Dual AMD MP vs Dual Intel Xeon

[HumbleCaveman]

Hi all

I want to buy a new dual cpu computer. I would be used for serious video editing and graphics editing.
I seached the net but can't find anwhere a comparison between the AMD MP and the Xeon on that area...not even a general MV vs Xeon. The only review I saw was on this site but for SQL server :-(
Anybody that can help me out to make a good descision? I need a good explenation why you would recommend me for buying the latest dual Xeon or latest dual AMD.

Or maybe Anantech is going to try and do a general test on such a configuration in the near future?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Technonut]

Try 2cpu.com.

EDIT: BTW, welcome to the forums!

 

[dullard]

The MP and Xeon have the exact same core as their single processor counterparts. Thus all you have to do is look at the single processor benchmarks to get a good clue as to how the dual processor ones will perform.

There are lots of dual benchmarks floating around. The problem is that you often find articles from May 2001 when Intel released the 1.7 GHz Xeon. Finding more up to date articles can be time consuming. I tried to list some of them below. For some odd reason that I have yet to figure out, nearly all websites will compare the top AMD dual processor to the second best Intel dual processor (this has been going on for the last 18 months at least - if anyone knows why, I'd love to know).

Anandtech's database
Tomshardware
gamepc Xeon (each one has slightly different benchmarks, so I include all 3)
gamepc MP (each one has slightly different benchmarks, so I include all 3)
gamepc both (each one has slightly different benchmarks, so I include all 3)
AMD itself but be careful since AMD compares their top 2100+ to Intel's 3rd best the 2.0 GHz.

 

[Utterman]

For price and performance, AMD MP's give you both. The Xeon processors use just one bus for data to go through, while each Athlon MP has their own bus for data. This gives the MPs a really big adavantage in terms of performance. As for motherboards, I suggest ones made by Tyan for their stability.

 

[Sunner]

Originally posted by: dullard
The MP and Xeon have the exact same core as their single processor counterparts. Thus all you have to do is look at the single processor benchmarks to get a good clue as to how the dual processor ones will perform.

There are lots of dual benchmarks floating around. The problem is that you often find articles from May 2001 when Intel released the 1.7 GHz Xeon. Finding more up to date articles can be time consuming. I tried to list some of them below. For some odd reason that I have yet to figure out, nearly all websites will compare the top AMD dual processor to the second best Intel dual processor (this has been going on for the last 18 months at least - if anyone knows why, I'd love to know).

Anandtech's database
Tomshardware
gamepc Xeon (each one has slightly different benchmarks, so I include all 3)
gamepc MP (each one has slightly different benchmarks, so I include all 3)
gamepc both (each one has slightly different benchmarks, so I include all 3)
AMD itself but be careful since AMD compares their top 2100+ to Intel's 3rd best the 2.0 GHz.

Actually, the "new" .13 Xeon's have Hyperthreading, that is, Intel's fancy name for SMT.
SMT can increase performance quite a bit in some cases, Anand did an article about it a while ago, I seem to remember the performance increase was around 10-25% in most apps that were SMP aware.

If you the best performance and price isn't much of a problem, go Intel, they have the performance crown right now.
If you're looking for good price/performance, go AMD.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: Sunner

Actually, the "new" .13 Xeon's have Hyperthreading, that is, Intel's fancy name for SMT.
SMT can increase performance quite a bit in some cases, Anand did an article about it a while ago, I seem to remember the performance increase was around 10-25% in most apps that were SMP aware.

If you the best performance and price isn't much of a problem, go Intel, they have the performance crown right now.
If you're looking for good price/performance, go AMD.

Ok I was simplifying a bit, the P4 has it but it isn't yet enabled. However in all hyperthreading reviews I've read, about half of programs get a 10-20% boost and half get a 10-20% performance loss. So if asked a general question without any specific programs, we cannot know if hyperthreading will help or hurt. So basically I ignore it.

I didn't mention price in my post since HumbleCaveman didn't ask about it. The 2.2 GHz Xeon chip really isn't priced much more than the 2100+ MP ($277 vs. $216). So as far as the chips themselves are conserned there isn't much difference in price/performance. However there is a big difference in motherboard prices - a dual MP motherboard is as cheap as $160 while a dual Xeon motherboard is $375 minimum. Add in slightly higher memory for the Xeon and higher powersupply costs and you end up with dual Xeon computers costing $500 more than similar dual MP computers.

The Xeon will be moved to 533 MHz fsb and Intel will likely slash prices on the Xeons in September (they are slashing P4 prices on Sept. 1). The MP will move to the throughbred core (0.13 micron). So I were you, I'd wait 2 months to see what develops since both AMD and Intel should have significant changes in their chips. If you can't wait, then I think either the AMD or Intel chip will make you happy.

 

[dexvx]

The cheapest i860 boards (dual xeon RDram) goes for around $250, whereas the E7500 (dual xeon and dual channel DDR) goes for over $450. But you have to remember that the E7500 has features not found on either the i860 or 762 MPX. One of the most important server features, IMO, is PCI-X. A lot of high end server adapters are based around PCI-X, and PCI-X will eventually phase out PCI altogether. A lot of the mid-range Intel based Xeon MP (the "real" Xeon) servers dont even have PCI anymore, they are all PCI-X expansion slots.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: dexvx
The cheapest i860 boards (dual xeon RDram) goes for around $250

Which ones and where can I find them for $250? The prices I listed where the lowest on pricewatch, but pricewatch doesn't list everything. If there is a board for $250, then that changes the price dramatically.

 

[Sunner]

Well, regular AXP's can be run in SMP mode too, it's just isn't officially supported.
The unfortunate downside is that some dual mobo's dont support it, but some research can take care of that part.

Of course, that's only a good solution if you're somewhat sensitive to price, if you have money to burn, just go with a "true" rig with Athlon MP's, or Xeon's for that matter.

 

[imgod2u]

Originally posted by: Utterman
For price and performance, AMD MP's give you both. The Xeon processors use just one bus for data to go through, while each Athlon MP has their own bus for data. This gives the MPs a really big adavantage in terms of performance. As for motherboards, I suggest ones made by Tyan for their stability.

Is that true? As far as I'm aware, the Athlon's FSB is not capable of NUMA. Also, memory modules on most dual MP boards don't have to be installed in pairs. If the Athlon MP boards did have a dedicated channel for each processor then memory modules would need to be installed in pairs. I think you're mixing Athlon MP with the upcomming Hammer line, which is capable of NUMA and dedicated memory channels for each processor.

 

[HumbleCaveman]

Thanks all!!

I'm gonna wait a few months to see how the thoroughbread core is going. I hope it comes trough since my preference would be AMD although I always have had Intel's sofar.

C ya around

 

[AluminumStudios]

I would probably go with a dual Xeon because a lot of multimedia apps (especially ones like After Effects 5.5) are heavily SSE2 optimized. Even if a Xeon tends to be a bit slower in a given area than an Athlon, the SSE2 support will make up for it with multimedia and video editing apps.

 

[Adul]

There was a site that compared a dual Athlon MP, a single p4 2.53, and a dual G4 1 Ghz. They ran all sorts of multimedia apps.

 

[dexvx]

I'll have to check where i saw i860 boards for under 300, but I may be mistaken (it wasn't pricewatch).

Oh yea, if your application is SSE2 optimized, then definitely go for Xeon. Nothing beats an SSE2 optimized Xeon, and nothing touches a truly SSE2 optiimized Xeon (well now anyways).