

[plastick]

Originally posted by: jaredpace
how about this PSU?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16817101033

How about NOT THAT PSU!

ROFL: "Cons: I plugged this in, and the entire block blacked out. Also, my computer exploded and set my chair alight."

 

[plastick]

Originally posted by: GuitarDaddy

EVGA 9600GT 1GB $215 AR

1GB of memory seems good especially for use in a 3D design application, but is this card pretty good otherwise? I also have my eye on this 8800GTS which looks like it would be a good card based on specs and reviews.

 

[myocardia]

Originally posted by: plastick
I also have my eye on this 8800GTS which looks like it would be a good card based on specs and reviews.

That card would be horrible for rendering. The more VRAM a card has, the better it will perform, although I'm willing to bet that an 8800GTX will outperform a 1GB 9600GT, because of it's increased shader power and memoory bandwidth. If you decide not to get an 8800GTX, you should seriously consider a 1GB 8800GT, which aren't very expensive.

 

[plastick]

thanks myocardia, I added the 8800GT to my wish list. Could I double them and use SLI?

 

[Modelworks]

SLI support does not work correctly if at all on 3d applications unless you are using the quadro specific drivers. It really isn't worth it to use SLI for applications as the gain really is next to nothing.

Multiple cards though can be used with Gelato .
They do not even have to be configured as SLI.

 

[plastick]

I want the SLI for gaming though

 

[myocardia]

Then you'll just have to disable SLI, while using Cinema 4D, then re-enable it for gaming. BTW, are you aware that having one fast video card (like an 8800GTX) is almost always better than having two slower ones SLI'd?